Macro Work - Flash Required

[martinturner]

I have decided to delve a little deeper into macro photography; thus far I have only shot the occasional flower, insect and some other crazy experimental stuff. Whilst I have got pretty good results I have always been reliant on natural light.

I own a Nikon D90, Sigma 105mm and have just bought a Raynox MSN-202 to get 'very' close 2:1ish (I think). Given the fact I am getting much closer I think its a necessity to be using a flash. This is an area I have not got a clue about. I want to keep the price down as for me; other than the occasional portrait the main purpose will be for macro work. I am going to also get a bracket so it can be attached off the shoe (is that what its called), by way of a wire. I am thinking of diffusing with a Lumiquest Mini Soft Box.

So questions ...
1. My camera limits me to 1/200 of a second for using the flash. Is this just for the onboard or a limitation regardless of which flash is used?
2. I was looking at a SB400/SB600 any reason why I should go for one over the other?
3. Does both the SB400/SB600 come with one of those wires that allow you to use it off camera by way of a bracket.
4. I am considering buying one of those off-camera multi flash kits at a later date so I can use a couple of flashes for further macro stuff. Given you can use much cheaper flashes and fire them wirelessly, could I just get a kit and a cheapish flash thats compatible and it will do the job?
5. Are there any alternative flashes other than the Nikon ones which I should consider.
6. If shooting insects or water drops; what do I need to know about when I should fire the flash? Any advice on this welcomed. I did have a look online but most stuff was all geared towards portraits and I was hoping not to have to spend hours reading up on it. Perhaps I should?

Thanks all

 

[lsg1r]

Personally for macro I'd be looking at a ring flash that sits on or near the end of the lens.

Flash limit - iirc some higher nikon allow faster but don't quote me.

 

[martinturner]

I considered ringflash, but its very expensive! Marimu offer a cheap alternative (~£110), but I cannot use that due to restriction of Raynox clip on lens blocking the attachment.

Basically, I have seen some pretty impressive shots by someone who has used a Canon 450D, 100mm Macro and a Raynox lens clipped on and I would like to do the same. The Marimu has cost me £50 and they hold their value so even if its rubbish, I will just offload and would have lost a tenner or so. Worth a punt.

 

[Namistai]

I can't answer all of your questions, but I can say that I believe the reason for the minimum sync speed is to ensure even light across the image. with fast shutter speeds, I think it's possible that you'll have a dark part of the image (the bottom?) due to the shutter motion. Perhaps someone with a better knowledge can clarify.

 

[Raikiri]

I personally use a single diffused flash gun, it works quite well. You can get ringflash adapters (£25-£150 and varying greatly in quality) that fit onto a normal flash if you wanted.

 

[Gnomey]

The sync speed is a limitation of the shutter. There is a high speed sync mode on the SB600 which will allow you to use any shutter speed, the SB400 doesn't have this mode. However for macro 1/200 will be fine. I would go for the SB600, the SB400 has no manual controls, swivel and low power. They don't come with the off shoe cord.

For shooting water drops and insects use manual with 1/200, ISO 100 and f/11. Change the flash exposure compensation or power output to correct the exposure. The flash duration will effectively become the exposure time which will be fast enough to freeze a water drop or any movement from insects.

The camera will fire the flash, but I guess you could try pressing the test button and shutter button at the same time and hope to get lucky .

The Lumiquest diffuser is a good choice if you don't want to bother making one.

I can't answer all of your questions, but I can say that I believe the reason for the minimum sync speed is to ensure even light across the image. with fast shutter speeds, I think it's possible that you'll have a dark part of the image (the bottom?) due to the shutter motion. Perhaps someone with a better knowledge can clarify.

That is correct, below the camera's max sync speed the flash is fired when the shutter is completely open and exposes the whole frame. At higher shutter speeds the first and second shutter curtains travel at the same time with a small gap inbetween which exposes a part of the frame at a time. The flash fires one burst of light for a short duration and the dark line is the part of the frame which was not exposed to the flash.

Some flashes support a high speed sync mode which will fire several bursts for the complete duration of the exposure so that the whole frame is exposed to light from the flash and can be used at any shutter speed.

 

[john_s]

I can't answer all of your questions, but I can say that I believe the reason for the minimum sync speed is to ensure even light across the image. with fast shutter speeds, I think it's possible that you'll have a dark part of the image (the bottom?) due to the shutter motion. Perhaps someone with a better knowledge can clarify.

Pretty much. The sync speed is the shortest period that the whole of the sensor is completely exposed to the lens image at once. As shutter speeds go higher, the opening and/or closing shutters are travelling across the sensor at the same time - ie giving a stripe of exposure that travels across the sensor. If the flash fires while the shutter is moving, one or both of the shutters shades the sensor, giving you a dark band.

Canon cameras will do high speed sync if you have a Canon flash on the camera (or on the curly off-shoe cord); I presume Nikon will have something similar. Basically, it pulses the flash *very* quickly, but at lower power, so the flash is effectively a continuous light source while the shutter is open.

The sync speed for my 5D is 1/200; I've used high speed sync at 1/2000. I understand it works right down to 1/8000, but I've not tried it at that myself.

 

[martinturner]

Very useful responses guys, thank you!

