What is the legaility of rebuidling a 'scrapped' car?

[pitkin]

Back in 1987 I acquired a MK1 2 door 1300GT Ford Escort. I never actually used it on the road, so never taxed it. I just learned to drive in it it around my grandparents smallholding. A few year later I stripped it for parts for a kit car. My cousin had most of the interior so there was little left. Back in 2002 it had became not much more than a pile of rust, so I called up a local scrappy to take it away. I gave him the logbook and he said he'd deal with scrapping it through the DVLA.

Just recently, I've had a hankering for a MK1 Escort. Out of curiosity, I checked out my old reg number on the DVLA website and found out it wasn't scrapped and was just listed as untaxed. The last logbook issue date was when I acquired it back in 1987.

I'm wondering, as the car certainly doesn't exist any more, but appears to be still registered to me, could I apply for a logbook replacement, buy a bodyshell and build myself an Escort MK1 using my original Escort documentation?

Or alternatively could I get the logbook and sell it to someone that wants a period correct registration for their own 2 door Escort project?

Would there be any legal issues that could get me into trouble, such as never having taxed, MOT'd or SORN'd it? I don't think I needed to SORN it as it was never taxed prior to SORN coming in, ans was only ever kept off road, but I'm not sure.

Anyway, sorry for the ramble, hope someone can offer some insight into it.

 

[-westy-]

So you want to get a log book, then use it for a different car..?

 

[Joe T]

Highly dodgy!

 

[MikeTheNative]

Isn't that just cloning a car?

 

[Phil99]

Isn't the chassis number (VIN) on the V5C?

https://www.gov.uk/vehicle-registration/vehicle-identification-number

When you may need a new VIN or registration
If you have a kit car, rebuild, or radically altered vehicle, DVLA will usually have to assess it.

You may be able to keep its original registration number if you can prove the vehicle’s original VIN. If you cannot, you’ll have to apply for a replacement identity number.

DVLA will give you an authorisation letter to get the vehicle stamped with the new VIN if your vehicle passes its assessment.

You then need to register the vehicle - you can only do this when DVLA receives confirmation it’s been stamped with the correct VIN.

 

[pitkin]

So you want to get a log book, then use it for a different car..?

I want to get MY logbook for MY car and rebuild it. I do still have the kit car, so I could transfer the parts I used from the Escort to build that, onto a "replacement" Escort bodyshell. Some of the car would be original. I also have the rear window, the rear axle and parts of the dash from the original in a shed somewhere.

Isn't that just cloning a car?

I don't know. Surely the original would still have to exist to be a clone? The only person that would have any part of the original car is me. It really was just an empty, rusting bodyshell when it got taken away and that was before he picked it up with a claw.

I'm thinking of it as a restoration. I've seen "restorations" where pretty much the whole car is replaced with new parts, including the bodyshell and most other major parts. Couldn't I just say I've stripped all the useful parts from the original and disposed of the rest?

 

[Diddums]

This is called ringing and is highly illegal.

 

[sovietspybob]

This is interesting, maybe have a look on Mini and VW bug forums as they're cars that had lots of replacement body shells produced so must run in to similar issues regarding what is and isn't the actual vehicle the V5 is relating to.

 

[stoofa]

This all feels very "Triggers Broom" - entirely original parts, except for the shell, chassis, suspension.......

 

[Rroff]

This is interesting, maybe have a look on Mini and VW bug forums as they're cars that had lots of replacement body shells produced so must run in to similar issues regarding what is and isn't the actual vehicle the V5 is relating to.

At least with those there is some kind of (documented) continuity and I assume in most cases it is still the same chassis. What the OP is talking about is very different and to my limited understanding highly illegal.

 

[sovietspybob]

At least with those there is some kind of (documented) continuity and I assume in most cases it is still the same chassis. What the OP is talking about is very different and to my limited understanding highly illegal.

Maybe, but i for instance have a mini sat in my garage, it's rusty and say i decided i couldn't be bothered faffing with months of fabrication of floor panels, front and inner wings etc and just bought this https://www.minisport.com/aaa360200-genuine-body-shell-mk5-complete-1997-2001.html and did it all in my garage who would know or check it?

Edit: actually its right there on the DVLA website:

Keep a vehicle’s original registration number
A rebuilt vehicle can keep its original registration number if you can prove you’ve used:

• the original unmodified chassis or bodyshell (car or light van)
• a new chassis or monocoque bodyshell of the same specification as the original (car or light van)
• the original unmodified frame (motorbike)
• a new frame of the same specification as the original (motorbike)

You must also have 2 other major components from the original vehicle from the following lists.

