Tethering (probly been asked before)

[Simian]

I'm gonna be looking to get myself a Nexus 4 and a Nexus 10 in the new year, and I'm looking to get an Unlimited SIM from either 3, O2 or GiffGaff for the N4.

Now I also want to be able to, on the rare occasions I go away from my Wi-Fi with the N10, teather it to the N4 for Large Screen Google Maps, Youtube, Pron etc...

All of the above seem to state on their 'Unlimited' SIM only deals that "Tethering is NOT allowed!, if you want to Tether you need to pay us Loads more money!" I don't really want to pay more than £15/month (30 day contract)

Strangely on GiffGaff the 1Gb SIM (£10 goodybag) DOES allow Tethering, I've not checked O2 or 3 for similar, but don't thing they can match that price!

Anyhew what I really wanted to know is this... How do they know if I'm 'Tethering' my N10 to my N4?, is there some way the Phone reports back and I get a slapped wrist and extra charges?, or can I on the brief occasion that I'll be doing it, just do it and the service provider is none the wiser (as long as I don't download Gb's of suff!!)...

It's not like I'm gonna tether my home PC to my phone!, I Think my Infinity BB is a little faster than the N4

 

[Myshra]

You're right, this was asked about before but your case is a little different. This specific type would probably go around the watchdog, the bigger ones in use are more for higher traffic types (windows >> phone >> APN) which are easily to spot (check-in's to update.windows.com is the first thing windows does when it connects for example). Heuristically it's not too hard to spot either (headers would be different but only a few times a year? headers don't match <handset sold to you>, screen resolution suddenly different?), there are tons of give aways and using them to match a pattern of "a tetherer" isn't exactly rocket science when you look at it like this.

I can assure you, as someone who works in telecoms that these filters are very much real it's just that telcos have a hard decision - crack down too much, you alienate a technical (and small minority) audience which you could do with for handset launches etc... but let too much through and you get taken for a ride (in THEIR eyes). Most will let a bit through, some don't care, three care quite a bit (firm lockout now). big offenders tend to be contacted personally but the rest mostly get to slip by.

I don't agree with charging twice for tethering I stress but I'm not the boss there's a limit to the amount I can really say about secure devices when it comes to telecoms as it's propietory per telco usually and this crosses into government territory / the law too bizarrely.

 

[koooowweeee]

do you mean tether your n4 to the 10

im on the 12quid a month giffgaff and i tether to my nexus 7 all the time.

i think they will only know if your tethering to your pc, because it will be desktop sites rather than mobile ones. so in your case and mine we will not be doing that.

just check if you get a good signal in your area with o2/giffgaff, you could always try it then go to another network.

 

[muon]

Feel free to tether the Nexus 10 as the chrome browser being identical makes it hard to detect properly without accidentally blocking tethering on some android phone variant.

 

[StarmanUK]

Personally I used to tether rarely on the old £10 "Unlimited" data offer. I'd like to think provided its not too often and only small amounts it'll go unnoticed.

But with the new £10 1GB offer I'm glad to see they now don't care how/what you use your data allowance for.

 

[Skeeter]

I'm assuming the Nexus 10 will identify itself in requests as a mobile device (when you go to a website that has a mobile version it automatically gives you the mobile version)? If so you should be fine.

I think GiffGaff are going to block tethering though. If your after a sim only look at Virgin. I'm on a cheap 10 quid tariff and can tether my Nexus 7 fine. Better coverage than O2 aswell.

 

[koooowweeee]

how are they going to block it going off what you said at Tim start of your post?

they do ban people now but some people just take the mick and download loads.

 

[titaniumx3]

As far as I know Giffgaff only detect tethering by heavy usage, they don't have any proper detection system.

I've used tethering (via wireless hotspot on my phone) for getting interent on my Nexus 7 and have no issue, which makes sense as I use internet on my N7 the same as I use it on my phone.

If you start using to as your main internet connection, you'll probably get banned pretty quickly though.

 

[Marvin]

I'm not convinced that anyone would use desktop/mobile site requests as a filter, I have my WP permanently set to desktop sites only, and I had the same on my S III with Paranoid Android running, usually I find mobile sites to lack features I'm after, and so just default straight to desktop.

Anyway, plenty of people would do this I'd think regularly enough that it's no indication.

 

[Rainmaker]

Three do allow tethering on their One plans (PAYG and contract). We're in a new build house and VM haven't finished finalising their cable lay. Everything's in place now (finally after 8 months) but they haven't added our address to their database yet. In the meantime we've been tethering to a Three PAYG sim via an Android handset and pull literally tens of GB a month (including downloads via NNTP). Some nights I pull 20GB at once overnight at 20Mbps!

From Three's blog:

The One Plan is by far our biggest selling plan, and if you’re one of those customers already on it, we really do want you to be using all-you-can-eat data to its full potential.

New smartphone functionality has meant that your phone is capable of so much more than simply letting you update your Facebook status when you’re on the move. That’s why we’ve squeezed as much value as possible into our hero offer The One Plan, as well as taking the decision to incorporate tethering in the package.

