PlayStation 4 Pro in-bound

[Minstadave]

Consoles normally have hardware respins through their life (360 had several) so it wouldn't be a huge cost to add some GPU grunt with a die shrink, especially with the APU design.

I think the Apple analogy is spot on, add a midlife respin with some extra performance but keeping compatibility with the older version.

I'd by the new console (have skipped this gen so far) - need a 4K blu-ray player and always felt this gen were underpowered from the off. Quite happy with 60fps 1080P though.

 

[TheVoice]

We shall see. I predict it'll sell not far off PS4 launch numbers. The kind of people that buy a new generation at launch when there are zero games are *exactly* the kind of people that'll be all over an enhanced version.

People were ready, waiting and hyped for the PS4 when it was launched; the excitement around a slightly-faster edition of the console millions of people already own is going to be minuscule in comparison. If it launches at a similar time to PSVR, they're going to end up cannibalising sales of each other because very few people are going to buy both at once.

 

[1ofaKind]

If it doesn't offer exclusive titles and is literally a high res mode on normal games I won't bother unless my ps4 goes bang. I wonder if they will retire the original ps4 for sale or maybe drop the price down a load and put the new one in the same price point. I have had a sneaking suspicion that you would need the upgraded ps4 for vr but I doubt people would be happy now especially with Pre-orders of vr.

 

[Raymond Lin]

If it doesn't offer exclusive titles and is literally a high res mode on normal games I won't bother unless my ps4 goes bang. I wonder if they will retire the original ps4 for sale or maybe drop the price down a load and put the new one in the same price point. I have had a sneaking suspicion that you would need the upgraded ps4 for vr but I doubt people would be happy now especially with Pre-orders of vr.

There is no way they will split the user base. It would be suicidal for the new console, it will not sell many and developers will not make games for it because the games on it just won't make their money back because there won't be enough people to take advantage of it.

As opposed to continue to make games for the PS4, 25 million or something users and rising and have that on tap, add in a high res feature for the 5% or something that can take advantage of it.

 

[BuffetSlayer]

As opposed to continue to make games for the PS4, 25 million or something users and rising and have that on tap, add in a high res feature for the 5% or something that can take advantage of it.

How difficult / time consuming will it be for devs to do that with all of their releases? Genuine question because my understanding is that changing to hi-res textures throughout a game isnt just simply a toggle switch. And upscaling 1080p to higher res is selling people short surely?

It strikes me that it seems a lot of hassle for the devs to create high res texture packs for entire games for only 5% of the user base. I admit I don't know that much about how it all works so I am happy to stand corrected.

 

[Plainsong]

I read some comments from one of the BioWare bosses the other day who said that it would be an absolute pain in the arse to have tiered versions.

 

[mid_gen]

How difficult / time consuming will it be for devs to do that with all of their releases? Genuine question because my understanding is that changing to hi-res textures throughout a game isnt just simply a toggle switch. And upscaling 1080p to higher res is selling people short surely?

It strikes me that it seems a lot of hassle for the devs to create high res texture packs for entire games for only 5% of the user base. I admit I don't know that much about how it all works so I am happy to stand corrected.

When targeting multiple platforms you usually just create all the assets at a higher quality, and downsample them as part of your content pipeline as appropriate, same as you do for generating LODs, pretty standard stuff.

Anyway, the 4.5 doesn't have any more memory, it just has more GPU grunt, so assets will probably remain exactly the same, they'll just be able to up rendering resolution and framerates, and add more complex shaders and effects.

 

[FrankJH]

People were ready, waiting and hyped for the PS4 when it was launched; the excitement around a slightly-faster edition of the console millions of people already own is going to be minuscule in comparison. If it launches at a similar time to PSVR, they're going to end up cannibalising sales of each other because very few people are going to buy both at once.

You are missing the point though (imo anyway) - ps4 is STILL selling well, and will probably continue to do so, so instead of it being a PS4 at the top of the list (for the same price) its a PS4.5

Sony then has a decent games machine more capable of VR going forward, and better 2D graphics for the same price
They also have a 4k BR player (from the people who developed BR in the first place, looks a bit strange not to have this).

Giving your customers a choice rarely hurt anyone - they may even generate more sales from those who bought near to release day and are looking for a 2nd device for whatever reason.

Apart from the 4k BR drive, its not going to cost them very much at all as it doesnt really need extra /redesign of packaging (although they may do this from a differentiation point of view)

The APU shrink may cost a bit to start with, but could well save them in the long run.

From Sony's point of view its a win-win situation

All games will work on both systems just with / without extra bells and whistles

 

[BuffetSlayer]

When targeting multiple platforms you usually just create all the assets at a higher quality, and downsample them as part of your content pipeline as appropriate, same as you do for generating LODs, pretty standard stuff.

Anyway, the 4.5 doesn't have any more memory, it just has more GPU grunt, so assets will probably remain exactly the same, they'll just be able to up rendering resolution and framerates, and add more complex shaders and effects.