I think I am leaning towards the SB600. I will sit tight for a week or so as it would be interesting to hear from famas in particular and equally anyone else who can advise with their experience and also with regard to the other questions.

Thanks again though, much appreciated. Clearly explained too, not very often I understand the techie garb first time round

 

[DJ_Switch]

So questions ...
1. My camera limits me to 1/200 of a second for using the flash. Is this just for the onboard or a limitation regardless of which flash is used?

I believe others have already covered the reasons why, however, should you wish to the d90 will allow you to go faster than 1/200 should you ever wish to. John mentioned the flash pulsing to create a more continuous light source...the sb600 also does this.

3. Does both the SB400/SB600 come with one of those wires that allow you to use it off camera by way of a bracket.

My sb600 didn't although it works wireless so the lack of a wire isn't a problem.

 

[Snapshot]

You don't need a faster shutter speed than 1/200th as the duration of the flash is much shorter than that. The shutter speed controls the amount of ambient light that's recorded and, compared with the flash, it's normally too small to worry about unless you're shooting in very bright conditions.

I think the SB-400 is a great close-up flash as it has all the power that's needed and is light weight but, very unfortunately, only one can be used with connecting cables as its standby function can't be switched off.

If you buy an SB-600 you don't need a connecting cord as the on-board flash can control it.

 

[famas]

I use a d90 and sb-600, you can use them in commander mode so no need for a sync cable, it works extreamly well, its never failed me.
As others have said 1/200th is fine unless your in very bright light. you can us FP to sync the sb-600 to higher speeds than 1/200th but every time i've tried the picture is always very under exposed, i think this is because when in FP mode the flashes power is greatly reduced. the only way around this i have found is to move the flash very close to the subject. I maybe wrong about this so wait to be corrected.
im not sure if the sb-400 has FP mode?

a big advantage of the 400 over the 600 is its size, its lighter and more compact which is a good thing when using it with a flash bracket, Although it does not have as much movment in the flash head as the 600 which can tilt 90 degres and spin 180 degrees this is very handy. As long as you have a sturdy bracket the sb-600 will be fine and the addest features and well worth the extra cost.

personally i think the 600 is an amazing flash, i also read somewere that it has the fastest recharge time of all nikon flashes, tho this might be rumour, but its still pretty quick.

one thing about ring flashes, because the light from them is direct it can some times make objects look a bit flat, it can take away the depth of the subject which isn't always welcome when shooting insects ect. having the flash above gives a more natural lighting effect.

 

[Tomsk]

Have you considered an LED ring light?
Hama do one for £70.

 

[BUFF]

imo LED ring lights don't tend to be as good as proper ring flashes.

 

[D.P.]

SB-600 is much more useful than a SB-400

Full pan-tilt head, remote command

 

[martinturner]

Thanks for all the advice everyone. Now given how much it costs I am going to have to wait 4/5 months before I can make such a purchase.

With that being the case, I was thinking I could afford something a bit cheaper if there was something available. Perhaps not quite as good as say the Nikon, but will at least get me up and running. So ...

£50
Sigma EF-500 ST Electronic Flash for Nikon AF SLR
New, boxed Sigma EF-500 ST TTL electronic flash dedicated for use with Nikon autofocus SLR cameras.
Guide number 50 (ISO 100/m)
Recycling time 4-6 seconds
Number of flashes 100-220 aprox
Bounce up 60, 75, 90 degrees down 7 degrees
Swivel right 60, 75, 90 degrees left 60, 75 , 90, 120, 150, 180 degrees
Built-in wide panel
Complete with case
Uses 4 AA batteries (not supplied)

£80
Jessops 360AFD Digital Flashgun for Nikon
Guide number 36m/ISO 100
Bounce and swivel adjustment
Built in diffuser and reflector
Backlit LCD display
Autofocus assist light
Auto/manual Powerzoom settings
24/28/35/50/70/85mm Head Settings
5 Level power ratio : 1/1, 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, 1/16
Trigger Voltage : 6V
Requires 4 x AA batteries

I am contemplating the latter. What are the differences with that versus a SB400/600 for example?

What are your thoughts?

 

[Raikiri]

Strangely enough I have both of those (well, the DG ST Sigma but much the same).

Sigma is more powerful and made slightly better but the Jessops offers a greater range of control. Both work well with E-TTL and probably would with the Nikon equivilent.

 

[famas]

Also have a look at the Nissin Di622, it can be had for under £100
i have one, its a pretty good flash, full pan tilt head and has a built in deflector, can also be used wirelessly with the D90 command mode.
its pretty well made, not as good as the nikon but by no means bad.

only down side for me is the long recharge time from a full flash, at lesser poweres it keeps up with the nikon happily.

 

[martinturner]

Cheers guys. After a little more research and a good old look over at talkphotography forums; I keep hearing good things about ... (Yongnuo) YN-465 TTL Flash Speedlite.

Has anyone here used them? Any good, and most importantly, how would they compare to the Jessops and Sigma flashes I listed above?

Much appreciated

 

[Raikiri]

From what I've heard they aren't as powerful, but for £40 new it's worth a go.

 

[martinturner]

£40 new?!? I can only see them for £50 on the bay? or did you round down