Another I've Been Scammed On Ebay Thread

Soldato
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Are you mad, he should not need to ask more than once, if I had bought a processor that had bent pins you could be sure that I would have taken and sent photos before this was even asked of me.
You seem to be forgetting it was the buyer who initially offered to send the photos. The buyer offered, albert asked (rather forcefully) for the photos and a whole raft of details about the "computer specialist", the buyer responded saying "no worries" but apparently hasn't gotten around to sending the photos yet.

Fairly reasonable so far. The obvious next step as the seller is to kindly request the photos again.

Secondly I would not have left negative feedback until the issue was resolved.
It seems albert gave the buyer the impression he wasn't going to take any steps to resolve the issue (assuming there is in fact an issue), so the buyer figured that was that and left negative feedback.

The buyer may well have been a scammer, but I don't there's any solid proof of that yet...

Edit: What would be the point in a scam like this, anyway? What does the scammer have to gain?

Bearing in mind the buyer's original request was to return the item for a refund, the only potential scam I can think of is if the buyer had an identical CPU with bent pins in the first instance that he would attempt to pass off as the one he was sold. Then again, if he's subsequently going to claim the bent pins can be fixed for £35, why go to all the hassle of buying a used CPU and scamming the seller for the sake of £35? :confused:
 
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Soldato
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Seems about par for the course for EBay tbh. This is why I don't use them or their joke of a service called Paypal.

Then again, they had their chance with me and wazzed it up the wall.
 
Soldato
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How big was the box? Did the bubble wrap keep the CPU snugly in place in it's plastic box? How much bubble wrap did you use?
 
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Soldato
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You seem to be forgetting it was the buyer who initially offered to send the photos. The buyer offered, albert asked (rather forcefully) for the photos and a whole raft of details about the "computer specialist", the buyer responded saying "no worries" but apparently hasn't gotten around to sending the photos yet.

Fairly reasonable so far. The obvious next step as the seller is to kindly request the photos again.

It seems albert gave the buyer the impression he wasn't going to take any steps to resolve the issue (assuming there is in fact an issue), so the buyer figured that was that and left negative feedback.

The buyer may well have been a scammer, but I don't there's any solid proof of that yet...

Edit: What would be the point in a scam like this, anyway? What does the scammer have to gain?

Bearing in mind the buyer's original request was to return the item for a refund, the only potential scam I can think of is if the buyer had an identical CPU with bent pins in the first instance that he would attempt to pass off as the one he was sold. Then again, if he's subsequently going to claim the bent pins can be fixed for £35, why go to all the hassle of buying a used CPU and scamming the seller for the sake of £35? :confused:

You know when you ask for proof of damage or pictures of something and the buyer ignores this email and gives you feedback, their bluff has been called. (See post #42)

If it was a genuine damage case proof of pictures would only need to be asked once and the buyer would have responded before going to leave negative feedback. If it really was damaged, I as a buyer would open a dispute (if the seller was uncooperative or couldn't claim on the postal insurance).

Don't see how albert gave any impression that he wasn't going to take any steps to resolve the issue. Surely giving the seller proof proves the damage is genuine and gives them some proof to claim against the postal insurance.

The proof of the buyer being a scammer is in post #42 where he says if he's given £35 he'd be happy. He thought that he could blackmail the seller into giving him a huge discount and that the seller would give in.

Most average private sellers wouldn't be so sure of their packaging and might give in but the buyer wasn't expecting to be asked for proof of the damage and the name and address/phone no of the shop that would repair it for "£35".

Even I didn't think of asking the name, tel no and address of the shop and I've sold things a few times for years.

The next sentence shows how his bluff was called and he quit trying it on - He replied back that it was ok and was
He replied back that it was ok and was 'willing to take a hit'

If you really can't see what the scammer has to gain or the point of this then you need to re-read it.

In simple terms the scam is:

1) Buy product at second hand price
2) Try and scam seller into giving £10-£20
3) Naive seller gives in and gives back £x amount
4) Scammer gets their item for £price - £x saving them a few bob.



Either seller gives in due to not being sure/protecting themselves or is a wise seller and requests proof.
A genuine buyer would go ahead with proof giving to try and help seller help them solve their problem, not reply with some bs like "I'll take the hit".
 
