Derek Chauvin murder trial (Police officer who arrested George Floyd)

[robfosters]

Floyd's heart stopped while he was being restrained and that his death was a homicide caused by "cardiopulmonary arrest complicating law enforcement subdual, restraint, and neck compression", the neck compression, aka, strangulation.

Come get in the ring with me, I’ll go knee on neck on you and you tell me whether or not you feel like you are being strangled.

 

[dowie]

Jury selection was delayed today as there is an appeal at the state supreme court over whether or not a third-degree murder charge can still apply - apparently the prosecution think this is relevant re: jury selection (AFAIK this gets super tactical in the US) as I guess having this charge present gives a kind of better fall back option than manslaughter should the second-degree murder charge not stick.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-56325773

A US judge has delayed jury selection in the case of an ex-Minneapolis police officer accused of killing George Floyd, an unarmed black man, last May.

Derek Chauvin faces murder charges for kneeling on Mr Floyd's neck for over seven minutes in a widely-viewed video that sparked protests worldwide.

The delay came as the judge awaits an appeals court decision on whether a new murder charge can be added.

BBC has this slightly wrong in the above- this has already been heard by an appeal court - it's the state supreme court they're waiting on now.

"I can't breathe"

Could be a lie, he was fighting the police just prior.

Its not like he was an outstanding citizen with no reason to be believed...

Well that isn't something that the defence are allowed to bring up at the moment, their application to mention his previous crimes - threatening a pregnant woman with a gun during a house break-in won't be something the jury can hear.

On the other hand, the prosecution present them with details of Chauvin's previous complaints and has arranged some witnesses who have had previous encounters with him - I'm assuming they're not going to be too complimentary about him - though to be fair it does seem like he's the sort of cop who should have been sacked a while ago!

They need to remove knees on necks, and frankly anything to do with necks, from the American police handbook. How many deaths will make that clear?

They probably do but tbh.. it isn't actually all that clear that it caused the death here. I know it sounds counter-intuitive as we all saw him saying I can't breathe and the knee on the neck but he was saying that before he was even on the floor and he had a heart issue and a load of drugs in him - the problem the prosecution has is that the defence will put emphasis on that - note the medical examiner's comments from the article in the OP:

According to notes filed as evidence, the medical examiner told prosecutors that if Floyd had been “found dead at home alone and no other apparent causes,” it would have been “acceptable” to call his death an overdose. But, Baker added, “I am not saying this killed him.”

^^^ that is where the reasonable doubt comes in - they have a knee on the neck and the "I can't breathe", but the "I can't breathe" was shouted out before he was even on the ground and the drugs, heart problem, recent Covid infection etc.. mean they don't know for sure whether the knee on the neck killed him or whether his increased heart rate/panic etc.. combined with those other factors caused his death anyway.

IIRC even in the US it's banned in many areas but the police have got away with it because apparently if it's unsafe to do it with the knee it's unreasonable for an officer to assume that doing it with other parts of their leg is also unsafe, but then the way the US law protects police offices means that effectively they're deemed too stupid to understand what they're doing (as it's been ruled many times that unless they're trained specifically not to do something that any normal person would understand is dangerous/illegal, they're fine).

The complication here is that it seems it is permitted in this part of the US and is featured in the training materials for this particular police force, he's following his training etc.. is what the defence will likely argue.

 

[The Running Man]

I mean if this didn't cause outrage then we can only assume that this entire event is a racist witch hunt

 

[a1ex2001]

Can't wait for the fun and games when he gets found not guilty. Although that being said, how is the guy ever going to receive a fair trial?

What ever the outcome in court I predict plenty of fun and games, although I think he will be found guilty his apparent willingness to take a plea says his legal team are not confident.

 

[dirtychinchilla]

I mean if this didn't cause outrage then we can only assume that this entire event is a racist witch hunt

One dead white man doesn’t make the whole thing not-racist. I’m most opposed to the fact that American police seems to regularly kill people.

What is it with racists in this forum being worried about the agenda against them? We should be eradicating racism, no propping it up.

 

[dowie]

One dead white man doesn’t make the whole thing not-racist. I’m most opposed to the fact that American police seems to regularly kill people.

What is it with racists in this forum being worried about the agenda against them? We should be eradicating racism, no propping it up.

I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated that there was any racism in this incident or the other one someone has dropped in. The issue is more one of whether the police went too far or didn't do enough when the suspect had medical difficulties.

It blew up in the press as a result of perceptions of racism - the suspect happens to be black and there were three white police officers and one black police officer involved but it would be rather a lazy/flawed argument to simply claim "racism" every time a black person dies during a police encounter.

