Well, that's not my fault is it ?
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Why do people feel the need to offer bad advice on upgrades?
- Thread starter easyrider
- Start date
Well, that's not my fault is it ?
5970 for HTPC internet browsing rig not an overkill ? : D
Soldato
On i3 vs Phenom II, it's a case of pick your benchmark.
The Phenom II does very well in games that load 3 or more cores to 100%. Those games are currently few and far between. They're becoming more common though. As more and more games become fully multithreaded the i3's weaknesses will be exposed.
For right now though i3s, especially overclocked, do brilliantly in todays games. The same logic that says get a Phenom X2, try to unlock / overclock it, and maybe upgrade to a better CPU when you can afford it, could equally apply to the i3. Get an i3 overclock it and maybe upgrade to i5 750 or better if not being true quad core becomes a problem for you.
A few months ago Intel didn't have the budget progression option that i3 has given them. Credit to them - they've filled a gap in the market and they're competitive at entry level, with an upgrade path, again.
The Phenom II does very well in games that load 3 or more cores to 100%. Those games are currently few and far between. They're becoming more common though. As more and more games become fully multithreaded the i3's weaknesses will be exposed.
For right now though i3s, especially overclocked, do brilliantly in todays games. The same logic that says get a Phenom X2, try to unlock / overclock it, and maybe upgrade to a better CPU when you can afford it, could equally apply to the i3. Get an i3 overclock it and maybe upgrade to i5 750 or better if not being true quad core becomes a problem for you.
A few months ago Intel didn't have the budget progression option that i3 has given them. Credit to them - they've filled a gap in the market and they're competitive at entry level, with an upgrade path, again.
don't be crazy... i've not seen 1 person on here wanting a 5970 for a htpc.
be serious...
i've seen some people here say they game at let's say 1440x900 and they wanna upgrade to a top high-end card, many people say no point because it's an overkill.
it may be a "overkill" to start of with but if the person upgrades other parts like monitor/s ect , he'll/she'll still have top gaming performance
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that makes more sense, sure, if they say they will upgrade xyz parts in the next month-two or something, then yes, I agree. But not everyone is going to upgrade, some people are happy with their 1440x900 if you get my point.
So if the potential buyer says " I have 17" TFT But I will be upgrading to 24" next month " - fine, buy higher end GPU.
But if they want to stick with that 17 and don't want anything bigger, then there is obviously no point going for something extreme for their needs. So yes, I would say it's an overkill, just like an i7 in example for casual or low res gamer.
tbh u can't plan the time of your upgrades.. maybe one day next month you'll fancy to upgrade something, which u didn't know your gonna upgrade last month.
nobody knows tomorrow, next week, next month,next year
moods changes all the time.
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Soldato
ive run an I7 rig for a year but im now running a budget build with a 550BE (locked at 3.8Ghz) with a 5750 on a £30 motherboard, so those 3 items cost me less than a X58 mobo, for a budget build it is great and what i use it for to be honest there isn't a lot of difference day to day, its what i will building for my customers.
Saying win7 needs a quad is bull, ive got it running on my Atom and as 90% of PC games are console ports you can still have a decent dual core gaming machine.
Im liking AMD right now, they have a lot to offer, but if you were wanting a high end machine the only way to go is Intel.
I will build another I7 rig though soon as ive got the dough for for the £170 mobo i want
Saying win7 needs a quad is bull, ive got it running on my Atom and as 90% of PC games are console ports you can still have a decent dual core gaming machine.
Im liking AMD right now, they have a lot to offer, but if you were wanting a high end machine the only way to go is Intel.
I will build another I7 rig though soon as ive got the dough for for the £170 mobo i want
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Seriously, do people on here give that bad advice, on the most part I dont think so.
IMO, all advise comes down to :- budget/system lifespan/individual needs.
We all admit that currently the fastest CPU available out there is the I7 range, but tbh, the majority of people on here will unlikely utilise its full potential, until it is out of date.
Any I5/most Phenoms are more than competant at holding up their own with respect to gaming, and without a never ending budget, would be better placed getting one of these for a gaming rig. The cash saved from an I7 would get you a better Graphics card.
