Dont touch that phone!

Soldato
Joined
1 Mar 2010
Posts
21,889
https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/news/motoring-news/the-truly-staggering-things-seen-from-a-police-lorry/

The police lorry was loaned to the forces by Highways England to give officers a better view inside cars from above.

More than 300 different offences were committed by 285 drivers over nine days, in plain sight of shocked officers.

They included not being in proper control of a vehicle, driving on the hard shoulder, driving without due care and attention, and seatbelt offences.

Careless motorists were handed 23 Fixed Penalty Notices, 155 Traffic Offence Reports and 104 ‘words of advice’.

Out of the 86 offences for not being in proper control of a vehicle, the majority involved drivers interacting with maps on mobile phones.

no comments on people being done for touching inbuilt systems ? I suppose that's not a discrete crime
 
Soldato
Joined
5 Apr 2009
Posts
24,849
This is what I don't understand. So I can't skip a song on my phone which is in a mount on car mode

This is and will be fine.

Ministers have rejected calls to also ban the use of hands-free function, for example using a sat-nav in a phone cradle.

The major change here is making it against the law to hold and use your phone for anything (with specific exception like contactless payment). Previously it was only illegal to hold and use it for 'interactive communications'. As per the original link, someone successfully appealed a conviction for videoing something whilst driving as it wasn't interactive communication.

It is not currently illegal to use it in a mount, nor is it proposed to be, whether that's calls, music, nav, whatever.

If you're completely distracted by it (playing a game for example), they'd just use due care and attention laws if the specific phone laws didn't cover it.
 
Man of Honour
Joined
17 Oct 2002
Posts
159,596
It just feels political. Why is there a specific law being introduced to stop you holding your phone and using it to take photos when just like holding a DSLR and taking photos whilst driving it's already something that, if the police use the correct charge, you can be prosecuted for?

It's a useful clarification of a law introduced to make something illegal that was arguably already illegal in the first place.

You're not in proper control of your car if you're messing about with a handheld phone changing music and not being in proper control of a your car has been illegal for many years already.
 
Soldato
Joined
5 Apr 2009
Posts
24,849
It presumably makes it easier (at least in theory) to directly tackle something that is a considerably bigger problem than people using DSLRs whilst driving.

Driving without due care and attention strikes me as more difficult to achieve convictions and more open to arguments, contested court cases etc. Whilst it is a catch all that also means that it's 'vague' and a lot of instances will start to fall under judgement and interpretation.

There is no doubt a political element to it too, being seen to be doing something about mobile phone use in a way that is much more visible than a 15% increase in CD10 endorsements would be.
 
Man of Honour
Joined
17 Oct 2002
Posts
159,596
Driving without due care and attention strikes me as more difficult to achieve convictions and more open to arguments, contested court cases

Presumably as it precludes the use of 6 point fixed penalty notices for people caught checking Google maps traffic in a queue of stationary traffic, whereas the phone law is absolute, you're using it, you're guilty.

It does seem like it's more about optics than proportion. Is checking Google maps in a queue really the same harm to society as driving without insurance or leaving the scene of an accident or failing to name the driver after a potentially serious incident? Because the law seems to now regard all three of these acts equally.
 
Soldato
Joined
1 Apr 2003
Posts
11,890
Location
Northamptonshire
This new law does four things:

- removes any ambiguity in the law where people may have wriggled out of situations in the past
- makes it clear to drivers that holding a phone is not appropriate while driving
- creates useful PR in the world of driving with due care and attention / dangerous driving, in general
- allows for certain exceptions such as drive-thru payment.

I dont see it as any more complex than that really.
 
Last edited:
Man of Honour
Joined
17 Oct 2002
Posts
159,596
I think the new law is a helpful, sensible and pragmatic revision of what was and to an extent still is a flawed law.

It will improve the situation. No reasonable person thought it was fine to video stuff whilst driving anyway so the situation remains unchanged for most of us. Infact it gets better as it clarifies situations where phone use in the car is acceptable, the fact it's illegal to Apple pay at McDonald's is currently silly.
 
Soldato
Joined
5 Apr 2009
Posts
24,849
Are walkie talkies allowed? Why are they allowed?

From askthepolice
Q659: Is it illegal to use a CB or two way radio whilst driving?

It is an offence to use a hand held mobile phone or an "interactive communications device", but there is an exemption for a two way radio which is designed or adapted -

for the purpose of transmitting and receiving spoken messages; and
operates on any frequency other than 880 MHz to 915 MHz, 925 MHz to 960 MHz, 1710 MHz to 1785 MHz, 1805 MHz to 1880 MHz, 1900 MHz to 1980 MHz or 2110 MHz to 2170 MHz.
Ofcom states that you should be transmitting CB in the 27MHz range, if you are, you come within the exception and are OK. The exception was created because so many government and private organisations (e.g. taxis) use 2 way radios.

