Homophobic attack on two women on London bus.

Soldato
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Just because gay people were the victims doesn't mean it was homophobic.

Correct,

However it is homophobic if the motive for the the attack, is that the victims were homosexual.

Which according to the reports (which I can’t verify) seems to be what happened.

They didn’t attack randomly, they didn’t just pick anyone, they purposefully singled out a gay couple, verbally abused them then beat them.

Which makes it a homophobic attack, if the reports are correct.
 
Caporegime
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Correct,

However it is homophobic if the motive for the the attack, is that the victims were homosexual.

Which according to the reports (which I can’t verify) seems to be what happened.

They didn’t attack randomly, they didn’t just pick anyone, they purposefully singled out a gay couple, verbally abused them then beat them.

Which makes it a homophobic attack, if the reports are correct.

I don't think they picked them out rather than they just happened to be there. Wrong place at the wrong time. Chances are they wanted to wind them up. When they didn't play along they then attacked them. It's likely one of them didn't help the situation by saying something back and they didn't like it and it then escalated from there.

Scrotes will target you and use anything against you. If it was a Jewish couple that got attacked and they told him to eat some bacon, etc. I wouldn't call it a anti-semetic attack. They just used what they knew against them on a whim.

I don't believe this gang went out looking for a gay couple to attack. They probably saw 2 women who were a couple and then wanted to get their jollies off on making them kiss, then touch each other, etc. When they got some chat back they then started on them is how this likely panned out.
 
Soldato
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It seems much more likely that they were just scumbags who were out to cause trouble and a lesbian couple was just an easy target for them
An easy target, because they were gay. That almost the very definition of a homophobic attach or hate crime. Duh.

@Scam I'd love to live in the world you do where people never make things up out of vengeance or spite and never exaggerate the details of something. Especially not when they've gone running to the media.
And I'd hate to live in a world full of victim-blaming, and not having the decency to believe two innocent women that were beaten up by a gang on a night bus, until proven otherwise. Seriously... :rolleyes:

Just because gay people were the victims doesn't mean it was homophobic.
Correct. But picking on them because of it is the very definition of a homophobic attack. God, it's like talking to a brick wall.

How would one ascertain the sexuality of 2 women sat next to each other on a bus?
They were kissing each other.

Scrotes will target you and use anything against you. If it was a Jewish couple that got attacked and they told him to eat some bacon, etc. I wouldn't call it a anti-semetic attack.
You wouldn't. But the law would.

I don't believe this gang went out looking for a gay couple to attack. They probably saw 2 women who were a couple and then wanted to get their jollies off on making them kiss, then touch each other, etc. When they got some chat back they then started on them is how this likely panned out.
That's nice for you. And the gang. I'm sure they appreciate you giving them the benefit of the doubt, rather than the two women who are prepared to go in the newspapers, attract more attention, possibly revenge, risking more attacks etc. to say otherwise - and that they were picked on because they were kissing. And as above, it doesn't matter how the altercation started, you might even be right. But if they were using homophobic language whilst attacking them etc, that is a homophobic attack. Why is that so hard to comprehend?
 
Soldato
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I don't think they picked them out rather than they just happened to be there. Wrong place at the wrong time. Chances are they wanted to wind them up. When they didn't play along they then attacked them. It's likely one of them didn't help the situation by saying something back and they didn't like it and it then escalated from there.

Scrotes will target you and use anything against you. If it was a Jewish couple that got attacked and they told him to eat some bacon, etc. I wouldn't call it a anti-semetic attack. They just used what they knew against them on a whim.

I don't believe this gang went out looking for a gay couple to attack. They probably saw 2 women who were a couple and then wanted to get their jollies off on making them kiss, then touch each other, etc. When they got some chat back they then started on them is how this likely panned out.

Take this as you will, but the article suggested that the lads on the bus "discovered" they were a couple...that's picking them out right?
 
Soldato
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I don't think they picked them out rather than they just happened to be there. Wrong place at the wrong time. Chances are they wanted to wind them up. When they didn't play along they then attacked them. It's likely one of them didn't help the situation by saying something back and they didn't like it and it then escalated from there.

Scrotes will target you and use anything against you. If it was a Jewish couple that got attacked and they told him to eat some bacon, etc. I wouldn't call it a anti-semetic attack. They just used what they knew against them on a whim.

I don't believe this gang went out looking for a gay couple to attack. They probably saw 2 women who were a couple and then wanted to get their jollies off on making them kiss, then touch each other, etc. When they got some chat back they then started on them is how this likely panned out.

This is insane thinking.

You're literally saying that because they would have abused people based on any difference to themselves, be that race, religion, sexuality, sex, etc then it's not a racist, bigoted, homophobic or mysogynistic attack.

As is proven from these forums people can be all those things and some people in the general populace will take things further than frothing on the internet and physically attack anybody different to themselves.

A serial killer who targeted white people would be both a racist and a serial killer.

I can well imagine these kids are both serial troublemakers and bigots.

People talk about how scared they feel walking around London, not something I've experienced but there you go, imagine how you'd feel if you knew people would target you more than the average person due to nothing you can do or control?
 
Caporegime
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This is insane thinking.

You're literally saying that because they would have abused people based on any difference to themselves, be that race, religion, sexuality, sex, etc then it's not a racist, bigoted, homophobic or mysogynistic attack.

As is proven from these forums people can be all those things and some people in the general populace will take things further than frothing on the internet and physically attack anybody different to themselves.