I do agree, that some peoples opinions on here are biast, I know full well that I am totally against nvidea because of the amount of grief i've had with their cards over the years, so I steer clear of GPU discussions by norm.
Easy, given your first post, without seeing what threads you are talking about, I cant really comment. I can only speculate that the posts you are reading, havent been written with the best possible explanation.
For example, you mention the thought that people are "selling" OP's the idea, that if they buy a £70 chip, it will unlock to a quad core.
More likely is that the OP is on a restricted budget, hence they are recommended a £70 chip, which would more than meet their needs within budget, with the chance of it unlocking to a full quad core. As such, opting for a cheaper chip saves kudos for other components, which may offer the OP a more enriched experience, depending on their needs.
At the end of the day, without any of us actually knowing the OP, we cannot in true honesty advise on the best system for them in the first place.
As such, should this be the end of discussions/advice?
IMO, all advise comes down to :- budget/system lifespan/individual needs.
We all admit that currently the fastest CPU available out there is the I7 range, but tbh, the majority of people on here will unlikely utilise its full potential, until it is out of date.
Any I5/most Phenoms are more than competant at holding up their own with respect to gaming, and without a never ending budget, would be better placed getting one of these for a gaming rig. The cash saved from an I7 would get you a better Graphics card.
I do agree, that some peoples opinions on here are biast, I know full well that I am totally against nvidea because of the amount of grief i've had with their cards over the years, so I steer clear of GPU discussions by norm.
Easy, given your first post, without seeing what threads you are talking about, I cant really comment. I can only speculate that the posts you are reading, havent been written with the best possible explanation.
For example, you mention the thought that people are "selling" OP's the idea, that if they buy a £70 chip, it will unlock to a quad core.
More likely is that the OP is on a restricted budget, hence they are recommended a £70 chip, which would more than meet their needs within budget, with the chance of it unlocking to a full quad core. As such, opting for a cheaper chip saves kudos for other components, which may offer the OP a more enriched experience, depending on their needs.
At the end of the day, without any of us actually knowing the OP, we cannot in true honesty advise on the best system for them in the first place.
As such, should this be the end of discussions/advice?
Wait a sec, why are we recommending i3 for HTPC builds?
"Clarkdale: The Perfect Home Theater PC
AMD was first to achieve it - the Radeon HD 5000 series support Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD-MA bitstreaming over HDMI. With Clarkdale, Intel is the first to achieve the same with integrated graphics.
If you have a Clarkdale CPU and a H55, H57 or Q57 motherboard, you can bitstream Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD-MA over HDMI. Outputting 8-channel LPCM over HDMI is also supported.
I’ve tested it and it just works. Using an Intel supplied build of PowerDVD 9 I had no problems bitstreaming either codec from a variety of BDs.
The PowerDVD Media Center interface for Windows 7 is much improved over the last time I used it. You can even select to bitstream the high definition audio codecs from within the interface.
Clarkdale is just perfect for an HTPC. You get the benefits of integrated graphics without sacrificing any features at all. It’s taken entirely too long but we now have the ability to have the same functionality from a PC as we get from a set-top Blu-ray player. Err, hooray?"
The fact you know very liitle about PC hardware?
Grow up.
Have an argument in return or **** ***
Wouldn't worry about it.
PhoenixUK claims to know people here better than they know themselves.
Soldato
I'd never recommend the unlock option, maybe it's just me but getting my 5000 x2 to a quad and stable took ages 
T'was worth it though
T'was worth it though
I'm not just talking about gaming.When will people realise some OCUK are not students sitting around all day playing games. Some us make money with our PC's video editing, sound recording etc...
Bias and FUD
Its all over these forums...especially in CPU's....These people seem intent on bringing the CPU forum into the realms of the whimsical just like GFX.
No not really..he had the money for better and yet he was told to by mediocre hardware because of the badge.
Advice is good and helpful when its based on the notion of truth.
Not based on the notion of romance and the odd affinity with a tech company who don't care about anything other than profit.
