Will UKIP win its first seat in parliament tonight?

robgmun · 20 Jan 2015 at 13:33

LordSplodge said:
Our own blood? What does that even mean?

Do you not know history brv?

LordSplodge · 20 Jan 2015 at 13:43

robgmun said:
Do you not know history brv?

Britain for the Trinovantes, right? Bloody Romans coming over here with indoor plumbing, paved roads and central heating.

phil675 · 20 Jan 2015 at 14:07

I don't know if the greens get discussed much here, but, is this real?

Lagmeister · 20 Jan 2015 at 14:10

robgmun said:
released today by UKIP

I have to say it's mega confusing about the poll this week, i've seen two that say 13%, one that says 15% two that say 18% and one that say 20%! They're all over the place!

That doesn't really stand up to be honest, I don't trust any of the major parties concerning reform of the NHS but I trust UKIP even less when stories like this keep popping up of Farages' views.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...aced-by-private-health-insurance-9988904.html

scorza · 20 Jan 2015 at 14:13

phil675 said:
I don't know if the greens get discussed much here, but, is this real?

...

Looks real enough - the black text does appear to be from their manifesto and the green text is someone's spin on it. Would be useful to know who wrote the green text.

D.P. · 20 Jan 2015 at 14:22

TwsT said:
agreed wasn't startign a fight i was generally interested as like I said I know a lot of people agree with farages anti europe ethos but aren't economically able to survive some of the extremes which would come from long term control by a far right conservative like farage.

OFC I don't expect Ukip to be in charge nor do i expect it to change much as dave and his crooks will set up the sale of the nhs anyway. Losing tory seats to Ukip isn't a concern losing labour or liberal ones is.

This election will do wonders for fixing these "were not so bad/good" centre of the left/Right ******s we have at the moment.

Green will definitely pick up more than people are expecting they are taking the student vote from cleggy I predict a lib dem strong hold like cardiff (not sure which zone but teh student one) to swing green in may,

I think you are right in that the total number of Lib dem + green seats will remain the same, making a Labour+Lib+dem+green majority a good possibility.

D.P. · 20 Jan 2015 at 14:24

robgmun said:
Do you not know history brv?

So why should native Aboriginals Australians have any more right to emigrate to the Uk than our European neighbors when Britain was formed by European migration, not Australian emigration.

robgmun · 20 Jan 2015 at 15:33

Lagmeister said:
That doesn't really stand up to be honest, I don't trust any of the major parties concerning reform of the NHS but I trust UKIP even less when stories like this keep popping up of Farages' views.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...aced-by-private-health-insurance-9988904.html

I think i'll take it straight from the horses mouth rather 3rd hand information and chinese whispers in a newspapers

Tweeted by Nigel Farage today

v0n · 20 Jan 2015 at 15:42

And yet in 2010 manifesto UKIP wanted to hand over chunks of NHS to private 'franchises':

"Encourage County Health Boards (ed: UKIP proposed extra management layer) to put out to tender key NHS services ranging from Long Term Care to local hospitals and GP surgeries. This will be done by franchising key services run on a fixed budget to charitable associations and profit-making private companies, partnerships and individuals. This will bring in private sector efficiency and innovation, while fixed assets, responsibility and direction remain firmly in public hands.

Over time, UKIP will replace Hospital, Foundation, NHS Care and Ambulance Service Trusts with equivalent franchises "

robgmun · 20 Jan 2015 at 15:43

v0n said:
And yet in 2010 manifesto UKIP wanted to hand over chunks of NHS to private 'franchises':

Well you yourself admit how horribly out of date that is, so not much more to say on that. Better than a zombie party that doesn't change their tune *cough*liblabcon*cough*

v0n · 20 Jan 2015 at 15:58

Well, they've gone from "we'll make sure NHS is sold off to private sector franchises" to "I don't want to hand off NHS to faceless private sector companies" in just 4 years. That's not political party "tune", that's greatest hits remix compilation.

