Midweek Football Thread

Caporegime
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Another thing, he's also extremely poor in the transfer market. His success rate is dwarfed by mediocrity and only god knows what his definition of "quality" is. The amount of millions he's spent on players in our team that wouldn't make it into many mid-table teams is alarming. He says he hasn't been supported financially, and that may be, however you look at other, mid table managers and see what they get out of there teams with what little they have and its evidently clear that he isn't one of the "greats" that we all want him to be.

That's a great point. How many world class players has Rafa brought in in the past 4 or 5 transfer windows? Compare that number to how many mediocre players he's brought in, then look at teams like Everton, Fulham and co. I don't think he should be sacked. He needs much more time and just because Liverpool are on a bad run doesn't mean they're a bad side. For the fans to want him out, well, hardly can call themselves a fan if they don't back the manager after a few losses.
 
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The liverpool fans that I know, and thats quite a few, hold on to the result last year in the league and the time they won the champions league.

I really think that if they do go out in the group stages this time those blind/loyal/call it what you will fans will start to see the situation for what it is.

Liverpool punched well over their weight last season as well as the other top 4 teams having slow starts, injury problems and manager problems, there is no way they will do that again.
 
Caporegime
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Not agreeing with DM but with the exception of the golf club incident (and I guess that's a big exception), Bellamy's attitude was fine with us and Rafa was fairly happy with him (he was only sold as he was one of a few players we could get a decent fee for, to fund the deal for Torres). He didn't set the world alight (far from it in fact) but he gave us another option that would have been handy right now.

Bellamy is scum though :(

The golf club incident, well I don't really know much about it, a drunken night out where half the club was leathered and he got angry with Risse over nothing and smacked him with a club, but I don't know if he went hell for leather or pretended to smack him, crushed his skull or it was a joke gone to far.

I always thought he was a git, but to be honest he's a mouthy git on the pitch and I've seen little else he's done wrong. Got on the wrong side of a stupid Souness who despite Bellamy scoring quite a lot was constantly dropped pretty much purely because Souness didn't like him. Other than a hunger to play first team, and giving 100% in every match I've ever seen him play, whats he actually done wrong or worse than anyone else.

Yes theres something very irksome about a no neck welshman getting mouthy over every single thing in a match, but doesn't that also show the level of his passion for football.

As for not performing at Liverpool, how many decent players go to football and seem to be underused, underperform and not fit in. Maybe its not all those players fault, but a manager who couldn't get the best out of them?

Theres also something fairly key, unless you have to selling your best players to fund other possibly great players is a huge risk that rarely pays off as you want. Why wasn't he selling the worst players and buying in cheaper, riskier prospects as most succesful managers do.

Had Ronaldo wanted to stay Fergie wouldnt' have sold him just to buy Villa, he'd look to offload the junk, Djemba Djemba, Kleberson, and buy other midpriced players and hope they are good, and several cheap youngsters who might turn into great players, and some fringe players he hopes to get great value out of. Wenger does the same, even Barca appear to have suffered from the same type of "lateral move" by selling Eto'o to get Ibra and now sitting 3rd in the group stage and not seemingly anywhere near as fluent or freescoring as they were before.

Yes Torres turned out to be great, but what if he does turn into a constantly injured player, or what if he had been completely average and they overspent and sold several players just to get him. Even with Torres getting lots of goals, is it worth selling 5 decent players to fund a player like Torres, but also have a squad incapable of maintaining a challenge in all competitions and incredibly shallow with a few injuries drastically changing the usefulness of the team.

Right now would Torres be best, or 10 3million pound players and a few free transfer of which 5 turned into very good first team players capable between them of outscoring Torres?

Do you really expect Voronin to play well when the manager couldn't be more clear about his lack of belief in the player?


Last point for the night, Fabregas 19 starts since the start of the season in all comps, 11 goals, 14 assists........... best in form player in the world right now, by a margin.

Drogba's an incredibly close second, 11 starts 9 goals, 5 assists in the league alone is might impressive, and overall 20 starts, 19 goals and 5 assists is pretty incredible. What a difference it makes when he actually fights to stay up(at least more often than he used to by a quite significant amount).
 
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Soldato
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As an outsider looking in, he does seem to have charmed the Liverpool fans to the point of obssession. Benitez must think it's Xmas every day to see some of the crap that is going on in the Anfield corridors of power, because one thing is sure it is covering up for a lot of his short comings.

Two trophies (won on penalties. A Champions League winning squad, largely inherited from Houllier) is not a fantastic return for his supposed midas touch and genius. Despite what Liverpool fans say about there being no money available he has had the money to strengthen but you can put a very very big question mark over his dealings in the transfer market and team selection.