Generally speaking this may be true (i'm not 100%). However i stumbled across this the other day:
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/&menu=browser&image_id=1251642&article_id=705532&page=1&show=original
So i think for you to say games really 'need' a quad right now is a bit of a sweeping genralisation. I think you're right about that thread though, i wouldn't spec anyone a dual + unlock extra cores as it isn't a gurantee. If you're going to do that you should go into it just wanting/needing a dual and take anything extra as a bonus. However if you had the funds for a quad in the first place then its a no brainer, go for the quad.
Back to what you were saying though, i think what people actually need is subjective. Although with a given budget you'll want the best possible of course.
Soldato
Easy whens the last time you used an AMD CPU?
An Opteron 170 dual core overclocked to 2.8ghz..very nice chip.
I had a Barton before that.
I also had a few Opty 146's
Of course conroe came and changed it all.
I had a P4 briefly but the Opty was a far superior CPU
I'm looking forward to an AMD rig again when they have something worth buying over INTEL offerings at the same price point.
Thing is I use an abuse PC hardware regardless of who makes what...Its a nice place to be in all honesty. Not to be shackled by the nonsens of brand loyalty.I'm free to choose without feeling guilty that I ma letting a comapny down in some bizarre way
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[QUOTE='Pro' PC Builder... or Dell] Your ingame FPS is low? Dont upgrade your graphics card, you need to upgrade your RAM! [/QUOTE]
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@easyrider
Surely;
budget-->best for money-->buy PC
is the wrong way to do things? This benefits the company, not the consumer. The more logical way to decide what to buy would be;
use for PC --> power needed --> best value for that power --> buy PC
The first method will result in people spending more and getting a PC that has extra power they don't use. The second method will result in exactly the same user experience but with cash left in the users pocket to spend on other things.
This is very similar to the way my sister recently bought a car. She had a £10000 budget and spent all of it on a car. Personally, I think it would have been far more sensible to decide what was needed from the car (back and forth for an hour or so each weekday) and buy the cheapest car (that is reliable and safe) that can be found. The idea that everyone needs the very best that they can afford is promoted by the industry for their own profit, and as someone with no interest in cars my sister would have been much better off spending £2500 on the car and saving the rest for insurance and petrol (things that she really does need) or shoes and shopping trips (things she enjoys).
If you enjoy building and upgrading PCs, or benchmarking them, by all means spend loads of money on hardware. If someone comes looking for advice on what hardware they need to do a specific task and you send them away to buy something because "it's the best" rather than "it's good enough for what you want to do", and in the process cause them to spend more money than they needed to, that is not good advice.
Yslen
Surely;
budget-->best for money-->buy PC
is the wrong way to do things? This benefits the company, not the consumer. The more logical way to decide what to buy would be;
use for PC --> power needed --> best value for that power --> buy PC
The first method will result in people spending more and getting a PC that has extra power they don't use. The second method will result in exactly the same user experience but with cash left in the users pocket to spend on other things.
This is very similar to the way my sister recently bought a car. She had a £10000 budget and spent all of it on a car. Personally, I think it would have been far more sensible to decide what was needed from the car (back and forth for an hour or so each weekday) and buy the cheapest car (that is reliable and safe) that can be found. The idea that everyone needs the very best that they can afford is promoted by the industry for their own profit, and as someone with no interest in cars my sister would have been much better off spending £2500 on the car and saving the rest for insurance and petrol (things that she really does need) or shoes and shopping trips (things she enjoys).
If you enjoy building and upgrading PCs, or benchmarking them, by all means spend loads of money on hardware. If someone comes looking for advice on what hardware they need to do a specific task and you send them away to buy something because "it's the best" rather than "it's good enough for what you want to do", and in the process cause them to spend more money than they needed to, that is not good advice.
Yslen
Soldato
I'd never recommend the unlock option, maybe it's just me but getting my 5000 x2 to a quad and stable took ages
T'was worth it though
By the sound of things, people that have tried unlocking some of the PII black editions have had a much easier time of it than those of us that went the X2 5000+ route.
Having said that - best bang for under £40 new CPU out there when it does unlock. At that price I'm almost tempted to buy a spare or two.