What to do with teenagers?

Soldato
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The thing with national service is that it would just be a burden on the armed forces. The military doesn't want to put it's resources into babysitting a bunch of kids when the vast majority of them are going to be completely useless to them at the end of it.

And on a personal note, I would hate doing national service. It would probably be the worst time of my life. Having the option to do charity work instead would be ok with me. I think that's a good idea.
 
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Really?

I was quite a nice 15 year old and don't really fancy doing National Service with a bunch of low lifes because you say so. I would get eaten.

So is everyone else your age a low life, like EVERYONE? whos going to eat you? Im fairly sure you would see said low lifes etc get an ***whooping until they started being pleasant, to make up for all those years that mummy and daddy didnt bother spanking their bums.

Manic, great post, great points, but would it really have seriously hindered you to have done a year national service in between all that learning, It could have been used as a placement year and you could have gone into something extremely relevent.

School college and uni all failed me, my lecturers are Uni have told me I really was failed badly at school and college, My academic work ethics are appauling, and I was pushed and pushed and pushed into staying on an academic route, my talents do not serve me well being an academic, Im more hands on. I read around a lot yea, Im on these forums and pretty active in GD, and we have a lot of computing stuff here funny enough dont we :)

Iv had a few fights, well maybe quite a few.. mostly since I left school, I dont go out my way to start them, but as a northern male who likes to go on the town with his mates and have some fun its bound to occur now and then, a lot of it is upbringing and biology, alpha etc :p
Even national service wont stop the fights, its just part of being human.
a lot of people seem to have distorted views on this, a year is not really anything major, we're talking pre 20s here mostly, its no different to the government deciding everyone stays in education till they are 17. Its not going to hinder anyone, its going to sort out the bad eggs, the ones wanting to learn can embrace it and learn lots of valuable skills and treat it like academic institution.
My sister, Naval Admin Role : Doing degree of some sort, absolute PLEB, somehow they taught her various skills, school or college didnt, she miserably failed college, neither managed to diagnose her acute dyslexia, the Navy found it pretty quick(better staff?)
Brother : Doing engineering degree, now moving onto Nuclear topics due to his Nuclear Sub draft.
Best friend : Some sort of air traffic/comms in RAF, doing engineering degree at OU with help from RAF in spare time/while on standby at work.

Forces actively encourages further learning, doesnt remotely hinder, lots of people seem to think its going to be a year wasted in their lives of complete hell... its just like school?!?!

Manic, one point though, 'change your life, move house thus moving school'
That kind of ruined your post, you expect a family to uproot and move to a better school? You do know that house prices rise if house falls in catchment area of better school, where are you from? Have you been to any worse off places in the UK? Do you think everyone has the financial capabilities to move to better schools? The better schools are now effectively private schools, because house prices are so much higher meaning only the rich can afford. For record though, I went to one of the town's better schools, and a better college, still though, theres a massive difference in standards between wealthy areas and poorer areas.
If you cant acknowledge this point and admit what you are saying is snobbery then you are very ignorant, and I would say you would also seriously benefit from national service, to bring you back down to earth and make you open your eyes to the world around you.
Im basing above on assumptions made from the fact you suggest moving house for better schools as a feasable option for people.
 
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Pay each chav £5 to go and petrol bomb the offices and houses of the Children's Commissioner for England and groups including civil liberties group Liberty...

Then switch the high pitched device for something more useful, like a taser
 
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There used to be one of these speaker systems near the shops at school where we used to go for dinner, it did help get rid of a lot of the problems around the area, but it was also really annoying for a, respectful, law-abiding 16 year old like myself.

As for National Service, I would be all for bringing it into place for people who are not in full time education or employment for anything longer than 18-months (Unless they have a genuine excuse such as medical issues obviously)
 
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Exactly, what have i done wrong?

what have you done wrong? I dont know, but why are you forced into school? Is that a punishment too? Why do we get forced to pay taxes? are we being punished? Read through some of mine and Ulf's posts, you will get some points from the other side of story, national service isnt a punishment, its hardly got PRISON in its name has it. It might even help sort out a bit of the overweight and obesity problem come to think of it.
 
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everything,

seriously though its about making teenagers learn that we all live in the same country and they can't just do whatever they want, also its about building bonds with other people.

I resoect almost every person i ever meet, and i can socilise and get on and build bonds with almost anyone.