For cars or light vans:

• suspension (front and back)
• steering assembly
• axles (both)
• transmission
• engine

For motorbikes:

• forks
• wheels
• engine
• gear box

So to me it looks like it'd be kinda ok as long as the OP still has 2 of the bits from the list above?

 

[Joe T]

You must also have 2 other major components from the original vehicle from the following lists.

For cars or light vans:

• suspension (front and back)
• steering assembly
• axles (both)
• transmission
• engine

For motorbikes:

• forks
• wheels
• engine
• gear box

So to me it looks like it'd be kinda ok as long as the OP still has 2 of the bits from the list above?

Given that what remained of the vehicle went to the scrapper, I doubt he still has 2 of the bits from the list above.

 

[pitkin]

Hmm, thanks for that info sovietspybob. That was my thinking. I've seen many Escorts that really would only be worth buying to get your hands on the documentation as they've been not much more than a pile of holes surrounded by rust.

I still have the front suspension as that was used on my kit car, the steering rack too. The steering column was shortened, so no use now. The rear axle is in the kit car too, but now has an RS2000 diff I think the 1300 diff may be around somewhere. I used the prop shaft but was shortened, so again no use. The engine and gearbox went into a different kit car. I might be able to find enough parts to scrape through.

I was sort of looking at this as a bit of luck that the guy never notified the DVLA it was scrapped, so as far as they are concerned I still have possession of it. I wan't thinking the actual "restoration" side of it might be dodgy as I'd seen one of the wheeler dealer programs recently where they had a Mini and stated the only thing they'd kept from the body was the windscreen.

I don't know what the rules on scrapping a vehicle were 20 years ago, but It was just a scrap metal dealer who took the car, he said he'd look after the paperwork but I guess he didn't bother. My first kit car and a MK4 Cortina were taken by him as well, both of which still exist on the DVLA website.

 

[pitkin]

Given that what remained of the vehicle went to the scrapper, I doubt he still has 2 of the bits from the list above.

Only the empty bodyshell went to scrap. A lot of the mechanical parts went into my kit car which is in my garage. I still some minor bits and bobs from it in the back of a shed. Probably no use now, but they are there.

 

[SeatIbiza]

Surely when the scrappy took it away, it ceased being yours even if he did "forget" to do the paperwork...

A V5 isn't proof of ownership...

 

[Rroff]

So to me it looks like it'd be kinda ok as long as the OP still has 2 of the bits from the list above?

I'd assume he'd also need to be sure it was scrapped and have some way to prove the original chassis or a continuation of the vehicle was no longer in existence but I might be wrong on that.

EDIT: As above not sure what happens if you had it scrapped either.

 

[red eye]

Back in 1987 I acquired a MK1 2 door 1300GT Ford Escort. I never actually used it on the road, so never taxed it. I just learned to drive in it it around my grandparents smallholding. A few year later I stripped it for parts for a kit car. My cousin had most of the interior so there was little left. Back in 2002 it had became not much more than a pile of rust, so I called up a local scrappy to take it away. I gave him the logbook and he said he'd deal with scrapping it through the DVLA.

Just recently, I've had a hankering for a MK1 Escort. Out of curiosity, I checked out my old reg number on the DVLA website and found out it wasn't scrapped and was just listed as untaxed. The last logbook issue date was when I acquired it back in 1987.

I'm wondering, as the car certainly doesn't exist any more, but appears to be still registered to me, could I apply for a logbook replacement, buy a bodyshell and build myself an Escort MK1 using my original Escort documentation?

Or alternatively could I get the logbook and sell it to someone that wants a period correct registration for their own 2 door Escort project?

Would there be any legal issues that could get me into trouble, such as never having taxed, MOT'd or SORN'd it? I don't think I needed to SORN it as it was never taxed prior to SORN coming in, ans was only ever kept off road, but I'm not sure.

Anyway, sorry for the ramble, hope someone can offer some insight into it.

You butchered a mk1 for a kit car?!?!

 

[gc123]

how do you know if you got the document and sold it , the people who bought it didnt just steal another mk1 escort and use the document on it ...ringing i believe is the correct term. very dodgy

please forget the idea .

 

[Tinders]

I guess you have seen how much even a bag of rust MK2 is fetching now and want to cash in lol. They are fetching daft money and they really arent that good, considering what else you could get for the cash, its all sodding nostalgia clouding peoples heads!

 

[Scania]

If it was that simple the market would be flooded with resurrected scrapped vehicles and the market for rare cars (as the majority have been scrapped long ago) would not exist.

Think about it.