 

[Dis86]

I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated that there was any racism in this incident or the other one someone has dropped in. The issue is more one of whether the police went too far or didn't do enough when the suspect had medical difficulties.

It blew up in the press as a result of perceptions of racism - the suspect happens to be black and there were three white police officers and one black police officer involved but it would be rather a lazy/flawed argument to simply claim "racism" every time a black person dies during a police encounter.

Would you believe that men are about 20 times more likely to be killed by police than a woman is in the states?
Must be that inherent pro female sexism inherent in the majority male misogynistic police forces there...hollllld on a second!

 

[dirtychinchilla]

I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated that there was any racism in this incident or the other one someone has dropped in. The issue is more one of whether the police went too far or didn't do enough when the suspect had medical difficulties.

It blew up in the press as a result of perceptions of racism - the suspect happens to be black and there were three white police officers and one black police officer involved but it would be rather a lazy/flawed argument to simply claim "racism" every time a black person dies during a police encounter.

I actually agree with that. As per my other post, I think the wider issue is wtf the police think they’re doing.

However, some people in this forum seem intent on defending racists - not necessarily in the context of George Floyd’s murder.

 

[The Running Man]

I'm not sure anyone has demonstrated that there was any racism in this incident or the other one someone has dropped in. The issue is more one of whether the police went too far or didn't do enough when the suspect had medical difficulties.

It blew up in the press as a result of perceptions of racism - the suspect happens to be black and there were three white police officers and one black police officer involved but it would be rather a lazy/flawed argument to simply claim "racism" every time a black person dies during a police encounter.

One officer was of Chinese/Asian ethnicity. So 50% of the attending officers were NOT white.

But yeah its just racism...

 

[200sols]

One dead white man doesn’t make the whole thing not-racist. I’m most opposed to the fact that American police seems to regularly kill people.

Eh? Many more white people die than just one each year. Its only racism when it happens to black people?

 

[a1ex2001]

Eh? Many more white people die than just one each year. Its only racism when it happens to black people?

It is all police brutality but the disproportionate number of black men killed is an issue that is not possible to brush under the carpet. Policing in the states has serious issues with violence and the ease with which extreme force is deployed against particularly young black men.

 

[The Running Man]

It is all police brutality but the disproportionate number of black men killed is an issue that is not possible to brush under the carpet. Policing in the states has serious issues with violence and the ease with which extreme force is deployed against particularly young black men.

But you can demonstrate exactly the same force being used by officers against white people?

I just posted a video of it.

There were no riots. No investigation even..

 

[a1ex2001]

But you can demonstrate exactly the same force being used by officers against white people?

I just posted a video of it.

There were no riots. No investigation even..

There should have been though, the fact that one appalling piece of police brutality is over looked when another isn’t is wrong. However you can’t avoid the growing anger in the black community about the treatment of young black men by the US police it has been growing for years and has now bubbled over. Maybe it will take years of abuse of young white males before the anger about that bubbles over although I really hope not.

The evidence is clear a significant number of American police officers resort to the use of excessive force, including the use of fire arms, tasers and over zealous physical restraint too easily and that this is disproportionately felt by young black men.

This does not mean police violence against white men doesn’t matter or should be ignored in the same way that the ‘black lives matter’ slogan doesn’t mean white lives don’t matter or that a breast cancer awareness t-shirt doesn’t mean we should ignore testicular cancer.

 

[Dis86]

There should have been though, the fact that one appalling piece of police brutality is over looked when another isn’t is wrong. However you can’t avoid the growing anger in the black community about the treatment of young black men by the US police it has been growing for years and has now bubbled over. Maybe it will take years of abuse of young white males before the anger about that bubbles over although I really hope not.

The evidence is clear a significant number of American police officers resort to the use of excessive force, including the use of fire arms, tasers and over zealous physical restraint too easily and that this is disproportionately felt by young black men.

This does not mean police violence against white men doesn’t matter or should be ignored in the same way that the ‘black lives matter’ slogan doesn’t mean white lives don’t matter or that a breast cancer awareness t-shirt doesn’t mean we should ignore testicular cancer.

A white suspect is more likely to be killed than a black one...

 

[[FnG]magnolia]

Because ...

 

[Reality|Bites]

George is old news now, Trump has gone.

 

[robgmun]

What is it with racists in this forum. . .

There aren't any. You're just chasing phantoms.

 

[Reality|Bites]

it's racist to debate a topic?

 

[i-bert]

it's racist to debate a topic?

Jesus Christ man, where have you been?

 

[hurfdurf]

One officer was of Chinese/Asian ethnicity. So 50% of the attending officers were NOT white.

But yeah its just racism...

Ah ok sorry didn’t realise only white people could be racist, I always thought that was a common thing racists on here likes to trot out to try and make their white selves victimised.