Maybe if you get less than X GCSE's should you be forced into it, might start making kids of my age value their education a bit more.

EDIT: I see your point peetee, but what if someone life me, predicted all C-A*s at GCSE and looking forward to college was suddenly told, "Sorry mate, youve got to do national service and learn a trade." Id be pretty miffed tbh.
 
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Soldato
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There used to be one of these speaker systems near the shops at school where we used to go for dinner, it did help get rid of a lot of the problems around the area, but it was also really annoying for a, respectful, law-abiding 16 year old like myself.

As for National Service, I would be all for bringing it into place for people who are not in full time education or employment for anything longer than 18-months (Unless they have a genuine excuse such as medical issues obviously)

Its quite easy for chavs to go to local colleges and do pointless quals and claim EMA, or get a mickey mouse job going doing something fairly pointless, it doesnt stop them from harassing people and mugging your gran on a night though.
There should be an option to use it as a placement year or something if studying at uni or something, to apply knowledge in relevant field etc, and obviously there can be exceptions but these should be put before a panel that decides on each individual case, meaning the massive majority do do it.
If people are worried about working with 'low life scum' do something clever, then you wont work with plebs, you branch out in the forces, ie. specialise in something a chav cannot do, they will all decide they want to play with guns anyway. Forces life would sort there heads out within a few months.

I resoect almost every person i ever meet, and i can socilise and get on and build bonds with almost anyone.

Maybe if you get less than X GCSE's should you be forced into it, might start making kids of my age value their education a bit more.

yea, and it would mean all the kids in deprived areas are much more likely to have to get their hands dirty instead of the richer folk, oh, thats SO fair.

Few people need to think out of the box, obviously your brilliant educations have not really opened your eyes up to the world around you yet
 
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aybe if you get less than X GCSE's should you be forced into it,

Just because if someone is stupid doesn't mean they're a trouble maker. A bloke at school failed every course, but a quiet person.

seriously though its about making teenagers learn that we all live in the same country and they can't just do whatever they want, also its about building bonds with other people.

If you agree that people should be forced into doing things they don't want, then I'll suggest the goverment brings out legislation that everyone has to ride to work for 1 year on a pushbike, then another 1 year before (and must proove it, with x milage per bike) even being allowed to own a car. After all I notice idiot car/van drivers so by doing this it'll improve everyone else's driving/being aware of bikers.
 
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Just because if someone is stupid doesn't mean they're a trouble maker. A bloke at school failed every course, but a quiet person.



If you agree that people should be forced into doing things they don't want, then I'll suggest the goverment brings out legislation that everyone has to ride to work for 1 year on a pushbike, then another 1 year before (and must proove it, with x milage per bike) even being allowed to own a car. After all I notice idiot car/van drivers so by doing this it'll improve everyone else's driving/being aware of bikers.

we all have to do things we don't want to do, its part of life. making everybody do it means there no divide between people, their in the same thing together, there isn't then a group with a chip on their shoulder because they had to do national service when someone else didn't.

there is also the the fact that it can give someone usable skills and a good work ethic. there is bad points to national service but i think it would help solve a lot of the social problem we've got.
 
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Just because if someone is stupid doesn't mean they're a trouble maker. A bloke at school failed every course, but a quiet person.



If you agree that people should be forced into doing things they don't want, then I'll suggest the goverment brings out legislation that everyone has to ride to work for 1 year on a pushbike, then another 1 year before (and must proove it, with x milage per bike) even being allowed to own a car. After all I notice idiot car/van drivers so by doing this it'll improve everyone else's driving/being aware of bikers.

1st point is good, just because someone isnt academically capable doesnt mean they are stupid, a lot of experts in their fields and extremely talented people only excel in a minority of things, good example would be athletes and sports personel, a lot are incredibly thick, but extremely able.

Second point, well, its just crap tbh, use your head. We already get forced into doing things you dont want to, you are forced into getting a driving license before you can legally drive. Like iv said repeatedly already but no one seems to take note of, we are forced to go through education till we are 16, why exactly? What is the point? Why should we? I dont see any of you whinging that you have to go to school, but you whinge about national service, its the same thing, being forced into an institution you dont 'believe' in etc. Most of it is just plain ignorance, I was forced into school and didnt like it, but I learned valuable skills and it helped me grow etc, everyone needs a basic level of education, but now youngsters also need discipline an other skills because society has changed, and it is failing a lot of youngsters.
School does not serve everyone well, it can obviously hinder the minority, as it draws them away from what they are good at, I accept national service will do the same, but if you're using these arguements against National Service then you should be campaigning to make going to school a choice.
 