OK, thanks for the insight. I guess if it won't be too much hassle for devs then it might fly. Still seems like a catch 22 though. If they make it loads better than the standard PS4 it splits the user base and upsets a lot of PS4 users. If they make it only slightly better it will be hard to market as the added benefits are not worth shelling out for in, dare I say it, the majority of users eyes.

That said, if they could release a version that will happily do solid 60FPS @ 1080P on all games then I might buy it. But then as I remarked in an earlier post I think devs would stay at 30FPS and add more eye candy

But I suppose eye candy sells games and that is what devs/pubs are there to do!

 

[Woden]

I read some comments from one of the BioWare bosses the other day who said that it would be an absolute pain in the arse to have tiered versions.

It's already done on PC though. I can load up BioShock on steam and choose from a dozen resolutions. Depending on how Sony do this, it could simply be running at a higher res.

 

[Raymond Lin]

It's already done on PC though. I can load up BioShock on steam and choose from a dozen resolutions. Depending on how Sony do this, it could simply be running at a higher res.

Sony will just have 2 tier, as opposed to a million combination on the PC. Sure it will be a pain compare to now, but it is not reinventing the wheel.

 

[TheVoice]

You are missing the point though (imo anyway) - ps4 is STILL selling well, and will probably continue to do so, so instead of it being a PS4 at the top of the list (for the same price) its a PS4.5

Sony then has a decent games machine more capable of VR going forward, and better 2D graphics for the same price
They also have a 4k BR player (from the people who developed BR in the first place, looks a bit strange not to have this).

Giving your customers a choice rarely hurt anyone - they may even generate more sales from those who bought near to release day and are looking for a 2nd device for whatever reason.

Apart from the 4k BR drive, its not going to cost them very much at all as it doesnt really need extra /redesign of packaging (although they may do this from a differentiation point of view)

The APU shrink may cost a bit to start with, but could well save them in the long run.

From Sony's point of view its a win-win situation

All games will work on both systems just with / without extra bells and whistles

I'm not missing the point, you're just too focused on the tech of it. It's going to create a lot of confusion and animosity with consumers who are now faced with multiple versions of the same thing. I worked in retail for a bit after uni, and it was hard enough at times explaining the difference between a 12GB PS3 and a 500GB one. Somehow Sony has to be able to justify why the newer PS4 is more expensive when their own expectations of what developers do with the additional power are vague. There's going to be very little that they can actually promise the newer model will deliver because it's all up to what the developers decide or bother with.

 

[Minstadave]

Sony will just have 2 tier, as opposed to a million combination on the PC. Sure it will be a pain compare to now, but it is not reinventing the wheel.

May not even need two tiers, just use the dynamic resolution system some games are using and let it sort out the res, the newer system will just downscale less.

 

[Raymond Lin]

May not even need two tiers, just use the dynamic resolution system some games are using and let it sort out the res, the newer system will just downscale less.

Agreed. It's could be as simple as a tweak to the engine, might lead to some problems but not a long term problem once that variable is added to the base code.

 

[AtreuS]

I know a games dev who works with sony and they are being told that ANY ps4 game will be required to fully work on the normal ps4, with the neo being able to provide better FPS,resolution or graphics enhancements such as you would find on a pc game. No "exclusive" neo content or neo "only".

He said this is cast in stone and is a requirement of publishing on the playstation platform.

So seems that they are keeping a tight control on things.

 

[redrooster303]

Thing is though, won't multiplayer titles running at 2 different resolutions and Frames Per Second split the user base. What I mean is, the people with a clearer picture/res and a faster smoother running game have an advantage in games like COD and Battlefield where every millisecond counts.

Latency is an issue on a lot of games.

Personally I can't wait for a PS4.5, anything that gets games nearer to PC levels.

 

[Dano]

Thing is though, won't multiplayer titles running at 2 different resolutions and Frames Per Second split the user base. What I mean is, the people with a clearer picture/res and a faster smoother running game have an advantage in games like COD and Battlefield where every millisecond counts.

No different to how PC multiplayer games are.

 

[mid_gen]

Thing is though, won't multiplayer titles running at 2 different resolutions and Frames Per Second split the user base. What I mean is, the people with a clearer picture/res and a faster smoother running game have an advantage in games like COD and Battlefield where every millisecond counts.

Latency is an issue on a lot of games.

Personally I can't wait for a PS4.5, anything that gets games nearer to PC levels.

Really not an issue for the vast majority of people that wouldn't even notice the difference. If you're the sort of person that cares, well, better get the right gear if you want to play at that high a level.

 

[the_jetsetwilly]

Bloodborne @60fps, From software make a patch,Sony take my money

 

[Craterloads]

Is it possible this is a AMD led initiative?

Sony and Microsoft were probably looking at 14nm for their current consoles roughly halving the die space / silicon with the shrink and paying less for it.

AMD staring at a reduction in revenue say hay look for the same price / die space we can offer you triple the performance at the same cost?