Kyle Rittenhouse - teen who shot three people in Kenosha

Jono8 · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:14

Narj said:
That's a pretty naive take on things to be honest. There's previous video evidence of people who are supportive of the "cause" turning up at protests and subsequently taking a kicking! Think I posted one some time back saying that their "ally" cards had obviously been revoked!

Personally I'd just stay the hell away but I can understand why people would want to defend businesses and properties from looting and arson.

It isn't a naive take on things, because evidently him taking the weapon has resulted in people dying.

Narj · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:17

Jono8 said:
It isn't a naive take on things, because evidently him taking the weapon has resulted in people dying.

That would be all well and good if the protesters weren't tooled up. It's pretty obvious it's going to be a violent situation. I did read that one of the guys he shot was also armed (again I think we need the full story rather than taking everything at face value).

I don't care how good your intentions are, you're mental to be going in there in the first place. Again, this is 'Murica.

D3K · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:19

Jono8 said:
It isn't a naive take on things, because evidently him taking the weapon has resulted in people dying.

Watch the first video on the NY times article

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/27/us/kyle-rittenhouse-kenosha-shooting-video.html

Jono8 · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:22

D3K said:
Watch the first video on the NY times article

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/27/us/kyle-rittenhouse-kenosha-shooting-video.html

I already have watched the videos.

The fact remains, is that the only person who has shot and killed two people and wounded another is Kyle. If he was not there with his weapon, its likely no one would have died that night.

Dis86 · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:25

Jono8 said:
I already have watched the videos.

The fact remains, is that the only person who has shot and killed two people and wounded another is Kyle. If he was not there with his weapon, its likely no one would have died that night.

If he was there with no weapon might he have not been the victim?

D3K · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:27

Jono8 said:
I already have watched the videos.

The fact remains, is that the only person who has shot and killed two people and wounded another is Kyle. If he was not there with his weapon, its likely no one would have died that night.

Your point is that he is in the wrong for going there. I agree, he shouldn't have been there.
But he stated beforehand what the rifle was for, and there had been precedence of defenders getting attacked.
If he was there without a rifle, perhaps it woulda been him dead?
Finally the military condoned his presence. They thanked the militia for their assistance, and threw them bottles of water.

dowie · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:38

omnomnom said:
The person who was shot in the hand had a gun, thats fair enough as hes on the ground. He shot someone who was running away...

He also shouldn't be walking the streets with an assault rifle but lets just ignore that little fact.

Who did he shoot that was running away?

On the second point, no one is ignoring it but the context is this is a US state where that is either allowed or is a misdemeanour, you’ve got to look at it from their legal perspective not ours... yes it’s nuts!

G-MAN2004 · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:41

The US is finished. It's too far gone now and opposing sides will never find peace until the other is destroyed. It had a good run.

The Running Man · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:48

I guess he's just lucky he shot white folk otherwise there would be more riots?

Goksly · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:48

If I see a guy with a rifle... I don't try and tap him in the head with a skateboard or chase them throwing stuff. All these videos of people getting shot - they're either not complying with police or attacking someone with a gun. Asking for trouble.

Burnsy2023 · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:51

d_brennen said:
What I think is thank **** I don't live in America.

Indeed, whether it ends up being judged as a crime or self defence, I would never like to live in a country like the US. Also, children and firearms only mix in very disciplined and controlled circumstances. Clearly a riot doesn't count.

dowie · 29 Aug 2020 at 11:55

Jono8 said:
It is.

The biggest point for me is why the protestors were following him/angry with him in the first instance. Why was Kyle singled out? Why weren't other "militia" members chased/in this situation where they had to open fire and kill people? I would be surprised if this whole thing was entirely unprovoked.

There are reports that say he threatened them with his rifle. If thats the case, surely the protestors were acting in self defence/trying to disarm him?

I guess we will have to wait till the court case to find out exactly what the prosecutors have in terms of unreleased footage/witness statements.

Yup that last be could be key, so far the reporter says they were chasing him. The other milita witness says it was because he got separated after administering first aid to protestors then tried to stop some car fires at the businessman’s other property. I guess that’s where the other possible witnesses come in, has he brandished a weapon in doing that?

Though even if he had, he then retreats and is chased - so can he still claim self defence when a shot is fired behind him and the first attacker tries to grab his gun?

