Advice before signing the Tennancy Agreement

[DanielMMS]

Fees for drawing up/checking/allowing you to sign the tenancy agreement are illegal.

Only in Scotland - not in England where letting agents can charge a fee for pretty much anything so long as they are being transparent. The only things they are unable to charge for are for registering with them or for giving you a list or properties (there may be one other thing but I can't remember!).

That said, I'm assuming you have not seen the TA as yet. This should set alarm bells ringing. Somewhat inscrupulous agents tend to present the TA for signature on the day tenants are due to move in - only then do the tenants become aware of the nasty clauses included, such as 6 monthly above inflation rent rises. It is then too late for them to pull out.

I would strongly recommend walking away. Without knowing what you have signed it is difficult to know the extent to which you are contractually tied but, if it was merely a credit check agreement, then you have no further obligations.

 

[Abraham]

Citation please. Every single agency we've used (and it's around 5, and all the major highstreet big names) do this.

There is a very specific fee which I believe was made illegal, although it escapes me what it was for now. All fees in Scotland are illegal, but they're still made. The best you can do is dispute them and get justificiation for what they cover. It's difficult when you don't want to lose out on a property though.

 

[mothermachine]

There is a very specific fee which I believe was made illegal, although it escapes me what it was for now. All fees in Scotland are illegal, but they're still made. The best you can do is dispute them and get justificiation for what they cover. It's difficult when you don't want to lose out on a property though.

I see so it's a Scottish thing. In the UK it's commonplace for agencies to charge for drawing up agreements, checking references and "admin fees" which include any damned thing they like. No way around it unfortunately.

And some really cheeky agencies charge you for both a check in AND a check out! Which is ridiculous because they're being paid twice for the same thing each time someone moves out and someone moves in. This is quite rare but it happens.

 

[Abraham]

I see so it's a Scottish thing. In the UK it's commonplace for agencies to charge for drawing up agreements, checking references and "admin fees" which include any damned thing they like. No way around it unfortunately.

And some really cheeky agencies charge you for both a check in AND a check out! Which is ridiculous because they're being paid twice for the same thing each time someone moves out and someone moves in. This is quite rare but it happens.

Scotland is (currently) in the UK

But yes, in England they will tend to charge whatever they can get away with, like I say it's down to tenants to stand up to it (although Landlords would do themselves favours if they did too)

 

[mothermachine]

Scotland is (currently) in the UK

Haha yes I meant England of course.

 

[Haggisman]

OFT does actually state something about agents shouldn't be taking payments before the tenant has had an opportunity to read the tenancy agreement (I had to do a bit of research into this when an agency kept asking for more referencing fees after we'd already given them ~£400). Let me see if I can dig up the specific notes.

 

[Haggisman]

http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/reports/unfair_contract_terms/oft356.pdf

Pages 19-21 have some bits about deposit refunds following cancellation due to breach of contract. (i.e. the agreement to fix the fence)

Pages 31-33 has the section about payments pre-signing, most relevant is probably Section 3.85:

"Pre-contract deposits
3.85 If the landlord or agents take a non-refundable pre-contract deposit, they
may in effect bind the prospective tenant to accept terms 'sight unseen'. We
are likely to consider a non-refundable deposit to be unfair in any case (see
Group 4), and it is particularly open to challenge where tenants become
bound before they have the chance to become acquainted with the terms of
the tenancy agreement. "

 

[~Divine~Wind~]

I'm with the above I'm afraid.
If you can afford the £200 hit I'd walk away now.
Maybe even have a chat with CAB about claiming the £200 back?

Name and shame agency too please, don't let others get taken in by them

 

[CREATIVE!11]

Landlords job to fix the house?

It's a security risk... they're just trying to make you fix the house so they can save money. Disgusting....

 

[Abraham]

Landlords job to fix the house?

It's a security risk... they're just trying to make you fix the house so they can save money. Disgusting....

