Alfie Evans...

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It's getting ridiculous now

This evening Alfie's father told reporters outside the hospital that his mother 'was giving him mouth-to-mouth resuscitation to keep him alive' after his lips began to turn blue.

They're keeping him alive for themselves.
 
Soldato
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The dad wants that sweet sweet TV money.

I think that's uncalled for. It's obvious from the court documents that he's trying his best and genuinely believes he can save his son. In denial? Probably but it's part of the grieving process. That hope is flamed by him misreading signs of brain activity in the form of fits.
 
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I think that's uncalled for. It's obvious from the court documents that he's trying his best and genuinely believes he can save his son. In denial? Probably but it's part of the grieving process. That hope is flamed by him misreading signs of brain activity in the form of fits.

From the sounds of it I think the person who is the most in the wrong is the one giving him legal advice and thats just wrong. Getting the parents hopes up so that you may one day get a big pay day out of all of this
 
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I think that's uncalled for. It's obvious from the court documents that he's trying his best and genuinely believes he can save his son. In denial? Probably but it's part of the grieving process. That hope is flamed by him misreading signs of brain activity in the form of fits.

It's not a great situation but he is hardly helping matters, leaking the names of medical staff who are looking after the kid to allow 'alfies army' to start abusing them.
 

Pez

Pez

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It's getting ridiculous now



They're keeping him alive for themselves.

That's not ridiculous, that's heartbreaking.

I'm not saying that I agree with Alfie's parents entirely, but can you even remotely imagine your child dying in front of your eyes, sanctioned by the state, and NOT try to help?

Jesus.
 
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That's not ridiculous, that's heartbreaking.

I'm not saying that I agree with Alfie's parents entirely, but can you even remotely imagine your child dying in front of your eyes, sanctioned by the state, and NOT try to help?

Jesus.

Well if they were in that position then yes. Similarly with anyone who can't be helped further. You'll have the same situation with plenty of people at the end of their life, at some point nothing more can be done and the medical team move them to a hospice and try to ensure they're comfortable.
 

Pez

Pez

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Well if they were in that position then yes. Similarly with anyone who can't be helped further. You'll have the same situation with plenty of people at the end of their life, at some point nothing more can be done and the medical team move them to a hospice and try to ensure they're comfortable.

Oh I accept some similaritys, but this is a) backed by the state (most EOL care is accepted by the patient/family, not enforced) and b) The fact that it's a child makes it 10x harder.

Again, I'm not saying it's right, but I'm pretty sure I'd be catatonic in this situation... I'd go as far as saying that I'd likely need restraining for my own good :(
 
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That's not ridiculous, that's heartbreaking.

I'm not saying that I agree with Alfie's parents entirely, but can you even remotely imagine your child dying in front of your eyes, sanctioned by the state, and NOT try to help?

Jesus.

Agreed, its not right but these are parents desperate for their child survive.

So sad.
 
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doctors/NHS in this country are very callous - something happened to my Grandmother and as soon as it happened they tried to say she is end of life and wont survive past couple of weeks & even stopped feeding her despite our wishes.. but we insisted and she lived another year, might have lived longer had they taken care of her, she had a tube through her nose and i think something went down the wrong way (I am not sure)..
 
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doctors/NHS in this country are very callous - something happened to my Grandmother and as soon as it happened they tried to say she is end of life and wont survive past couple of weeks & even stopped feeding her despite our wishes.. but we insisted and she lived another year, might have lived longer had they taken care of her, she had a tube through her nose and i think something went down the wrong way (I am not sure)..

This is rather different to that. Alfie is brain dead and is not going to magically recover from that.
 
Caporegime
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They should just get the parents to sign a document stating they are going against advice of the hospital and will take responsiblity for whatever happens and then let then assist in whatever direction they want to go in (ie. hospital transfer), holding the kiddie hostage and wasting time in court when time is usually of the essence is too dictatorial/nanny state for me, not to mention a massive waste of NHS money/resources.
 
Soldato
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They should just get the parents to sign a document stating they are going against advice of the hospital and will take responsiblity for whatever happens and then let then assist in whatever direction they want to go in (ie. hospital transfer), holding the kiddie hostage and wasting time in court when time is usually of the essence is too dictatorial/nanny state for me, not to mention a massive waste of NHS money/resources.

But you're putting parental wishes above the needs of the child there. That's like saying parents should be able to do what they like with their kids regardless of any laws, because parents know best.
 
Caporegime
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The patient is not the property of the parents, they don't get to cause further suffering and it be OK because they signed a piece of paper.
 
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doctors/NHS in this country are very callous - something happened to my Grandmother and as soon as it happened they tried to say she is end of life and wont survive past couple of weeks & even stopped feeding her despite our wishes.. but we insisted and she lived another year, might have lived longer had they taken care of her, she had a tube through her nose and i think something went down the wrong way (I am not sure)..

A sweeping generalisation and complete unfair. It’s extremely hard to make decisions nearing the end of life. Your wishes are entirely secondary to the patients wishes. As in this case keeping people alive isn’t always doing the right thing.

The amount of effort, stress, flack and upset that we take on as Doctors is vast, especially in the case of dying children. The fact that people still turn up to work day after day in this case is a miracle. I’ve seen many colleagues break over the years. You also forget that only through the efforts of the intensive care team has Alfie lived this long. It’s not callousness that is driving Alder Hey to fight the parents to allow Alfie to die. It’s caring.
 
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