Man of Honour
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Bearing in mind the buyer's original request was to return the item for a refund, the only potential scam I can think of is if the buyer had an identical CPU with bent pins in the first instance that he would attempt to pass off as the one he was sold. Then again, if he's subsequently going to claim the bent pins can be fixed for £35, why go to all the hassle of buying a used CPU and scamming the seller for the sake of £35? :confused:

This is actually not at all uncommon, they hope (which is often the case sadly) that the seller did not take note of relevant serial numbers, photos, etc. before selling. Friends of mine have had people try it on half a dozen times with games consoles - claim it didn't work when it turns up and return their old broken one to try and get a refund.
 
Soldato
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You know when you ask for proof of damage or pictures of something and the buyer ignores this email and gives you feedback, their bluff has been called. (See post #42)

If it was a genuine damage case proof of pictures would only need to be asked once and the buyer would have responded before going to leave negative feedback. If it really was damaged, I as a buyer would open a dispute (if the seller was uncooperative or couldn't claim on the postal insurance).
It was the buyer who offered to provide photos, and the offer was made after the negative feedback was left. This isn't a case of the seller requesting photos and the buyer steadfastly refusing to provide them. The buyer supposedly went out of their way to take photos, offered to provide them, the seller took up the offer in a rather aggressive manner, and it seems the buyer hasn't gotten around to sending them yet.

Provided a follow-up request hasn't been made, that's completely reasonable. Buyer figures he'll transfer the photos from his camera that evening and send them over, gets sidetracked, forgets about it.

The proof of the buyer being a scammer is in post #42 where he says if he's given £35 he'd be happy. He thought that he could blackmail the seller into giving him a huge discount and that the seller would give in.
That's not proof of a scam? The devil's advocate would say it's the buyer, having received damaged goods and been given the impression that he won't be able to return them, resolving to work out how much it will cost to repair the CPU and saying he would be happy if that much were discounted from the price.

Also, remember the buyer's original request was to return the CPU. In his original communication with the seller, the buyer didn't even raise the prospect of a discount. Why originally request to return the CPU if the scam is to wrangle a discount off the price?

More generally, why go to all the hassle? These CPUs sell for £175+ from what I understand. Why would a scammer spend that amount, then send multiple messages back and forth all for the sake of £35?
 
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Soldato
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It was the buyer who offered to provide photos. This isn't a case of the seller requesting photos and the buyer steadfastly refusing to provide them. The buyer supposedly went out of their way to take photos, offered to provide them, the seller took up the offer in a rather aggressive manner, and it seems the buyer hasn't gotten around to sending them yet.

Where does it say that, I genuinely can't find in alberts posts where the buyer's been quoted to say he'd provide pictures.

I've seen this

Where the buyer says he'd give pictures after being asked for pictures in the first place.


Provided a follow-up request hasn't been made, that's completely reasonable. Buyer figures he'll transfer the photos from his camera that evening and send them over, gets sidetracked, forgets about it.

Right, but the buyer completely remembers to go leave negative feedback..


That's not proof of a scam? The devil's advocate would say it's the buyer, having received damaged goods and been given the impression that he won't be able to return them, resolving to work out how much it will cost to repair the CPU and saying he would be happy if that much were discounted from the price.

Also, remember the buyer's original request was to return the CPU. In his original communication with the seller, the buyer didn't even raise the prospect of a discount. Why originally request to return the CPU if the scam is to wrangle a discount off the price?

More generally, why go to all the hassle? These CPUs sell for £175+ from what I understand. Why would a scammer spend that amount, then send multiple messages back and forth all for the sake of £35?

Yes it is, all albert asked is for some information on how it got damaged/could have happened (after the buyer asked for a return), the buyer gave negative feedback.

Do you know what bluffing is? Returning the CPU would result in the seller losing on postage (and the buyer I suppose, but if it's damaged they shouldn't really have to foot it). A seller wouldn't want this so would try and sort it out by other means if they could before going to get it returned.

The buyer knows that's the case and a significant refund can be had instead.

Why go to all the hassle? Because it is no hassle! You try and con some money back and you either get it or you don't. Wheres the hassle? The buyer hasn't provided any pictures or details of the repair shop. He most likely hasn't even gone to one. Made it all up to try and get £35 back.

The hassle would be if he really did take pictures and visit the shop for a quote but we really don't know if he even did.

It's a free £35 if you have a unexperienced seller.
 
Soldato
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Where does it say that, I genuinely can't find in alberts posts where the buyer's been quoted to say he'd provide pictures.

I've seen this

Where the buyer says he'd give pictures after being asked for pictures in the first place.
It's right there in the post you link. The buyer sends a message, apparently unprompted, saying "I took the processor to my local computer specialist. They have taken 4 photographs which I can email to you [...]", seller asks quite aggressively for the photos to be provided — demanding the name, address and phone number of the "specialist" in what seems to be a very curt message.