(Other, maybe rather speculative, question is - was the first guy shot only by him or also by a stray bullet from whomever fired first in the group of protestors pursuing Kyle?)

jsmoke said:
He likely went out there primarily looking for a fight and guised it in the helping the wounded line.

There isn’t much to suggest that though, it requires some mind reading, in fact he seems to have acted like most of the other militia guys albeit he’s one of the guys LARPing as a medic and helping out protestors. Certainly the story that he got isolated/ couldn’t make it back to his initial location at the first mechanic’s shop because police had blocked the route can be checked out, that he treated people can be checked out. It’s those circumstances that put him in the dangerous position where he then heads to the second mechanics shop and the people who are trying to set cars on fire... I guess this is the bit where we need more details, but again his actions there - running away - don’t indicate that he’s looking for a fight, it seems he only fights(shoots) after he’s first attempted to retreat and each of the attackers is right on him. I suspect that fact is going to be pretty significant in the court case.

ANDREW GREEN · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:01

200sols said:
He undeniably put himself in a stupid situation but he was being chased down by an armed mob, sounds like self defence to me.

Malevolence said:
Guess it's OK for a gang of adults, one armed with a pistol (the dumb **** who got his arm blown off), to violently attack a child in the street, but it's not OK for that child to defend himself with the rifle he was carrying.

Johno please? said:
Where in the footage does he shoot someone running away?

Do you mean when he shoots the guy who hit him with a skateboard and trys to take his gun? Does anyone have any integrity anymore?

He wasn't shooting anyone at this point though.... as you can see in the footage, hes running down the street with the rifle pointed at the floor, hardly the actions of an "active shooter"

Lads he had already killed a protestor at that point. He was running away after shooting a protestor who threw a bag at him. The onus on his legal team is to prove a bag been thrown at him was a threat to his life.

ANDREW GREEN · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:04

dowie said:
Though even if he had, he then retreats and is chased - so can he still claim self defence when a shot is fired behind him and the first attacker tries to grab his gun?

Has to be a threat to his life from what I've read. Can you argue grabbing his gun is a threat to his life? I don't know, it's debatable.

omnomnom · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:05

dowie said:
Who did he shoot that was running away?

On the second point, no one is ignoring it but the context is this is a US state where that is either allowed or is a misdemeanour, you’ve got to look at it from their legal perspective not ours... yes it’s nuts!

The video i watched was from behind so it looked like he was chasing someone whereas he was actually the one being chased. I agree with the self defense posters now.

Its absolutely ridiculous you can walk the streets with a weapon like but whats more stupid is picking a fight with someone who has one.

omnomnom · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:06

ANDREW GREEN said:
Has to be a threat to his life from what I've read. Can you argue grabbing his gun is a threat to his life? I don't know, it's debatable.

He's grabbing his gun with the idea of using it imo.

jsmoke · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:08

omnomnom said:
The video i watched was from behind so it looked like he was chasing someone whereas he was actually the one being chased. I agree with the self defense posters now.

Its absolutely ridiculous you can walk the streets with a weapon like but whats more stupid is picking a fight with someone who has one.

I wish I could walk the streets with an ar-15.

BowdonUK · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:10

If someone is chasing me to do bodily harm and I have a gun then I'm shooting you.

If the other person also has a good then I'm going to shoot first.

I guess that some of the mob just saw him as a person with a gun that shot someone and went after him to grab the gun. That is giving the mob the benefit of doubt. I question the motives of 2 convicted criminals going for the gun as having good intentions.

Johno please? · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:14

ANDREW GREEN said:
Lads he had already killed a protestor at that point. He was running away after shooting a protestor who threw a bag at him. The onus on his legal team is to prove a bag been thrown at him was a threat to his life.

Not accurate.

Hes running away, has something thrown at him, Joseph Rosenbaum chases him, someone else fires a pistol in the air (for some dumb reason) he hears this turns and sees Jospeh bearing down on him and shoots him, a little different to the scenario in your head.

deuse · 29 Aug 2020 at 12:14

ZG002 said:
Sorry mate, didn't have time to read every ****ing opinion on the event. Wait there I will be back in 3 hours.

Lad shouldn't of been there with a rifle, was and it all ended badly for him and others.

Instead of the how about you enlighten me as to why a 17yr old decided to illegally turn up with a rifle?

You best ask him.
I have no idea.