However, there is strong scientific evidence that any such activity (including fiddling with your CD player etc.) does raise the level of danger so far as accidents are concerned, so it is recommended that you do whatever you can to minimise use of transmitter buttons, tuning devices and volume controls. If something akin to hands free exists it would be a good idea.

Even if the device you are using does not fall within the mobile phone legislation, with or without hands free, if you can't control your vehicle properly or are driving badly, you can be prosecuted for not being in proper control of your vehicle, careless driving or dangerous driving, the latter two offences carry much higher penalties. If you kill someone in an accident caused by phoning or texting or using a CB etc. you can expect a lengthy sentence of imprisonment.
 
Soldato
Joined
8 Nov 2006
Posts
22,979
Location
London
Minicabs/Taxis these days use apps rather than 2 way radios.

It's also becoming a bit more moot as car infotainment systems are now far more integrated with mobiles. So you shouldn't really need to touch your mobile phone.

Next step for campaigners will be to ban the use of infotainment systems whilst driving.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...gher-penalties-on-drivers-using-mobile-phones

The radio can be distracting as well. Ban that eventually. In fact ban driving, then no one can cause death by driving.

Roads minister Baroness Vere said: “Our roads are some of the safest in the world, but we want to make sure they’re safer still by bringing the law into 21st century.

Sounds like we are aiming for zero deaths. UK roads are the safest in Europe the last time I checked.

edit:

https://ec.europa.eu/transport/facts-fundings/scoreboard/compare/people/road-fatalities_en

Actually Sweden are a bit better.
 
Last edited:
Soldato
Joined
22 Nov 2006
Posts
23,360
I don't see how touching a screen in the car is any better than messing with a phone though. A law should also say that basic car controls must be proper buttons, so that you don't need to look away from the road to adjust the ******* AC.
 
Soldato
Joined
8 Nov 2006
Posts
22,979
Location
London
I don't see how touching a screen in the car is any better than messing with a phone though. A law should also say that basic car controls must be proper buttons, so that you don't need to look away from the road to adjust the ******* AC.

Or how about we stop the nanny state and actually look at how big of a problem it really is.

There is a difference between using mobile phones interactively whilst driving not paying attention to what is in front of you. Or picking up your phone in stationary traffic.

The people that use their phone whilst in moving traffic aren't suddenly going to stop. They already knew it was breaking the law.
 
Soldato
Joined
11 Nov 2004
Posts
8,182
Location
Couvains, France
Every day I see dozens of people using phones while driving and even taking selfies and posting on social media while sitting in traffic. There isn't the Police to deal with this now so new legislation won't improve the situation.
 
Soldato
Joined
8 Nov 2006
Posts
22,979
Location
London
Every day I see dozens of people using phones while driving and even taking selfies and posting on social media while sitting in traffic. There isn't the Police to deal with this now so new legislation won't improve the situation.

And you think they are causing deaths?

I don't believe this law was actually created to tackle that anyway. Although will by default. It is being introduced to stop people playing games or taking videos whilst not stationary. It was a loophole some used when caught.
 
Soldato
Joined
27 Nov 2005
Posts
24,675
Location
Guernsey
So am i right in thinking that i can use the touch screen display built into my car to scroll through my contract list to choose someone to call..

But am not allowed to do the exact same thing on my mobile phone
 
Soldato
Joined
5 Apr 2009
Posts
24,849
So am i right in thinking that i can use the display built into my car to scroll through my contract list to choose someone to call..

But am not allowed to do the exact same thing on my mobile phone
Not if you're holding your phone.

If it's in a mount you can.

If you can't maintain proper control of your vehicle doing this via infotainment or mounted phone, you could be prosecuted via 'due care and attention' laws anyway.
 
Soldato
Joined
29 Jun 2004
Posts
2,652
I don't see how touching a screen in the car is any better than messing with a phone though. A law should also say that basic car controls must be proper buttons, so that you don't need to look away from the road to adjust the ******* AC.

I think I've adjusted the aircon in my car around 4 times in the 8 years I've owned the car. It's just left on auto and it does its stuff.
 
Soldato
Joined
1 Mar 2010
Posts
21,889
now looking at the report, it's the the female uk drivers who are the most distracted .(unless this multi-tasking meme is true)
need to ban smoking too, and makeup

50503245381_1554a50999_b_d.jpg
 
Back
Top Bottom