Correct, the remote fobs work by pressing the buttons.
Keyless entry and start not working
- Thread starter Meatball
- Start date
Correct, the remote fobs work by pressing the buttons.
Soldato
It does sound like the comfort access sensor(s) is/are shot. In a BMW you can get something similar if one of the sensors goes faulty.
Holy thread revival!
4 months... i've seen a lot worse!
So you're still running the same battery? I'm not sure having the dodgy guys at kwik fit run a battery test would rule much out.
Have a look at someone like ECP T&Cs on returning batteries, especially with distance selling regulations if buying online. If there's not much quibble, then i'd be tempted to buy a decent branded one and see if that resolves it. Try it pretty quickly so you can return it the same day and just say your car wouldn't start and you thought it was the battery, but new battery still doesn't start the car.
The only thing making me lean away from the battery is the fact that everything else in the car is working fine and *touch wood* it’s not failed to start the car. If the battery was at fault it would also display other symptoms?
I have a feeling it may be something to do with the sunroof and the wiring loom there. This is what Hyundai suggested when it was with them for diagnostics but there uncertainty and £350 cost just for examination put me off further diagnostics with them. The sunroof is a known fault with the vehicle and mine wasn’t working when purchased, it closed half way and then would return to open. The garage fixed the issue by lubricating it and it’s not failed me since. When you look at wiring diagrams there is wiring related to the keyless module near it:
this and the fact I don’t get a warning when I’ve left it open makes me think the car can’t detect whether the sunroof is open/closed and therefore disables the keyless? That or damaged wiring is causing a short / grounding issue:
you seem pretty adamant that its a roof wireing fault , so lets go to basics . when sat in car look at grab handles, interior light units , sunvisors and around the sunroof and check if anything looks as if its been disturbed, scratch marks around plastics little divots out etc it may be as simple as a trapped wire, or even as said internittent short. failing that if it was me and you ruled out everything then try and find the wiring harness that goes to the roof and check it along the length.
a post pillar trim , removal till you find the side and then trace it. have had harnesses trapped where they exit the corner of the dash to go up the pillar.
on my mondeo the roof wiring goes up the passenger side a pillar under the trim with the roof aerial and sat nav wiring had to pack the edge of the dash with a piece of foam as looked likley to chafe.
may even be somthing simple like a wire pulled slightly out of a connector , im afraid as sherlock says , rule out the obvious and whatever is left , however inplausible could be the answer.
a post pillar trim , removal till you find the side and then trace it. have had harnesses trapped where they exit the corner of the dash to go up the pillar.
on my mondeo the roof wiring goes up the passenger side a pillar under the trim with the roof aerial and sat nav wiring had to pack the edge of the dash with a piece of foam as looked likley to chafe.
may even be somthing simple like a wire pulled slightly out of a connector , im afraid as sherlock says , rule out the obvious and whatever is left , however inplausible could be the answer.
Batteries can be a bit temperamental with some components.
My car has stop/start, and when the battery was starting to be on its way out, the stop/start was temperamental - i know stop/start requires many other factors to work correctly, but it does start to become iffy when the battery is on its way out, even though i'd have no problem cranking the car etc.
From memory as well when i eventually had the battery replaced, for stop/start to work again, the battery had to meet a minimum criteria (i think it was more on capacity rather than CCA), and meant you couldn't just stick any battery in there - even if it met minimum CCA.
So my Hyundai VCI arrived on Saturday. I’ve been working all weekend so all I’ve had a chance to do is plug it in to see if it actually worked, and it certainly appears to!
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I can’t access some of the software functions as it requires dealer log in but the bits I need appear accessible. I’ll get a proper chance to check it out on Tuesday. I get the impression this will allow me to view / record live data from different systems / modules, including the keyless. I’m hoping this will shed some light on where the weak link(s) are.
[url=https://ibb.co/kKFHssf]
[/URL]I can’t access some of the software functions as it requires dealer log in but the bits I need appear accessible. I’ll get a proper chance to check it out on Tuesday. I get the impression this will allow me to view / record live data from different systems / modules, including the keyless. I’m hoping this will shed some light on where the weak link(s) are.
Well I finally got a chance to have a look through the diagnostic software and run the tests within this. The smart key module is clearly "alive" and communicating:
I then looked at the sensors within the system and they appear normal:
When I run the antenna actuation tests they are all 'success':
No closer yet it seems
I then looked at the sensors within the system and they appear normal:
- Driver/Passenger/Boot switch go to "on" when pressed
- External buzzer changes from "off" to "on" when I activate it
- Immobilizer indicator changes from "off" to "on" when it's illuminated
- Start/Stop button changes from "off" to "on" when I press it
When I run the antenna actuation tests they are all 'success':
No closer yet it seems
Soldato
So the key fobs' buttons work to lock/unlock - this will be because a different module/antenna deals with this longer-range RF signal. It lets you start the car if you put the key in the designated slot - presumably so that the backup "old fashioned" transponder can be used (the ones normally in the ring around the ignition barrel of a car without smart keys) if the fob is completely dead. It also doesn't moan when you remove keys, and obviously doesn't respond to keyless commands.
Both fobs have the same issue, so it's not the fob. And all antennas seem to have the same symptoms, which in my mind rules out an antenna/wiring fault.