A serial killer who targeted white people would be both a racist and a serial killer.

I can well imagine these kids are both serial troublemakers and bigots.

People talk about how scared they feel walking around London, not something I've experienced but there you go, imagine how you'd feel if you knew people would target you more than the average person due to nothing you can do or control?

Your missing the point. Especially when you say a serial killer who targeted white people. i'm saying this gang will target anyone not just lesbians. it just happened to be lesbians on that day.

it's likely this gang has attacked hundreds of people of all types and colours. this time around it just happened to be a lesbian couple.

next week they attack 2 black people are they now racist and homophobic? even though it's highly likely they themselves are black?

therefore it's not a true homophobic attack in my eyes. unless it can be proven that out of all the people they have attacked they on the majority were gay.
 
Soldato
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There's four paragraphs there and four really big assumptions. Aren't you finding it hard work to twist this into your own agenda? lol..
 
Soldato
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Your missing the point. Especially when you say a serial killer who targeted white people. i'm saying this gang will target anyone not just lesbians. it just happened to be lesbians on that day.

it's likely this gang has attacked hundreds of people of all types and colours. this time around it just happened to be a lesbian couple.

next week they attack 2 black people are they now racist and homophobic? even though it's highly likely they themselves are black?

therefore it's not a true homophobic attack in my eyes. unless it can be proven that out of all the people they have attacked they on the majority were gay.

YOU'RE missing the point, or being deliberately obtuse.

Yes, as I said people can be all those things I mentioned, and IME if they're one then they tend to be more than one of those things as their mindset is simply intolerance.

Also, the fact that their are black on black, gay on gay or woman or woman offences doesn't then mean that any attack can't be predominantly instigated because of that intolerance to people being different.
 
Soldato
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Jesus, Walthamstow has always been a horrible dump. I actively refused to go there in the 90's when i was a teenager. Literary anywhere else in east London would have been better

Meh, I've lived in Walthamstow the past three years and it's not really that bad, no worse than anywhere else in East London.
 
Soldato
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An easy target, because they were gay. That almost the very definition of a homophobic attach or hate crime. Duh.
Correct, I was replying to a post that was suggesting that they went out purposely to find and attack a gay couple, where as I say it is more likely a completely random attack. They didn't decide to go and beat up a gay couple, they were going to attack anybody. They happened to come across a gay couple which caught their attention and then became a target.
 
Caporegime
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Correct, I was replying to a post that was suggesting that they went out purposely to find and attack a gay couple, where as I say it is more likely a completely random attack. They didn't decide to go and beat up a gay couple, they were going to attack anybody. They happened to come across a gay couple which caught their attention and then became a target.

That is what I believe happened too.

Wrong place wrong time as opposed to them going out with the intent to look for a gay couple.

If they went out with the intention then that is a true homophobic attack. Rather than them being the ones in the firing line that day just by bad luck.

No doubt the scrotes will end up stabbed soon enough. When they pick on the wrong person.
 
Soldato
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Correct, I was replying to a post that was suggesting that they went out purposely to find and attack a gay couple, where as I say it is more likely a completely random attack. They didn't decide to go and beat up a gay couple, they were going to attack anybody. They happened to come across a gay couple which caught their attention and then became a target.
You're contradicting yourself though. It's not a random attack if somebody is picked on for a reason. It might be because they had ginger hair, it might be because they're fat. However, it was because they were gay and that means it's a homophobic attack. End of story. Otherwise anyone could go out with the premeditated intention of attack a gay person, then when interviewed by the police just say "oh they just happened to be there at the wrong time". Your argument is so flawed in the eyes of the law.

By the way, I agree that clearly the attackers were going out to cause trouble regardless of who they found, these people always do. But to spout homophobic abuse at people whilst beating them up, makes you a homophobe. If their victims "happened to be black" and they were racially abusing them whilst beating them up, we wouldn't be having this argument would we. Attackers were racist, end of story. No GD thread, no GD nonsense.
 
Soldato
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Surprising youths would have initially planned violence, even robbery, given there was CCTV. (seems your cctv data available under gdpr, public access request)

the victim had claimed she had been verbally agressed in previous incidents too, so there can be a retributory motive in making salacious claims by social media for this incident,
her claims had ackowledged ommisions 'before I knew it ..' - why not provide the whole account, verbatum to social media, if she want to promote justice on there.

Until I re-read it the BBC article versus most others, did, iterate it was their words, so not proven
"Two women say they were subjected to a homophobic attack and left covered in blood after refusing to kiss on a bus."
 
Caporegime
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It's old news now. Who cares really? There's probably been 30 more stabbings, muggings, fights on busses and trains.

There will be a hushing down of it depending on the race and religious views of the kids involved, end of story. Plus them being kids it will go basically unpunished anyway. Maybe one of them will get stabbed one day? We can only hope... CONTROVERSIAL.....

New week now, new scare stories to be had.
 
Soldato
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I think a hate crime is automatically assumed if they are a protected group.

I would say they most likely was picked on because they were women and an easy target. The added fact they were lesbians was probably a bonus for the attackers i.e. not men around. If they hadnt asked them to kiss then they could have denied the homophobia hate crime part of this. The last person I remember facing a hate crime charge, 7 years was added to the potential sentance. I'm not sure how many years are added on these days. But its serious stuff if convicted.

I think the case is being heard in July.
 
Caporegime
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Well being targeted because of being a woman is a hate crime...

Either way it's up to the prosecution to prove it, not much else to discuss.
 
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