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If you are not a spy or anything secretive post an aerial shot of the garden from Google Maps and perhaps some ground level shots, I am sure some of us can perhaps put forward some ideas. A dipole or vertical for 10 metres is small, but the band is far from always open. If you can manage a dipole about 35 feet in total length and can find or make supports about a minimum of 20 feet off the ground, then the 20 metre band is always active. Of course the lower in frequency you go the bigger an effective TX antenna is. I like 20 metres and 40 metres myself, although 10 metres is incredible if and when it opens up.

Are you only interested in talking to rela people, or are you happy to just run digital modes, PC to PC in effect, over the airwaves? Digi modes can be effective with small inefficient aerials.

Beware of bringing RF into the house and phone wiring if you put a TX antenna in the loft... It can be done, but something external is best.

If you put a horizontal type of aerial like a dipole up outside make it so you can raise and lower it often and easily, so tuning it in is not such a pain you give up on the finer points ;)

End fed wires are probably the least obtrusive, personally I don't like them, but if needs must they offer a means of getting on HF with something with no feeder hanging down part way along. Verticals usually need radials, either under the lawn or raised above it a bit, as a ground plane. Our front lawn is riddled with wires, but `er indoors has no idea they are there, there are easy ways to put them down with no sign at all after a couple of days.

My one tip is always buy good branded co-ax and good branded RF connectors. A Chinese one off EBAY will NOT be the same as a branded one and the huge price difference IS worth it. I would also always recommend avoiding PL type RF connectors, they are a true abortion, and a plethora of cheap out of spec ones abound. Apart from the rigs themselves with their normal PL sockets that do not offer an easy way to change them, I ONLY use N type or BNC, and ONLY branded ones. I can't tell you how much hassle Chinese junk ones have given me in the past, before my old friend bent my ear about getting what you pay for... I don't know what the budget is, but one thing I find totally indispensable, but until prices fell in the last couple of years, were considered exotic, is an antenna analyzer. Just like the best set up car in the world is useless on junk tyres, the best transceiver money can buy is a waste of time into a totally mismatched aerial.
 
Soldato
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I personally find verticals with fishing poles to be easier on the eye (others may disagree) than dipoles overhead, especially when going for multiple bands.

I recently built a 'blue peter' version of the DX commander using stuff I had in the shed, I was going to recommend something similar, but having just looked an the price of 10m fishing poles, they have gone up in price - crikey! I had a 40m (slightly over 1/4 wave) wire on folded over like the DX Commander version which also give me 15m and a seperate 20m (1/4 wave) wire on, with some radials out on the ground and it seemed to work ok for what it was. I used £15 (100m) 1.5mm conduit wire from Toolstation and a 10m fishing pole I had - but yes it needs a lot of wire down on the ground like all verticals do.
 
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I was looking top pick up one of those nanovna things, as the price for what you set seems ridiculous.

I have a huge box of N and BNC type connectors, just need to locate the crimp tool for them at the moment. I always hated PL259 connectors. Fortunately, I had a chassis mount N connector so that is now on the back of the radio (Same footprint and everything!)

Will see what I can do about an overhead shot and maybe some other stuff. Everything will live in the shed at the back of the garden so no need to be in the house with TV issues hopefully.

Think I can do a long wire pretty easily, as I can run right down the fence line at the edge of the property. Not sure I can get massive elevation, but I am thinking that I might be able to sneak higher as time passes :)
 
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Don't make the incorrect assumption that an antenna wire fastened to a tree branch will automagically go higher in direct proportion to how high the top of the tree gets. Trees, from an amateur radio point of view, are a PITA and don't grow in such a convenient manner :) Those NanoVNA things are remarkably cheap, but I think I would go for at least the newer, bigger screen version. Don't be sucked in to the "An antenna MUST be resonant" school of thinking.... I am slowly getting my head around antenna theory and practice, it's hugely complex, but very rewarding when home brew aerial building goes smoothly.
 
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I was looking top pick up one of those nanovna things, as the price for what you set seems ridiculous.

I have one and they are a steal for the price. The screen is small but plugged into the laptop with NanoVNA Saver makes it much more user friendly and easier to use.
 
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This shows the approx layout of the house. Not sure how far out you wanted :)

Y4KK6r2.png

Given that the shed is under a tree (Red Circle), I was aiming to avoid it at all costs. The edge of the property is a wooden fance supported by those concrete pillars that councils like to install. I could potentially use them to mount a pole to at each end i guess.
 
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Build a 49-1 with 67ft of wire and eithier inverted V on boundary line or inverted L . L will require 2 x 10m masts (unless you slope it ) and V will require 1

This shows the approx layout of the house. Not sure how far out you wanted :)

Y4KK6r2.png

Given that the shed is under a tree (Red Circle), I was aiming to avoid it at all costs. The edge of the property is a wooden fance supported by those concrete pillars that councils like to install. I could potentially use them to mount a pole to at each end i guess.
 
Commissario
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During the recent storms, the centre stub of my hex slowly lifted out of the plate after breaking free of the bush and then it folded over until it was hanging there, supported by the spreaders at the top and the coax at the bottom. Then one of the spreaders snapped and it all started looking like a very sad, drowned spider.
I reckon it'll be two to three months before I can get it all repaired and back up.

It was longer than three months. It's been nearly five months.

I spent three hours in the garden yesterday rebuilding it. Then I spent another three hours this morning finishing it off, followed by a couple of hours work getting it all mounted to the mast, tightened off and raised back up.

Looking good.

o3qfS6n.jpeg
 
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Looking at the plan I would think a vertical or an end fed wire, as Snaggle suggested might be good options. Are you intending trying to have an aerial that works most bands, or are you happy to select one or two and optimise for it or them?

