Advice pls, approved used car supplied with wrong spec

Soldato
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I can see Fox's point on not being able to easily tell if it has adaptive Xenons but for anyone that has owned a car with Xenons I would have thought it would be easy to check for at least Xenons due to the power on routine where they ignite and then change colour temperature/brightness as they warm up over a couple of seconds.

Still as he has it in writing it should be straight forward getting a refund although I would expect the ML has now gone and the best way forward is for the dealer to locate another X5 with the correct spec and swap at no cost (assuming similar age/mileage) X5s are not exactly rare so shouldn't be that hard for the dealer to find another one.
 
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Man of Honour
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Straight from the manual. If you have to activate it, it must be deactivated to start. Why post stuff, as if gospel, if you don't really know yourself?

Hahaha, it basically says 'turn the lights on'. Well duh. There is no switch for adaptive - they work with the lights. So your claims that you can tell if a car has adaptive lights by looking at the switch are, as I said, wrong.

The entire thread disagrees with you. Doesn't this suggest perhaps your view is out of whack with reality on this?

You are advocating the sort of checks you or I would do are normal and reasonable. They are not - we are obsessively detailed and know the cars more than is healthy. We are not the average buyer and we cannot hold the average buyer to our standards.
 
Soldato
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It says turn it round to auto. There is a manual on in the middle, to keep adaptive off and turn on headlights. But yes, I already submitted that I was wrong in this being a way to tell via some sort of switch, and you were correct in my thinking about auto full beam.

I don't actually agree I'm wrong in my thinking. Never will be. I'm happy to admit the rest of the thread appears to disagree, but I am still firmly of the opinion that the buyer has to take some responsibility for their purchase. Buyer beware and all that. I don't care if it's from Dodgy Micks garage of a BMW dealership, second hand car salesman are notorious. And many are obviously clueless about the specs of their own cars. I've experienced it many times.

I take your point that we shouldn't hold normal car buyers to our standards. However, I do think that if something is of such importance to the buyer that they would reject the car otherwise, then they should educate themselves on how to tell the difference. At least to some degree. And option codes are probably the simplest way of doing this for ALL options.
 

Jez

Jez

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xs2man: Why are you flogging this horse which is so dead that it is now a fossil.

This is very simple. The dealer sold a product with a specification agreed. The product does not meet this, it is incorrect. The buyer should seek a replacement or refund.

Forget that it is a car, it might as well be a TV which actually isnt a Smart TV when it was promised to be, or a fridge which doesnt make ice - whatever, it doesnt matter.
 
Soldato
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Sounds like the bigger issue is the lack of Xenons not the lack of adaptive function anyway? The dealer gesture seems to be an appropriate compensation for lack of adaptice function but not for lack of xenons entirely.

It's just an X5, not the rarest car in the world - surely asking them to source something comparable and swap it wouldnt be unrealistic
 
Soldato
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[...] I am still firmly of the opinion that the buyer has to take some responsibility for their purchase. [...]

I've taken the liberty of highlighting the relevant part of your post.

IMO the buyer took every reasonable action to check the spec. of the vehicle matched their requirements.

If you were buying a custom built PC with an certain spec, would you buy it, expecting to received what you paid for, or would you open it up in the shop and start removing heatsinks etc. to make sure they had put the correct CPU, RAM etc. in?
 
Soldato
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Sounds like the bigger issue is the lack of Xenons not the lack of adaptive function anyway? The dealer gesture seems to be an appropriate compensation for lack of adaptice function but not for lack of xenons entirely.

It's just an X5, not the rarest car in the world - surely asking them to source something comparable and swap it wouldnt be unrealistic

Agreed, I'll report back what they say. It's not a rare car to find another - but for the right spec and value, but they may have already auctioned off his ML...but that's not his problem I suppose - BMW has bigger pockets than my retired old man!
 
Soldato
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And option codes are probably the simplest way of doing this for ALL options.

So simple that most BMW owners wouldn't know what option codes are or how to even find or view them.

A forum of fairly detail-obsessive car enthusiasts disagrees with you. The law disagrees with you. You can continue to blame the buyer but it changes nothing to the outcome so it's all quite futile.
 
Soldato
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For goodness sake. I am not blaming the buyer here, not completely. I have, time and again agreed with the main sentiment in the thread, which is the dealer is mostly at fault here. And time and again, have agreed that it is the dealers responsibility to rectify this particular situation. For the majority of opinion on this thread, I am in agreement. The law doesn't disagree with me, as it is backing the purchaser here, to which I completely agree is appropriate.

My point is that it is not 100% the dealers fault. Probably 95% or so. All I am saying is there HAS to be some responsibility on the customer to ensure what he is buying is what he wants. Not just at the salesmans face value.

The SMART TV / Fridge Freezer / Custom PC arguments are not valid, to my point, in reality. They refer to new goods that, with the exception of the custom PC, are not available with options. You simply select the model that has the features you want. If the appliance doesn't have these features, you have likely been supplied the wrong model, or your appliance is broken.

As for the custom PC, that is different, as it is specced up. I would indeed likely open it up to ensure the parts I paid for are the ones I received. Most parts can be easily seen visually to confirm they are correct parts, and a simply look up of the processor in the OS would confirm that. In the shop? No, because I would be ordering online, except I build my own so...
 
