ISIS and Islamic militants - discussion

zoomee · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:14

All the muslims and Islam are to blame :rolleyes:

Some of you are pathetic. Can't differentiate the difference between political and religious motivation.

Anyways, now this is an interesting point:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...to-slow-Isil-recruitment-says-John-Kerry.html

'Solve the Israel-Palestine issue to slow Isil recruitment,' says John Kerry

He has a good point - Showing willingness to resolve this long outstanding conflict would debunk a lot of the claims of ISIL that the West are evulz.

Mynight · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:14

Housey said:
I suspect there is a very clear direction from UK government. Remove this scum in theatre, we don't want them back, shoot to kill etc.

Quite. I wondered how the family found out before the news did. Maybe there is some form of contact between certain families and ISIS.

Maybe there's a messenger delivering the bad news in england :confused:

.

Unless the government is specifically targeting the british jihads and scoring them off a list...

BuffetSlayer · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:15

balky12 said:
It's not a worthless comparisson at all. Think about it a bit more...

For someone to have the ability to go abroad and kill in the name of religion, imo, means there is something deeply rooted within the individual. It has just been brought out.

It's that deep rooted problem that is incurable.

I agree it is a problem. It could be specific to apathetic or shunned individuals. Or it could be grooming that happens by adults with an agenda over the course of many years.

I am not sure how it happens but the fact that it does means we are failing. We do not tolerate any other kind of grooming or manipulation, yet if it is a Muslim being radicalised they are automatically classed as a terrorist.

We see it in many walks of life. For example drug dealers giving young kids drugs to deal or get hooked on. It pulls them into a dark world and they use manipulation and violence to reinforce their power over those young people.

balky12 · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:20

BuffetSlayer said:
I agree it is a problem. It could be specific to apathetic or shunned individuals. Or it could be grooming that happens by adults with an agenda over the course of many years.

I am not sure how it happens but the fact that it does means we are failing. We do not tolerate any other kind of grooming or manipulation, yet if it is a Muslim being radicalised they are automatically classed as a terrorist.

We see it in many walks of life. For example drug dealers giving young kids drugs to deal or get hooked on. It pulls them into a dark world and they use manipulation and violence to reinforce their power over those young people.

That's because they become terrorists by the very definition. Extremists terrorise. In all aspects.

I agree though, we are failing. But HOW do you stop it? Thanks to the liberals you can't talk about it anymore through fear of being called a racist or a islamaphobe.

John40 · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:28

balky12 said:
I agree though, we are failing. But HOW do you stop it? Thanks to the liberals you can't talk about it anymore through fear of being called a racist or a islamaphobe.

Exactly what happened in Rotherham and quite a few other areas, somebody early said we don't allow any other kind of grooming, really ?

Mynight · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:35

zoomee said:
Snip

Bloody good video. I still can't believe some people lump everyone together.

Would have been nice to hear the opposing argument though. Can't find it yet but I'm sure it's out there.

scorza · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:43

zoomee said:
Anyways, now this is an interesting point:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...to-slow-Isil-recruitment-says-John-Kerry.html

He has a good point - Showing willingness to resolve this long outstanding conflict would debunk a lot of the claims of ISIL that the West are evulz.

Is that all? Let's schedule a meeting for next Tuesday afternoon then and thrash out the issues. Sad to say that I don't believe the Israel-Palestine conflict is solvable right now because both sides would prefer to keep fighting.

In any case, I don't believe it'd make much difference - the West "solved" the persecution of Muslims in Bosnia and Kosovo but that seems to always get forgotten - there'd just be some other conflict somewhere in the world where Muslims dying at the hands of non-Muslims would be seen as an injustice. My view is if these conflicts are seen by individuals as justification for going on a jihad then those individuals are part of the problem and not the solution.

balky12 · 21 Oct 2014 at 15:53

John40 said:
Exactly what happened in Rotherham and quite a few other areas, somebody early said we don't allow any other kind of grooming, really ?

More and more of this will come out over the next 5 years.