Feek: What make of mast is that, it's not a Versatower, is it UK made, and still manufactured? Thanks.
 
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Feek: What make of mast is that, it's not a Versatower, is it UK made, and still manufactured? Thanks.
It's an Alimast from John, G4ZTR (Aerial-Parts of Colchester). I've got four sections, along with the associated accessories, coupling packs, base pack, top plate and rotator plate. Yes, it's still available.

I put it up in 2011 and if you go back to the very first post in this thread, there's a load of pictures of the whole process of assembling it and getting it all installed plus a link to a video of it being wound up when it had my MA-5B on top.

I bet it looks huge in real life with 40m on!
Like anything else, it's all down to perspective. On the ground, it looks enormous but once the mast is wound up, I don't think it has anywhere near the same visual impact.
 
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Thanks, I'd forgotten you had posted regarding the masts initial installation, just read through it again. How high do they recommend as a maximum assuming something modest, weight and wind loading wise on the top, their web site doesn't seem to give much info on the masts themselves? I had to chuckle when you said amateurs can discuss anything except religion and politics, having been listening on 1.920 and 1.933 a bit recently ;) The forum mods would have a seizure if they were asked to discipline those good old boys <LOL>

Good work repairing the hexbeam, they seem a really good multi band antenna if you want a bit of gain and have a tower, they always seem to hear and send well.

As an aside, down in the bowels of the spectrum there's some interesting work around 8kHz at the moment, but I have nothing that hears properly down there, although I do now have a gifted 3kW audio amp that should shove a decent bit of antenna current out into earth electrodes. Someone (DL7NN) in Germany is sending WSPR15 on 8.27kHz as I type, but for now I have to use remote grabbers to listen that low.

Got some Andres LDF4-50 Heliax the other day, at a really good price, and bought some N type connectors off Ebay for it. TOTALLY going against the advice I gave above :( I examined them and thought these instructions are wrong and they really need a flaring tool to be used on the outer copper jacket of the Heliax. I e-mailed the seller and was told they are fine if you just tighten them up hard, they will self flare, I should have stuck by my instincts, I now have a very scrap N type. So I made a Heath Robinson flaring tool tonight and did what I felt I should have done in the first place, and the other one went on perfectly. I guess it puts people off if they tell them they need a tool that Andrew PLC sell for £50, plus carriage from the US, plus duty, plus handling fee, plus VAT.... The one I made was from a bit of scrap steel round bar, (50 pence max) and 15 minutes on the lathe. It doesn't have a nice wooden handle though, not sure how I'll manage to sleep tonight ;) LDF4-50 is a bit of a pain to handle and route, but for much less than LMR400 for a far less loss, I'll struggle! Given the amount of "offcuts" on Ebay of LDF4-50 it seems the cell phone mast installers have found a nice sideline!
 
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I need to get into this, I wouldn’t mind a receiving setup, just till starting training for licence.

I can’t see the missus letting me install an aerial like Feek, but an attic/roof dipole might suffice to start off with, is an internal aerial even an option, I’m in central Scotland and located quite high, so assuming reception would be decent.

thoughts for a basic transceiver, would like a nice Icom or similar, but an older unit would be perfect assuming costs are kept lower.

or maybe I should consider mobile setup ?

Al.
 
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How high do they recommend as a maximum assuming something modest, weight and wind loading wise on the top, their web site doesn't seem to give much info on the masts themselves?
I wanted to run five sections to give me 12.5m height but John highly recommended against it because I'm running unguyed. I seem to remember he says five sections guyed is a good figure with 75Kg headland but if you want more details, drop him and email and I'm sure he'll be able to help you. Drop my name and see if that does anything for the price (I've known John for years and he was happy to sponsor qso365 back in 2011).

I actually found out recently that the conditions prohibiting discussion of religion and politics is no longer in the licence conditions :(

I've got a length of 450 that I bought from eBay years ago with the intention to use it for my VHF system but in the end I went with Ecoflex 15 from the shack to the masthead preamp and then a tail made of Ecoflex 10 to go round the rotator and up to the aerial itself. I'm still using that coax but it's connected to a Diamond X510 now. I haven't used 2m SSB for nearly ten years although I did buy one of those cheap Ukrainian transverters for 2m to get me back on the band. I know it'll be useless being cross polarised but for local natter, it's fine.

thoughts for a basic transceiver, would like a nice Icom or similar, but an older unit would be perfect assuming costs are kept lower.
I have no brand loyalty - Whenever I'm looking at wirelesses, I try and spend some time at a shop playing with different models to see what I fancy. My shack isn't full of radios, I've just got a Kenwood TS-590, Icom 5100, Yaesu FTM-100D and an Anytone handheld here so a nice mix of makes.

I can’t see the missus letting me install an aerial like Feek, but an attic/roof dipole might suffice to start off with, is an internal aerial even an option, I’m in central Scotland and located quite high, so assuming reception would be decent.
As has been said above, simple wire aerials are pretty straightforward, easy to build and very unobtrusive. I'm assuming you're talking about HF though because if you're in the middle of GM land, I can't imagine there's much in the way of VHF/UHF activity.

If all you want to do is receive at the moment then just run as much wire as you can around wherever you can and connect it to the centre of the aerial connector.
 
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Congratulations, what modes are you currently running? Being in London are you space limited for aerials, or can you get something fairly decent for HF up? 20 meters was open last night for a good while, spent some time chatting SSB to amateurs in Uruguay and Brazil. Worked Suriname with low power WSPR on 10 meters when it opened for a while. Looking to put up a vertical delta loop for 40 meters soon, to see how it compares with my dipole. Have fun.
 
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