Soldato
By that logic every politician just ends up blaming every politician that there has ever been for every problem. He's blaming the Tories because they're in Government right now, and able to change things.
The next Labour leader thread
- Thread starter Ricochet J
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By that logic every politician just ends up blaming every politician that there has ever been for every problem. He's blaming the Tories because they're in Government right now, and able to change things.
Soldato
As opposed to the remain campaign on the basis of lies & fearmongering sound bites.
I suspect that he is only going to take over the leadership if he thinks he stands a chance at being PM.
I doubt he will replace Corbin, better to sit it out for a bit longer and increase his profile.
If the tories really mess up over Europe things might change.
Soldato
Corbyn isn't going anywhere. Even members critical of him have said this is a terrible time to attempt to get rid of him as it just solidifies the narrative that the brexit vote was our fault. When in reality, we ran a solid campaign, we just didn't get the airtime and in reality, 63% of labour supporters voted the way we were campaigning for, compared to was it 38% for the tories?
Soldato
The argument is about if party members followed the line but whether the traditional voter base did (it didn't).
The failure of Labour to win over it's own base rests largely with Corbyn but the seeds of this disconnection was sowed by the likes of Blair and Brown and made worse when Milliband changed the rules of Labour membership.
Soldato
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According to the new rules for leadership elections, Corbyn stays until he either resigns or the members/affiliates kick him out. Though he might receive no confidence motions, threats and sharp critique throughout his tenure. Indeed, this in part is what's pushing reasonably capable MPs like Sadiq Khan and Burham to move for mayoral positions. It's a good way to wait out the current soul searching era within Labour. The longer Corbyn vacillates in his bubble, the more of them depart the shadow cabinet and the backbench, going forward, imho.
Doesn't mean it's a good thing.
Comrade Corbyn has several problems:
1) A London socialist, from an era before this meant Blairite, but one nonetheless; and that will struggle to win lost voters in the North.
2) Hates the media, at times justly, at times to the point of tinfoil paranoia; the media hates him back.
3) Divides the party and their strategy.
4) Warm, approachable and kind, but has so few policies to set him apart from Ed max rhetoric, it's not funny. Some stuff like the electoral reform can get off the ground. More local power and spending is always popular (but not enough in itself). His 'new economics' are in bad need of fleshing out.
5) A total turnoff for wavering Tory voters Blair could win, who will be becoming more and more important as we further diverge from Scotland or separate from them.
6) His idea of campaigning is to talk inwards, even though he could probably do what Sadiq did in London more often and with good enough results, pending some practical improvement to the other points above.
7) Not a great opposition leader or Commons performer. His new politics is only workable if either the Speaker or the other team play along.
8) Shutdowns under hostile questioning and conditions, looking always for external factors to explain the hostility.
I can go on, and the fact that my mental list is far longer than the equivalent would be for Blair, Brown, Balls, and the like, is telling and I'm not even a close follower of Labour politics. What a supporter outside Momentum must be feeling like? I don't know, but they can't be all happy bunnies.
So, candidates aren't obvious: Burham, Khan, Blue Labour Woman, Benn and a crop of people that backed away from running last time, like Chuka. Will be easier to tell after the next general election.
Doesn't mean it's a good thing.
Comrade Corbyn has several problems:
1) A London socialist, from an era before this meant Blairite, but one nonetheless; and that will struggle to win lost voters in the North.
2) Hates the media, at times justly, at times to the point of tinfoil paranoia; the media hates him back.
3) Divides the party and their strategy.
4) Warm, approachable and kind, but has so few policies to set him apart from Ed max rhetoric, it's not funny. Some stuff like the electoral reform can get off the ground. More local power and spending is always popular (but not enough in itself). His 'new economics' are in bad need of fleshing out.
5) A total turnoff for wavering Tory voters Blair could win, who will be becoming more and more important as we further diverge from Scotland or separate from them.
6) His idea of campaigning is to talk inwards, even though he could probably do what Sadiq did in London more often and with good enough results, pending some practical improvement to the other points above.
7) Not a great opposition leader or Commons performer. His new politics is only workable if either the Speaker or the other team play along.
8) Shutdowns under hostile questioning and conditions, looking always for external factors to explain the hostility.
I can go on, and the fact that my mental list is far longer than the equivalent would be for Blair, Brown, Balls, and the like, is telling and I'm not even a close follower of Labour politics. What a supporter outside Momentum must be feeling like? I don't know, but they can't be all happy bunnies.