Police pushed it underground to not stir up racial tensions in the UK against Pakistani's.

Truth is, what these minorities were doing was abhorent and have ruined thousands if not 10's of thousands of lives.

But you couldn't talk about it then because you would be racist and stiring up racial tension.

We failed those children massively.

robgmun · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:00

Dj_Jestar said:
Dunno, ask someone who does. Try John40 - he seems to be passionate about seeing that some people are put to death.

Nice try, you are openly empathising with monsters and it offends me

Mynight · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:01

Robgmun unless you're a minority no one cares that it offends you

.

robgmun · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:06

Dj_Jestar said:
Rabies is an incurable infection. Being ill-informed, lied to, brainwashed, whatever you want to call it is not. Drop the worthless comparisons.

hum.... I'm not sure a agree with that, yes there are cases of deprogramming that works in cults but i haven't heard of any cases where someone who ends up being a jihadist changes his mind and goes "hang on"

an extreme ideology can sometimes be as incurable

robgmun · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:08

zoomee said:
All the muslims and Islam are to blame

Who on earth was going about all muslims and Islam?? Seriously you really have to watch your persecution complex.

robgmun · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:14

Mynight said:
Robgmun unless you're a minority no one cares that it offends you .

Hum, i am Latino and arguably is a far smaller minority than most so i can pull the race card out

John40 · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:15

robgmun said:
hum.... I'm not sure a agree with that, yes there are cases of deprogramming that works in cults but i haven't heard of any cases where someone who ends up being a jihadist changes his mind and goes "hang on"

an extreme ideology can sometimes be as incurable

It's the go-to excuse nowadays that they're all poor impoverished boys radicalised by nasty preachers.

I simply cannot believe that certain posters on here are sitting down bashing a keyboard to sympathise with and excuse some of the most barbaric individuals ever to walk this earth.

It makes you wonder about what other extreme views they have if they don't see a lot wrong with what's going on in the middle east.

Dj_Jestar · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:16

robgmun said:
Nice try, you are openly empathising with monsters and it offends me

Am I? Thanks for telling me.

Dj_Jestar · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:17

John40 said:
It's the go-to excuse nowadays that they're all poor impoverished boys radicalised by nasty preachers.

I simply cannot believe that certain posters on here are sitting down bashing a keyboard to sympathise with and excuse some of the most barbaric individuals ever to walk this earth.

It makes you wonder about what other extreme views they have if they don't see a lot wrong with what's going on in the middle east.

If you're expecting people to have similar thoughts as you, they wouldn't be any different to those you criticise.

rpg · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:20

robgmun said:
Hum, i am Latino and arguably is a far smaller minority than most so i can pull the race card out

Pull the race card out? What does that even mean? And even if it does mean something, is it actually applicable and appropriate in relation to your origin? :confused:

robgmun · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:20

I do worry about some posters here, particularly zoomee, i have been reading his posts in various threads for some months now and it strike me as someone who on his way to being radicalised. And as another poster pointed out a few weeks ago i wouldn't be surprised if he was on some watch list somewhere.

rpg said:
Pull the race card out? What does that even mean? And even if it does, is it actually applicable and appropriate relating to your origin?

Silly joke, deal with it, i was taking the mickey of certain individuals who get upperty and offended at the drop of the hat and resort to pulling the race card out even if it hasn't anything to do with race at all.

Harlequin · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:21

Dj_Jestar said:
What did you think any of that would add to the discussion? Rabble rousing ad nauseam.

it was a question you once again failed to answer - like all the others put to you

balky12 · 21 Oct 2014 at 16:23

Dj_Jestar said:
If you're expecting people to have similar thoughts as you, they wouldn't be any different to those you criticise.

So you are saying that people who criticise, or who lack sympathy for the ISIS followers and sympathisers are just as bad as these very same terrorists.

lulwut?

Bashing your keyboard against ISIS and it's sympathisers sends a very different message to bashing you keyboard sympathising with them... granted they both don't actually do very much in the grand scheme of things.