It does sound like the agency are doing it not the landlords, I'd probably try and speak straight to the landlord, but it might not be possible, and might not get them anywhere

 

[AndrewD]

Thanks for all the advice, we've appreciated it and have pulled out from the property. We got the tenancy agreement today but after stating issues and a quote to fix the fence at £1'400 we decided it was best to walk.

We really do feel fortunate to be staying with family at the moment otherwise it may have not been possible and had to take it on.

 

[nutcase]

The right decision I think. Have you asked for your £200 back? Stating reason of changing the terms on the tenany agreement after initially advised or something like that?

 

[mattyg]

£200 for drawing up a tenancy agreement which, Apart from the names will be exactly the same as the 100's that they already have.

Jeez you can download a FREE AST of the net.

Robbing B*******

Then theyre are the ones that think they can charge you that every year for renewing.

 

[Haggisman]

The right decision I think. Have you asked for your £200 back? Stating reason of changing the terms on the tenany agreement after initially advised or something like that?

Indeed, I'd do this - make sure you hint about naming & shaming to the press/online/etc. also, check if they're part of any professional bodies, e.g. ARLA, Property Ombudsman, as if they are, there is a code of conduct they need to stick to.

 

[singist]

£200 for drawing up a tenancy agreement which, Apart from the names will be exactly the same as the 100's that they already have.

Jeez you can download a FREE AST of the net.

Robbing B*******

Then theyre are the ones that think they can charge you that every year for renewing.

I have never understood how letting agencies can charge for 'drawing up an agreement/contract', as it would seem to me that almost every agreement will be identical and no 'drawing up' takes place. A car hire company doesn't charge for creating a contract for you to sign, they just reach into a drawer and grab one of the hundreds of identical, pre printed forms that they have.
edit: To my mind, an agent should be employed by the landlord/owner NOT by the tenant.

 

[Haggisman]

edit: To my mind, an agent should be employed by the landlord/owner NOT by the tenant.

They are - however that doesn't stop the ******s charging both for the same thing!!

There are some decent ones out there, our last agency only charged us what the referencing agency charged them, fair enough (although they're completely useless in other respects!). The reason they can get away with it is simple - to use your example, you don't <need> to hire a car, however everyone needs somewhere to live. If you can't get a mortgage, unfortunately you have no choice but to rent, and the agencies know this. Also, unlike car hire, where you can just go down the road to the next hire company and get the exact same model car, you can't go a different agency for the same property

So glad I'm buying soon, and hopefully won't have to deal with the thieving scum that are letting agents ever again!

 

[tom_e]

If I read it right the £200 was charged for references which they always state is non refundable never mind what happens, it's a load of crap but standard practise

 

[Haggisman]

If I read it right the £200 was charged for references which they always state is non refundable never mind what happens, it's a load of crap but standard practise

It might be "standard practice" but could most likely still be challenged under the OFT unfair contract terms I linked above:

"Where cancellation is the fault of the tenant, the landlord or agent is entitled to hold back from any refund of prepayments a reasonable sum to cover either the net costs or the net loss of profit resulting directly from the default,22 but not both where this would lead to double counting"

So they would only be allowed to withhold the costs of the referencing, plus a reasonable admin fee. That's in the case of the cancellation being the fault of the tenant. In this case it's actually the LL/agent who have caused the cancellation by breaching the contract, and so the OP should be entitled to a full refund.

Of course it would be a lot of hassle for the OP to claim this and most people wouldn't bother, which is why letting agents continue to do it and get away with it.

Also in order to illustrate that the LL/agency were in breach of contract, the OP would have to prove the agreement to repair the fence, which, unless he got it in writing is going to be virtually impossible!

 

[AndrewD]

The agreement was a standard one that probably just use for all their agreements because we asked about our pets (which we were allowed) but the agreement said we needed prior written consent of the landlord, which we did not get, so if we signed they would have been in their rights to have our two dogs removed from the property while we were liable for the rent.

We're both really happy that we got out of the situation.

 

[Morba]

They sounded like a nightmare tbh, so good you are out of there