Right, but the buyer completely remembers to go leave negative feedback..
Negative feedback because the seller has, from his perspective, been utterly useless. He states the item was damaged on arrival and wants a return. Instead he gets a message stating his claims are impossible, suggesting he's lying, etc. He figures the seller isn't going to do anything to try and resolve the matter, so chalks it up as a loss and leaves negative feedback.

The buyer knows that's the case and a significant refund can be had instead.
If that was the ultimate aim, why was it not even raised as a possibility in the initial email? Why send a message asking for a partial refund after leaving negative feedback?

It's a free £35 if you have a unexperienced seller.
Sure, I can see how it's a scam with a potential £35 payoff, but I just can't see someone spending £175+ on a CPU, and writing in the manner quoted by albert, attempting to con a buyer out of such a relatively small amount of money.

In fact, the buyer just told him to forget about it straight away. He figured himself it wasn't worth the hassle.
 
Soldato
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It's right there in the post you link. The buyer sends a message, apparently unprompted, saying "I took the processor to my local computer specialist. They have taken 4 photographs which I can email to you [...]", seller asks quite aggressively for the photos to be provided — demanding the name, address and phone number of the "specialist" in what seems to be a very curt message.

Yeah I see he offers the photographs. Kinda hard to order it the way this was posted :)

Whilst I sort of agree that asking the name address and phone number could be seen as a bit aggressive, as a genuine buyer I'd get those details. I understand that as the buyer I also have to provide proof of what I say (However I suppose if the buyer has never sold he can't put himself in the shoes of a seller so wouldn't understand why he's being asked this)


Negative feedback because the seller has, from his perspective, been utterly useless. He states the item was damaged on arrival and wants a return. Instead he gets a message stating his claims are impossible, suggesting he's lying, etc. He figures the seller isn't going to do anything to try and resolve the matter, so chalks it up as a loss and leaves negative feedback.

Well even if the seller believes that, if as a buyer I received a damaged item and was genuine, I would then raise a dispute about it as well, not just leave negative feedback and give up. Although he could be genuine (buyer) and not have time to pursue this further, the way he has acted out does give the impressions of trying it on.

If that was the ultimate aim, why was it not even raised as a possibility in the initial email? Why send a message asking for a partial refund after leaving negative feedback?

True it is weird to leave neg feedback then request £35, could still try and threaten with a dispute though.

Sure, I can see how it's a scam with a potential £35 payoff, but I just can't see someone spending £175+ on a CPU, and writing in the manner quoted by albert, attempting to con a buyer out of such a relatively small amount of money.

In fact, the buyer just told him to forget about it straight away. He figured himself it wasn't worth the hassle.

Well you know there are a lot of people who would go to great lengths to do such things, not everyone is the same.

As for the buyer, he only gave up after proof was requested which was one of the major points that makes it seem he was up to something fishy.
 
Soldato
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Well even if the seller believes that, if as a buyer I received a damaged item and was genuine, I would then raise a dispute about it as well, not just leave negative feedback and give up. Although he could be genuine (buyer) and not have time to pursue this further, the way he has acted out does give the impressions of trying it on.
But the buyer did raise a dispute about it? He initiated the whole affair by sending a nice, polite email to the seller asking to return the item for a refund. He was attempting to work out the seller's address from the recorded delivery slip, clearly ready to send it straight back. This is hardly the gambit of a master scammer, I'm sure you'll agree.

True it is weird to leave neg feedback then request £35, could still try and threaten with a dispute though.
If I had to guess, I would say the guy gave up hope of returning the item for a full refund, so decided he'd get it repaired himself. He chalked it up as a loss, left negative feedback (because by this point he's had a pretty rotten experience with albert), then when he went to find out how much it would cost to repair and found it was a bit more than he was expecting (£35) went back to the seller asking for that amount.

The seller gives him more grief, demanding the contact details of the shop he got the repair quote from, so he decides it's not worth the hassle and will take the hit himself.

As for the buyer, he only gave up after proof was requested which was one of the major points that makes it seem he was up to something fishy.
It's not really like that in this case, though. He offered proof, the seller aggressively demanded that proof and more, so he figured it wasn't worth it.
 
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Soldato
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But the buyer did raise a dispute about it? He initiated the whole affair by sending a nice, polite email to the seller asking to return the item for a refund. He was attempting to work out the seller's address from the recorded delivery slip, clearly ready to send it straight back. This is hardly the gambit of a master scammer, I'm sure you'll agree.