Soldato
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As for the custom PC, that is different, as it is specced up. I would indeed likely open it up to ensure the parts I paid for are the ones I received. Most parts can be easily seen visually to confirm they are correct parts, and a simply look up of the processor in the OS would confirm that. In the shop? No, because I would be ordering online, except I build my own so...

By the time you look up the CPU in the OS, it's too late - you've already bought the PC, so if the PC turned up with a Celeron instead of an i7 it would have been your fault for not checking it properly before buying it?
 
Soldato
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When I was looking at cars I had to photograph the VIN plate in the door and check it when I was back at home.

You can just get the VIN from the numberplate online (can't find the link right now) and they run it through that website that gives you the full factory spec.

That way you can check the spec on the AUC without leaving your PC :cool:

It says turn it round to auto. There is a manual on in the middle, to keep adaptive off and turn on headlights. But yes, I already submitted that I was wrong in this being a way to tell via some sort of switch, and you were correct in my thinking about auto full beam.

You realise that adaptive headlights and auto headlights are not the same, right?
 
Soldato
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My point is that it is not 100% the dealers fault. Probably 95% or so. All I am saying is there HAS to be some responsibility on the customer to ensure what he is buying is what he wants. Not just at the salesmans face value.

So your 5% of blame is attributed to the buyer on the basis that he didn't research BMW option codes and then find them for the vehicle he was buying from a BMW dealer who assured him said vehicle had the feature he wanted?

Harsh.
 
Soldato
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By the time you look up the CPU in the OS, it's too late - you've already bought the PC, so if the PC turned up with a Celeron instead of an i7 it would have been your fault for not checking it properly before buying it?

What part of DSR do you not get? Hence why in my opening post, I specifically mentioned it. Moreover, this is just getting silly now.


You can just get the VIN from the numberplate online (can't find the link right now) and they run it through that website that gives you the full factory spec.

That way you can check the spec on the AUC without leaving your PC :cool:



You realise that adaptive headlights and auto headlights are not the same, right?

Of course. Which is why my post was a DIRECT lift from the MANUAL under the ADAPTIVE HEADLIGHTS section. Feel free to look it up.

So your 5% of blame is attributed to the buyer on the basis that he didn't research BMW option codes and then find them for the vehicle he was buying from a BMW dealer who assured him said vehicle had the feature he wanted?

Harsh.

The 5% apportion is because the buyer bought without fully knowing. Buyer beware. Which is all over the internet, particularly on car forums, most especially when purchasing second hand cars. But apparently not here on OCUK. 5% is minimal blame anyway. 95% dealers fault is plenty.
 
Soldato
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What part of DSR do you not get? Hence why in my opening post, I specifically mentioned it. Moreover, this is just getting silly now.




Of course. Which is why my post was a DIRECT lift from the MANUAL under the ADAPTIVE HEADLIGHTS section. Feel free to look it up.



The 5% apportion is because the buyer bought without fully knowing. Buyer beware. Which is all over the internet, particularly on car forums, most especially when purchasing second hand cars. But apparently not here on OCUK. 5% is minimal blame anyway. 95% dealers fault is plenty.

Buyer beware is normally in reference to private sales, though. Also, I'm still confused as to how you tell that you have adaptive lights from the switch ... (tip: you can't)
 
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Soldato
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The 5% apportion is because the buyer bought without fully knowing. Buyer beware. Which is all over the internet, particularly on car forums, most especially when purchasing second hand cars. But apparently not here on OCUK. 5% is minimal blame anyway. 95% dealers fault is plenty.

Without meaning to fuel the fire, just on this point. My father said buyer beware and budgetted extra to buy AUC from BMW to be safe in his search, plus I'd say 5 confirmations (Verbal, 3 written, then verbal again in the car when test driving) when buying from distance is pretty much solid on the side of being aware and covering it off!
 
Man of Honour
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The 5% apportion is because the buyer bought without fully knowing. Buyer beware. Which is all over the internet, particularly on car forums, most especially when purchasing second hand cars. But apparently not here on OCUK. 5% is minimal blame anyway. 95% dealers fault is plenty.

Caveat Emptor, or 'Buyer Beware' has specific meaning and it doesn't mean what you think it does. It means that the buyer assumes the risk in the purchase and that the item is sold as-is - this is NOT the case for a purchase from a main dealer. Caveat Emptor does not apply to consumer to business transactions.

The reason you hear it lots on car forums is two-fold:

a) Lots of people buy privately, where it's absolutely a thing
b) Lots of people parrot terms they don't understand.
 
Soldato
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Without meaning to fuel the fire, just on this point. My father said buyer beware and budgetted extra to buy AUC from BMW to be safe in his search, plus I'd say 5 confirmations (Verbal, 3 written, then verbal again in the car when test driving) when buying from distance is pretty much solid on the side of being aware and covering it off!

Sorry Booner, five internet blame points for your Dad, regardless of how utterly wrong and inconsequential they are.
 
Soldato
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The car was delivered with items missing that were agreed as part of the sale.

It's pretty simple, The dealer either fits these items if the buyer agrees, Refunds the car in full with any costs incurred by the buyer, Offers a partial refund agreeable by the buyer or comes to an agreement on swapping the car for another with the correct specification.

No idea why this has become so complicated tbh....
 
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