I am also going to assume the test that fails is relying on communication with the fobs.
Therefore, I wonder if the fobs have somehow disassociated themselves from the keyless system or vice versa? Does this diagnostic tool let you reprogram/resync the keys?
Both fobs have the same issue, so it's not the fob. And all antennas seem to have the same symptoms, which in my mind rules out an antenna/wiring fault.
I am also going to assume the test that fails is relying on communication with the fobs.
Therefore, I wonder if the fobs have somehow disassociated themselves from the keyless system or vice versa? Does this diagnostic tool let you reprogram/resync the keys?
You’re right in saying the test is only a “success” if the module receives a response from the key fobs. I get the impression the actuation test is just a simple check the module / antenna is there and appears operational.
The software does allow me to program keys but I need the car’s security pin, which I don’t have! When I took the car to Hyundai for diagnostics it does say on the sheet that they reprogrammed the keys, but it does also say “live data check door locking unlocking on all fobs OK”
Soldato
I know it doesn't let you proceed, but does it state specifically what it is programming? i.e. the passive "ignition barrel" transponder, the remote lock/unlock, or the smart key functionality? I wonder if Hyundai only did the former (or former two). Clutching at straws a bit here, mind you!
With the access I have it doesn't appear to separate the remote and smart functionalities for the key.
I've had another dig through the GDS manuals and I've noticed a few things:
- I'm missing the "Key out indicator lamp" sensor as a option to test which I should have:
(Screenshot from the manual)
- The sunroof schematics shows a key in/out signal. I think this is the wire my Hyundai dealer thought could be damaged and wanted to inspect
I don't get a audible warning from the car when the sunroof is left open, which I should do when all the doors are closed and I attempt to lock the car using my fob.
Soldato
It does seem like a bit of a stretch, but then I suppose stranger things have been known.
You could get the multimeter out and start testing continuity of cables but that will probably mean pulling the headliner down?
I hope you get to the bottom of this. It would bug me too!
You could get the multimeter out and start testing continuity of cables but that will probably mean pulling the headliner down?
I hope you get to the bottom of this. It would bug me too!
Soldato
I know you said you checked the fuses to see if any had blown, but have you checked for missing fuses?
I'll have a quick look, thanks!
Howard said:
Although it's a vanity feature, it bugs me that it doesn't work and I'm now just determined to get it working again. Lockdown boredom I suppose?
I have got a digital multimeter but yes I think it's headliner down time which involves a lot of internal trim coming out
.From reading the manual another conclusion I've come to is my antenna actuation "success" results are actually false. When reading the manual it states:
GDS Manual said:
The LED on my key doesn't blink, suggesting it's not receiving/sending anything as it should. I get "success" even if I leave the key in the house! I have swapped both key batteries three times, all with high quality (Duracell, Energiser, Varta) batteries. The fob buttons operate from long range and the LED blinks when I press them so I'm incredibly confident the fob / batteries aren't at fault.
Soldato
Have you tried disconnecting the battery for a while to give everything a proper "power cycle"?
I have, several times and once for over 24 hours.
So I’ve taken a gamble and bought a second hand keyless module off eBay, it should arrive next week. My local Hyundai dealer concluded my “key signal” wire above the headliner was damaged and referred to a “Hyundai Tech” article which apparently had the same symptoms I have and the cause was the key signal above the headliner going to ground near the sunroof. I’ve found out a bit more about this tech article and the symptoms are not the same as I’m experiencing:
- When I look at the key switch in GDS (within the PDM module) it does seem to be working correctly, ie. off when my key isn’t in the fob and on when it is. I’ve tried at numerous times in as many conditions as possible.
- I’ve never had issues with the car not locking / unlocking with the fobs, it has always worked and I’ve never failed to lock / unlock my car
- It is my Smartkey module at fault
- The donor Smartkey module is fully functional
- The calculated PINs I get are correct
- I can successfully pair the replacement to my vehicle
Dude, try changing the battery. Honestly.
The Stop/Start on my Jaguar XE and XF both stopped working due to a dash camera. The car is smart enough to know the battery is a dud (or in my case being drawn on beyond the specification it left the factory with) and disable things that are additional draws such as emitting RF to find a key and to minimise load such as stop/start.
I wouldn't say Hyundai's are particularly known for it but I imagine they are as sensitive as other marques.
The only other course of action would be the previous owner in his infinite wisdom (I mean seriously, the front page of motors has a chap who had his car nicked through keyless) removed the fuse for the sensor to disable the system totally. Smart.
The Stop/Start on my Jaguar XE and XF both stopped working due to a dash camera. The car is smart enough to know the battery is a dud (or in my case being drawn on beyond the specification it left the factory with) and disable things that are additional draws such as emitting RF to find a key and to minimise load such as stop/start.
I wouldn't say Hyundai's are particularly known for it but I imagine they are as sensitive as other marques.
The only other course of action would be the previous owner in his infinite wisdom (I mean seriously, the front page of motors has a chap who had his car nicked through keyless) removed the fuse for the sensor to disable the system totally. Smart.
Soldato
Fingers crossed. For £35 it's worth a gamble.
The battery explanation above has crossed my mind but I'd expect other symptoms too I think.
The battery explanation above has crossed my mind but I'd expect other symptoms too I think.