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we all have to do things we don't want to do, its part of life. making everybody do it means there no divide between people, their in the same thing together, there isn't then a group with a chip on their shoulder because they had to do national service when someone else didn't.

there is also the the fact that it can give someone usable skills and a good work ethic. there is bad points to national service but i think it would help solve a lot of the social problem we've got.

I agree imagine the divide would pretty much go between the 3 classes when we all shared the same experiences. And overall i think it would bring back what made the uk so great once upon a time.
 
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hmm think Vasquez did a better post than me :)

Think this would probably be better in the Speaker's Corner, the 'Against' lot are putting up a pretty poor fight today like.
 
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hmm think Vasquez did a better post than me :)

Think this would probably be better in the Speaker's Corner, the 'Against' lot are putting up a pretty poor fight today like.


With re: to the moving point in my post, I did say "if that isn't possible" as I'm fully aware of how difficult it is to move at the moment. But the amount of parents who seem to blame their local school for their own childrens behavioural problems is staggering! Bad school or not, home life can instill the self discipline and indeed self worth that so many kids seem to now lack.

Imagine being a teenager right now, not 10 years ago (as i nearly was ARGHH) but right now.

You go to a school where being the bad kid is cool. As we all know, respect from your peers at that age is paramount for most. You are then told by seemingly knowledgeable people that you MUST do A-Levels and go to a top university or you might as well not bother living (thats the top and bottom of it in a lot of places.) OR if your a bit "special" you could (they suppose, with a sigh) do something vocational, but really they would much prefer you went to uni.

So you force yourself through GCSE's, 8 out of 10 of which you find deathly boring. You then kill yourself for 2 years doing A-Levels, most of which you may not be interested in (and honestly A-Levels really are the most stressful 2 years I have ever been through...) while at every single point being told "remember this next decision will shape your life blah blah."

You then find that you didnt ace your A-Levels but did ok, but you dont really want to go to uni, but if you dont then its McDonalds for you, right? So ok, you panic choose Business Studies at some middle university.

For a few months all seems ok, its all about partying etc, you spend your loan, enjoy the freedom of it all. But then you realise your bored out of your skull, so you don't apply to the course and start failing. Maybe get called up for plagerism, your debts start to rise, your overdraft always maxed out. Everyone else seems to be having a fantastic time of it?? Why arn't you?

Etc etc, I don't want to go on as its a long story as it is :) (and probably very badly written)

What im trying to say is that although we demonise the bad teenagers in our society, its also a very difficult time for most of them. A lot will simply be rebelling against a system they feel they can't escape from, while others will be repeating what they have seen their parents doing.

Is the answer to all this turmoil simply to ship absolutely every single person in the country off to the army for a year when they reach 18? Im absolutely 100% positive it is not.

Now should perhaps repeat young offenders be forced to attend the military, as somebody with a cousin now in prison because the system was so damned soft on him as a young offender, then yes maybe they should.
 
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Soldato
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Shouldn't you have done something you enjoyed rather then dragging your self through?

Also Uni isn't "all" about partying and spending your loan on beer/drugs. That's probably why you didn't do very well.

I actually wasn't the focus of that little diatribe :) However I knew people EXACTLY like that.

As it stood, I did very well bar my A-Levels for reasons i'm actually yet to totally fathom.

Done very well in my Uni degrees and I love what I do, have done from day one.

Being a scientist is what I have always wanted to do, so I really don't apply to the above story, im re-iterating friends experiences as an example really.

Sorry I probably should have made that clear before I started to spout off :)
 
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I actually wasn't the focus of that little diatribe :) However I knew people EXACTLY like that.

As it stood, I did very well bar my A-Levels for reasons i'm actually yet to totally fathom.

Done very well in my Uni degrees and I love what I do, have done from day one.

Being a scientist is what I have always wanted to do, so I really don't apply to the above story, im re-iterating friends experiences as an example really.

Sorry I probably should have made that clear before I started to spout off :)

Ah ok, thought it was a story about you.
 
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