That means you can use your smartphone to connect other devices to the internet, either by switching on your phone’s Personal Hotspot functionality so that it sends out a WiFi signal, or by connecting your phone to a device via a USB connection – you might know this as ‘tethering’ or ‘using your phone as a modem’.

...

Some other networks are cutting back on data and internet allowances, but we’ve worked hard to get The One Plan right. We want you to really make the most your smartphone’s functionality, so we’re encouraging you to tether as much as you need to – without worrying about the cost.

I double checked with the manager of a local Three store and he said it was fine, fill your boots. Works for us.

EDIT: On Three you'd need to top up with £15 a month and use it to buy the £15 bundle which is the cheapest one which incorporates all you can eat data. Definitely do NOT go with GiffGaff their service is appalling. I was banned off the network for using 'too much' data at 2GB in a month non-tethered. Apparently my peak time usage was too high. Pathetic!

 

[Kasc]

Virgin Mobile allows tethering on their unlimited plans. They also use EE/Orange/T-Mobile's network so should be good signal.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

Three do allow tethering on their One plans (PAYG and contract). We're in a new build house and VM haven't finished finalising their cable lay. Everything's in place now (finally after 8 months) but they haven't added our address to their database yet. In the meantime we've been tethering to a Three PAYG sim via an Android handset and pull literally tens of GB a month (including downloads via NNTP). Some nights I pull 20GB at once overnight at 20Mbps!

From Three's blog:



I double checked with the manager of a local Three store and he said it was fine, fill your boots. Works for us.

EDIT: On Three you'd need to top up with £15 a month and use it to buy the £15 bundle which is the cheapest one which incorporates all you can eat data. Definitely do NOT go with GiffGaff their service is appalling. I was banned off the network for using 'too much' data at 2GB in a month non-tethered. Apparently my peak time usage was too high. Pathetic!

I just checked their website and they do not allow tethering on any of their PAYG plans and the only pay monthly plan they allow it on is the £25 per month "one" plan

 

[Rainmaker]

I just checked their website and they do not allow tethering on any of their PAYG plans and the only pay monthly plan they allow it on is the £25 per month "one" plan

It seems you're right. Whether they changed their minds or what, I don't know. But I stand by the rest of my post, and it certainly works - and works well. For the record I have a PAYG and a contract phone (One Plan) from Three so it's no skin off my nose either way (i.e. it's not purposeful abuse as I also have a legit source of tethering from them).

 

[Skeeter]

I'm not convinced that anyone would use desktop/mobile site requests as a filter, I have my WP permanently set to desktop sites only, and I had the same on my S III with Paranoid Android running, usually I find mobile sites to lack features I'm after, and so just default straight to desktop.

Anyway, plenty of people would do this I'd think regularly enough that it's no indication.

Its not the actual site thats used, is the device identifyer within the request. When you make a web request your device is identified as being mobile or desktop (probubly more) in the request. The page can then use this information to automatically send you the mobile site. Of course you can over ride it and get desktop sites, but the device will still identify itself as a mobile device. And its the identification that they use to block tethering (for companies who do. Like some people have said, GiffGaff monitor data useage rather than request types).

Phone: "Hi, I'm a phone"
Server "Hi Phone!"
Phone: "Can I have BBC.co.uk please?"
Server " Sure, heres the mobile site, enjoy"
Phone "Actually, can I have the desktop version?"
Server: "No problem Phone, heres the desktop site"
Phone: "Thanks!"

Regardless of what version of the site your device renders, it still identifies itself to the server as being mobile or desktop. This is why tablets wont get picked up on a lot of filters as they will identify themselves as a mobile device by using Android or WP or iOS. PCs and Laptops will obviously identify themselves as desktops.

Basically, if you use a device that gets sent to mobile sites by default, you likely wont get picked up for tethering on that device, regardless of wether you view desktop or mobile versions of stuff.

 

[EyepodI]

Its not the actual site thats used, is the device identifyer within the request.

Are you saying it's the info in the user agent string that they use or is it more complicated than that?

 

[Skeeter]

Are you saying it's the info in the user agent string that they use or is it more complicated than that?

I don't know enough about the process to confirm that, but I know its to do with how a device identifies itself to the web server. Android tablets will identify themselves in the same way as Android phones, meaning its not possible to distinguish a web request as being from a mobile itself, or a tablet tethered to the mobile. Devices running Desktop OS's like Laptops and PCs will identify themselves differently, and its this that is picked up.

If its the user agent string that carries this information, then yes.

 

[lamboman]

To get the user agent they'd need to use deep packet inspection (DPI), which I doubt giffgaff do. I'd be surprised if they do anything more than look at traffic and data usage.

 

[demonix]

To get the user agent they'd need to use deep packet inspection (DPI), which I doubt giffgaff do. I'd be surprised if they do anything more than look at traffic and data usage.

When they started the consultation for the change in pricing for the £10 goodybag, they did say that they were planning to implement improved tethering detection which might include looking at the user agent string.

 

[Myshra]

To get the user agent they'd need to use deep packet inspection (DPI), which I doubt giffgaff do. I'd be surprised if they do anything more than look at traffic and data usage.

Giffgaff uses O2's GGSN.

 

[thepharcyde]

Got banned with giffgaff three and NZB baby