Nigel will promise the masses whatever they need to hear at the time, with pinky swear and crossing his heart, the full song and dance - just to get the vote.

scorza · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:01

v0n said:
Well, they've gone from "we'll make sure NHS is sold off to private sector franchises" to "I don't want to hand off NHS to faceless private sector companies" in just 4 years. That's not political party "tune", that's greatest hits remix compilation.

Nigel will promise the masses whatever they need to hear at the time, with pinky swear and crossing his heart, the full song and dance - just to get the vote.

Part of the charm of UKIP is that they aren't an established, mature political party - their leadership says what they think and not what a committee has decided they should say. The fundamental question for me is whether I trust Farage to stick to his promises more than I trust Ed, Dave or Nick to do the same. I think the answer is 'maybe'.

D.P. · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:06

scorza said:
Part of the charm of UKIP is that they aren't an established, mature political party - their leadership says what they think and not what a committee has decided they should say. The fundamental question for me is whether I trust Farage to stick to his promises more than I trust Ed, Dave or Nick to do the same. I think the answer is 'maybe'.

The question then comes which promise, the "we will sell th NHS to private profit-making fanchise" or the one you want to hear?

Can you trust someone who says absolutely anything to get votes, even if it is complete contradiction of what they have previously reported?

scorza · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:11

D.P. said:
The question then comes which promise, the "we will sell th NHS to private profit-making fanchise" or the one you want to hear?

Can you trust someone who says absolutely anything to get votes, even if it is complete contradiction of what they have previously reported?

You trust someone based on what they do, not what they say. Aren't politicians supposed to find out what the electorate want, and then deliver it if elected?

v0n · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:15

But you understand it makes no sense, right? A 180 degree turn to his promises from just 4 years ago, yet you think he's not like other politicians. He's not among ruling circles yet he's already defrauded taxpayers money, used tax escapes and made sure his family members were paid public sponsored salaries and expenses, yet you think he's not like other politicians. Most of the rubbish he utters daily is made up on the spot or taken out of context, but you think he's not like other politicians.

Because you don't trust established parties.

robgmun · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:18

v0n said:
But you understand it makes no sense, right? A 180 degree turn to his promises from just 4 years ago, yet you think he's not like other politicians. He's not among ruling circles yet he's already defrauded taxpayers money, used tax escapes and made sure his family members were paid public sponsored salaries and expenses, yet you think he's not like other politicians. Most of the rubbish he utters daily is made up on the spot or taken out of context, but you think he's not like other politicians.

Because you don't trust established parties.

It's plan to see that you're holding up UKIP to a standards you are not affording the other parties, which is terribly biased of you. There are a billion examples of the other 3 main parties of doing the same thing. 4 years is a an eon in political terms!

deuse · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:19

robgmun said:
I think i'll take it straight from the horses mouth rather 3rd hand information and chinese whispers in a newspapers

Tweeted by Nigel Farage today

Efour · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:24

So it is in fact pandering, vote winning BS "like the other parties" that chop and change every 4 years as well.

So exactly another cut from the same cloth, no fresh breath into the system at all. Just another BS spin merchant.

edit : what von said...

Lagmeister · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:30

robgmun said:
I think i'll take it straight from the horses mouth rather 3rd hand information and chinese whispers in a newspapers

Tweeted by Nigel Farage today

And then I will refer you to back to the link I posted, written today

'In a BBC Radio 4 interview to be broadcast today'

He is saying two different things on the same day, there is no reason you would ever trust a person who said two polar opposites in one day on that subject in real life, why would you trust someone like him to run a country?

As said I trust most political figures about as far as I can throw them and Farage is exactly the same as most.

v0n · 20 Jan 2015 at 16:31

robgmun said:
It's plan to see that you're holding up UKIP to a standards you are not affording the other parties, which is terribly biased of you. There are a billion examples of the other 3 main parties of doing the same thing.

No, I simply objected to the "I'll take it from the horses mouth", the "fact check" and "I trust Farage to stick to his promises more". I'm not judging whether he broke more promises than the rest of the parties and whether that entitles him to some kind of equestrian award, all I point out is that his promises are already broken on the "fact check" meme he's trying to roll out.