Oh I meant dispute as in paypal dispute. True the initial email comes across as a genuine buyer, it's just the later ones that discredit that.

If I had to guess, I would say the guy gave up hope of returning the item for a full refund, so decided he'd get it repaired himself. He chalked it up as a loss, left negative feedback (because by this point he's had a pretty rotten experience with albert), then when he went to find out how much it would cost to repair and found it was a bit more than he was expecting (£35) went back to the seller asking for that amount.

Well I would say that's the wrong way of doing things then. I say he shouldn't have left the negative feedback first because asking for £35 after does make him look dodgy.

On an offtopic note, I would have just bent the pins back if no recourse was available.

The seller gives him more grief, demanding the contact details of the shop he got the repair quote from, so he decides it's not worth the hassle and will take the hit himself.

It's not really like that in this case, though. He offered proof, the seller aggressively demanded that proof and more, so he figured it wasn't worth it.


Well I suppose it's only grief if the buyer doesn't understand why the seller would be asking. It could be that albert didn't explain properly why he was asking these details.

I would have emailed him asking if he could email me the photographs and those pc shop contact details to be able to make a claim against the postal carrier. If the buyer decides that's too much of a hassle then they're just being uncooperative imo.


Think it's silly people avoiding eBay or Paypal, you can have the same issues or worst with retailers or banks as well.

Bad stuff happens. :/


Retailers can't damage your feedback rating. Have you sold anything on eBay before?

It's not really silly to avoid it because as a seller it's a big hassle and eBay and Paypal generally don't listen.

Best way to sell would be to block the sale to everyone until they have emailed you. Some users do that but it does limit their amount of buyers.
 
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Soldato
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Well I would say that's the wrong way of doing things then. I say he shouldn't have left the negative feedback first because asking for £35 after does make him look dodgy.

On an offtopic note, I would have just bent the pins back if no recourse was available.
I'd say precisely the opposite. Surely one of the most effective tricks up a scammer's sleeve is holding positive feedback to ransom?

Again, if I had to guess, I would say that's what the buyer thought re: the pins. He figured it was just a few bent pins, shouldn't cost too much to get fixed. He'll take the hit, leaves negative feedback. Finds out exactly how much the hit will be, asks for a partial refund to cover it, gives up and resolves to take the hit anyway.

Well I suppose it's only grief if the buyer doesn't understand why the seller would be asking. It could be that albert didn't explain properly why he was asking these details.
It's a combination of the information albert asked for, and the manner in which he asked for it. Asking for the details in the first instance gives the impression that albert doesn't believe the statements the buyer is making, which obviously isn't nice from the buyer's perspective. Asking for the phone number, in particular, would give me the impression that the nice chap at my local computer store is shortly going to have some irate seller on the phone causing him grief.

I would have emailed him asking if he could email me the photographs and those pc shop contact details to be able to make a claim against the postal carrier. If the buyer decides that's too much of a hassle then they're just being uncooperative imo.
What albert should have done, if he was going to go down that avenue, was send a polite email asking for the photos and for a written quote from the computer store, explaining precisely the reasons he needed these details (i.e. "It's not that I think you're a scammer, but obviously for legal reasons I need to verify the information you've provided me before I authorise a partial refund, etc.").
 
Soldato
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I'd say precisely the opposite. Surely one of the most effective tricks up a scammer's sleeve is holding positive feedback to ransom?

Yeah that is, just the way the buyer went about it was erratic.

It's a combination of the information albert asked for, and the manner in which he asked for it. Asking for the details in the first instance gives the impression that albert doesn't believe the statements the buyer is making, which obviously isn't nice from the buyer's perspective.

Well asking for details of any claim is surely a given, surely the buyer should understand that anyone in their right mind will ask for proof as you can't just blanket believe what an unknown (to the seller) buyer has said.

Asking for the phone number, in particular, would give me the impression that the nice chap at my local computer store is shortly going to have some irate seller on the phone causing him grief.

True just asking for the phone number and details like that would seem a bit OTT without an explanation. I suppose albert already had it set in his mind that the guy was a scammer which is why he responded that way.

What albert should have done, if he was going to go down that avenue, was send a polite email asking for the photos and for a written quote from the computer store, explaining precisely the reasons he needed these details (i.e. "It's not that I think you're a scammer, but obviously for legal reasons I need to verify the information you've provided me before I authorise a partial refund, etc.").