So, candidates aren't obvious: Burham, Khan, Blue Labour Woman, Benn and a crop of people that backed away from running last time, like Chuka. Will be easier to tell after the next general election.
Top down politics; it's the leader's fault for not getting voters to tow the party line, rather than the party's fault for supporting the wrong side.
I voted Remain, and I'm not a Labour supporter. But it isn't hard to see why the party is losing voters to the SNP, losing voters to UKIP, and losing voters to apathy. They've lost touch with people (outside of London).
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Soldato
Corbyn - Anyone who supports this IRA sympathiser should be ashamed.
Deleted member 66701
D
Deleted member 66701
Even if the PLP force another leadership contest, the membership would just vote Corbyn back in anyway.
I'm not ashamed.
Keeping communication lines open != IRA sympathiser.
But this discussion has been had before, your statement was debunked then and it's now sounding like a broken record.
I'm not ashamed.
Keeping communication lines open != IRA sympathiser.
But this discussion has been had before, your statement was debunked then and it's now sounding like a broken record.
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He's done very little and I have no idea what he stands for. But then, that's kinda the point. He's a fresh face with an interesting back story, and Labour desperately need a fresh start; someone who isn't a reminder of the Blair/Brown era, or a callback to Labour's socialist past. Jarvis is one of a number of people who fit the bill, but his army past separates him from the (currently unpopular) political class. People distrust 'career' politicians. Having someone in charge who isn't seen as such would be a boon.
Soldato
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He is useless.
Labour needs a David milliband yes. Or a tony Blair like character , minus the Iraq war. I mean, look what ed milliband did last year. Corbyn will be worse, especially that (to most people) boris Johnson is more popular than cameron. It's going to be boris for Tory, but would prefer ozzy!
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Soldato
Or maybe that nice assad chap, minus the syrian war?
Caporegime
He's not been in parliament that long, really. Only five years and with his wife's cancer he's had more important things to do than push his public profile.
He's fairly firmly on the right of the party. I can't see him winning a leadership right now even if he was to stand (and I don't think he will given his reason for not running last time). However, I think if the Tories win the next election there will be an appetite to get someone seen as "electable" in and he could be a good unity candidate for a coronation by the PLP over the wishes of the Labour membership.
Hilary Benn has been sacked by Corbyn from the shadow cabinet. Rumours that Benn was going to ask him to step down and push for a vote of no confidence. Could be turmoil in that party in the next few days. Been quite clear from day one for me Corbyn wasn't the right man to take the party forward. I think there might be a strong push to get him out but with Union support very strong won't be easy. With there being so much anger with the leave vote this is the perfect chance for the Labour party to bounce back. They should have been leading the campaign to stay in but you got the impression they were just sitting on the fence.
Soldato
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Labour were more useful on the ground than on set events and media appearances, with Gordon Brown putting in another decent performance towards the end, but in places people listened, clapped and did something else. I guess we are at least heading for a shadow cabinet reshuffle.
Soldato
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It's a shame Hilary Benn was unsuccessful in my opinion. He was the only one who I thought could lead the party in a better direction.
Soldato
Hillary got what was coming, he is out of touch if he thinks for a second that there is an appetite for a coup among the wider membership at this time. It's doomed to failure even if they manage to pass a vote of no confidence, because Corbyn still has the overwhelming support of the members. Trying to overthrow him now just cements the media narrative that brexit was our fault, when in reality Labour supporters voted remain 2:1.
Soldato
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Does he have the support from the membership though? A lot of people were saying he wasn't connecting enough when he was campaigning to remain in the EU.
Soldato
I don't doubt it for a second. I've talked to lots of members who are usually very quick to criticise Corbyn who've said that a coup at this time is an absolutely terrible idea. I don't know what bubble he's living in that led him to belive this was a good thing to try.
Labour's campaign might not have got the media coverage it needed, but it was making all the right arguments, and Corbyn was finally starting to outline a position on immigration that the whole party can get behind, and that doesn't require us skirting around the issue. Hardly anyone in the party blames Corbyn for this.
Labour's campaign might not have got the media coverage it needed, but it was making all the right arguments, and Corbyn was finally starting to outline a position on immigration that the whole party can get behind, and that doesn't require us skirting around the issue. Hardly anyone in the party blames Corbyn for this.