So thats a **** load of money that Liverpool fans think they have never had. Surely with that money he could have bought better quality.

As you have said, be careful what you wish for. If the owners do go you could end up being left with Rafa and an even bigger transfer kitty to squander on sub standard players not fit for the Liverpool Jersey. Who would he have to blame then ?

I have differing views on a few players that you've listed, but otherwise agree with what you say. Yes, the owners are poor. Yes, I would love them to be gone from the club. But that doesn't mean that Benitez is doing well or that he should be fired. All of the players at the club are his, and they are poor. He has had money to spend from the owners, both old and new. Poor owners shouldn't lead to us overlooking Benitez's failings, of which there are an awful lot.
 
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Rough result.

Bad times at the moment for us. I suspect the season itself is going to be a bad one comparatively speaking.

Like Baz, I agree that we should judge Benitez at the end of this season rather than part way through. At the moment the season is bleak and our lack of strength and depth within the squad has truly shone through this year.

I would definitely like to see the "owners" go, I've never liked them from day on. Would much prefer Robert Kraft as the owner but thats just me.

I'm not overly keen on managerial changes during a season, prefer to wait for the end of the season. Having said that, even if Benitez did go, I'm really not entirely sure who we would be able to get as a replacement.
 
Soldato
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All I keep hearing from Rafa is he's not worried about his job. Sorry mate, 1 win in 8 games says otherwise, a bit of anxiety might bring the man to his senses.

If I were him I wouldn't be trusting my next game to players like Veronin who have consistently shown they're not up to it. It's not a time to be clever, it's a time for results. We really miss players Sami.
 
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He isn't worried because Liverpool cannot afford to sack him.

If I were him I would be seriously thinking about bringing a few guys in on loan or trying to scrape the money together to get a couple more decent players in Jan and aim at a top 4 spot in the league.
 
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I never saw Crouch as a failure but I also think he should never have been played as a lone striker. To me he was best suited to being behind someone like Torres so he could hold the ball up and then distribute it.

I lost faith with Benitez around February last year and constantly get annoyed with this decisions, etc but will hold out and see what happens over the next few month.

The greedy idiot Parry should never have sold to the Americans and only did because they offered a bit more money than the Arabs. My worry is if Benitez was sacked tomorrow who would we get to take his place? I don't see Maureen leaving Inter any time soon.
 
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Reports coming in that Rangers fans arrived late at the stadium and where shown to an area of seating which had a large flag draped over the seats. Rangers fans where asked to remove the flag to let other supporters use the seats but they refused and as stewards began to remove said flag the flag owners became irate and the fighting broke out.
 
Soldato
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I never saw Crouch as a failure but I also think he should never have been played as a lone striker. To me he was best suited to being behind someone like Torres so he could hold the ball up and then distribute it.

I lost faith with Benitez around February last year and constantly get annoyed with this decisions, etc but will hold out and see what happens over the next few month.

The greedy idiot Parry should never have sold to the Americans and only did because they offered a bit more money than the Arabs. My worry is if Benitez was sacked tomorrow who would we get to take his place? I don't see Maureen leaving Inter any time soon.

Koeman?
 
Caporegime
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Rafas face in the post match interview was brilliant. A face like a man who has waited on a table of 10 all night and not been left a tip.

Thats just for the cameras though, inside he will be laughing. I cannot believe they gave this guy another contract that will take around 20 million to get rid of him. Realistically they will pay up less but still he knows he's untouchable for a while yet.

I expect Liverpool to get out the group and go on to win the cup, like the last time they won it by barely being any good in the group stages and relying on results of others ;)

I love watching torres, I'm actually sad this year the side he has around him. He should see who they replace Rafa with and what money comes along to strengthen the side and make a choice about moving on otherwise he's going to flush away his career being a two part team with Gerrard and he's far too good to watch to have that waste of career :(
 
Soldato
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Reports coming in that Rangers fans arrived late at the stadium and where shown to an area of seating which had a large flag draped over the seats. Rangers fans where asked to remove the flag to let other supporters use the seats but they refused and as stewards began to remove said flag the flag owners became irate and the fighting broke out.

Actually the buses turned up late and hence were late to arrive. Police refused fans entry into stadium. Fans beaten and sprayed with cs gas outside the stadium while trying to get in.
 
Soldato
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Just looked at the Sun Dream Team player ratings for the Liverpool match last night.

Babel was star man with 8/10 and Mascherano got 6/10 despite, to me, being motm.

Very strange.
 
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