Yes that would have been the best way but you know what they say, hindsight is... :)
 
Soldato
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True just asking for the phone number and details like that would seem a bit OTT without an explanation. I suppose albert already had it set in his mind that the guy was a scammer which is why he responded that way.
It seems albert was set in the belief he was being scammed from the outset, from the moment he received the polite email asking to return the CPU for a refund.

From where I sit, and from the correspondence I've seen between the buyer and seller, I'm just as inclined to view this as a legitimate buyer being treated like dirt because the seller is convinced he's a scammer.

Hence, rather unsurprisingly, the negative feedback albert has now received.

Yes that would have been the best way but you know what they say, hindsight is... :)
As I mentioned earlier, though, everyone in the thread advised albert to pursue a different course of action.

The general consensus, I believe, was to accept the refund and be cordial with the buyer. If the buyer sends a different CPU back, that's evidence of a scam. If he sends the correct CPU back and it is indeed damaged, claim for the damage from the shipping company. Buyer is happy, seller gets positive feedback, everyone but the shipping company is a winner.

This is what happens when you ask for advice then proceed to ignore it...
 
Associate
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It seems albert was set in the belief he was being scammed from the outset, from the moment he received the polite email asking to return the CPU for a refund.

From where I sit, and from the correspondence I've seen between the buyer and seller, I'm just as inclined to view this as a legitimate buyer being treated like dirt because the seller is convinced he's a scammer.

Hence, rather unsurprisingly, the negative feedback albert has now received.

As I mentioned earlier, though, everyone in the thread advised albert to pursue a different course of action.

The general consensus, I believe, was to accept the refund and be cordial with the buyer. If the buyer sends a different CPU back, that's evidence of a scam. If he sends the correct CPU back and it is indeed damaged, claim for the damage from the shipping company. Buyer is happy, seller gets positive feedback, everyone but the shipping company is a winner.

This is what happens when you ask for advice then proceed to ignore it...

^^^ How high is your horse or are you nice and comfy in that big chair of smugness you're sitting in :p

From Alberts point of view
I'd probably have done the same as Albert if I'm honest, if you've packaged up something well enough, paid a good level of postage with insurance then I don't think it's unreasonable to be unhappy and dubious when you hear about 'pins falling out'.

From the buyers point of view
If the buyer was genuine he'd also want it sorted out one way or the other so why did he not send the photos or provide contact details. If I was the buyer and took the time and trouble to take it to a 'specialist' to get the cpu fixed then whats the issue in sending photos as requested. If genuine I'd be annoyed that I'd been sent a damaged cpu and want to get my cash back, not stump up £35 for some place to bend 4 or so pins back into shape with no real understanding of what any further issues the CPU might have.

I don't often post, I lurk and read but I saw your posts and could not stop myself posting.
 
Soldato
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From Alberts point of view
I'd probably have done the same as Albert if I'm honest, if you've packaged up something well enough, paid a good level of postage with insurance then I don't think it's unreasonable to be unhappy and dubious when you hear about 'pins falling out'.
Would you really have done the same thing, though?

You'd respond to a polite email from a buyer claiming the product you have sold them was damaged in transit, not by complying with their request to return the item and claim for the damage using the insurance you paid for, but by dismissing the possibility of it being damaged in transit, questioning the buyer's integrity and giving them the impression — albert is quick to state he never said outright he would not accept a return, but that is what the buyer believes to be the case, and I'm not half surprised — that you're not going to do anything to resolve the situation?

Then you'd act surprised when the buyer leaves negative feedback? :confused:

Edit: albert was awfully quick to dismiss the possibility of it being damaged in transit, but I'm not so convinced. If the little plastic case is anything like the one shown in this image of an X4, I wouldn't be at all surprised if the plastic casing came unclipped in transit and the processor became free to move about, ending up with a few bent pins. That's what the buyer claims happened...
 
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I had this but what funny is the guy picked it up as to have it delivered! Paypal and eBay went in his favour! I then sent all 3 the CCTV saying watch it, rethink your ideas and let me know. The CCTV was there due to my mental ex! The guy comes in and has a brew before taking the tv he bought. Lets say eBay and Paypal soon paid up!
 
Soldato
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I had this but what funny is the guy picked it up as to have it delivered! Paypal and eBay went in his favour! I then sent all 3 the CCTV saying watch it, rethink your ideas and let me know. The CCTV was there due to my mental ex! The guy comes in and has a brew before taking the tv he bought. Lets say eBay and Paypal soon paid up!

That's why you never take money via paypal for something that will be collected. Always cash because you would have no proof of the buyer receiving the item.

Good thing you had proof and got your money though.
 
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