When are you going fully electric?

[J1nxy]

We went for the Quartz Grey, they had a petrol version outside and my wife really liked it. It looks very smart with the red highlights and the interior is very good for what it is. We drove one on saturday and whilst it'll never set the world on fire from a performance prospective the drive was very good, its well spec'd and a decent size.

 

[DanTheMan]

Well I collected the corsa e yesterday and I have to say, I'm very impressed. I think the biggest hurdle will be getting over the fact that I own a Vauxhall corsa. It's absolutely nothing like the petrol versions I've driven previously and is amazingly refined compared to most comparable ICE cars.

Had a quick trip to tesco to get some free electricity and it was very straightforward. Also a bonus that the charging points tend to be in the quieter areas of the car park and quite near to the entrance.

Even in this class of EV, its amazing off the line. You hit 30mph before you know it and you look into your rear view mirror at the other cars just changing up to second.

 

[Robi_uk]

Are second hand electric cars a good idea? I was looking to get a cheap one for local run arounds.
I am just thinking if battery will be knackered and not give much range once they hit 5+ years?

 

[Basher]

Are second hand electric cars a good idea? I was looking to get a cheap one for local run arounds.
I am just thinking if battery will be knackered and not give much range once they hit 5+ years?

TBH I'd stick with petrol for a cheap runaround.

 

[Robi_uk]

TBH I'd stick with petrol for a cheap runaround.

Reason I was looking at the electric is because I can get a free business permit then and park anywhere. If I go petrol I would have to pay £600 for the permit.
Do you think after paying £600 for the permit a petrol will still work out cheaper?

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Are second hand electric cars a good idea? I was looking to get a cheap one for local run arounds.
I am just thinking if battery will be knackered and not give much range once they hit 5+ years?

EVs make great local run around but don’t expect to find anything cheap. A used Zoe or Leaf will be considerably more expensive to buy than an equivalent Clio etc. But on the flip side they also hold their value really well and very well equipped.

Even the oldest well used 10 year old Leaf will get 50 miles range in winter which fine for a local run around.

On the permit point, I’d make a spreadsheet and look at the total cost of ownership.

 

[J1nxy]

Well I collected the corsa e yesterday and I have to say, I'm very impressed. I think the biggest hurdle will be getting over the fact that I own a Vauxhall corsa. It's absolutely nothing like the petrol versions I've driven previously and is amazingly refined compared to most comparable ICE cars.

Had a quick trip to tesco to get some free electricity and it was very straightforward. Also a bonus that the charging points tend to be in the quieter areas of the car park and quite near to the entrance.

Even in this class of EV, its amazing off the line. You hit 30mph before you know it and you look into your rear view mirror at the other cars just changing up to second.

That sounds good. Really looking forward to picking up the Mokka next month, will sort the home charger in the next couple of weeks and we'll be all set.

 

[DanTheMan]

That sounds good. Really looking forward to picking up the Mokka next month, will sort the home charger in the next couple of weeks and we'll be all set.

I was admiring the Mokka when I collected our car. Its a lovely looking car and grey is definitely nicer than the green they offer.

The My Vauxhall app is not the most intuitive to use but I managed to pre condition the car so that my wife came out to a warm, defrosted car at 7:30 this morning. I'd recommend using the pod point app to set a charging schedule though as its easier to monitor usage through there.

 

[Basher]

Reason I was looking at the electric is because I can get a free business permit then and park anywhere. If I go petrol I would have to pay £600 for the permit.
Do you think after paying £600 for the permit a petrol will still work out cheaper?

I'd do the maths - but I suspect the premium on EV is far above that £600, so you'd almost certainly be better off with petrol. Also - how long does the permit last? If it's annual, you should also assume that the 'free for EV' offer won't last forever ...

 

[DanTheMan]

Yeah, the saving in running costs that I'll get from the EV won't negate the fact that I've spent 4 grand more than the equivalent petrol automatic version of the car.

I wanted to buy into the technology and needed to replace my aging fiesta. The running cost savings just go some way to negating the additional cost of an EV. It would take me 5 years to break even on fuel / electricity costs given my current mileage and energy prices.

 

[WJA96]

Yeah, the saving in running costs that I'll get from the EV won't negate the fact that I've spent 4 grand more than the equivalent petrol automatic version of the car.

I wanted to buy into the technology and needed to replace my aging fiesta. The running cost savings just go some way to negating the additional cost of an EV. It would take me 5 years to break even on fuel / electricity costs given my current mileage and energy prices.

Currently - no Road Fund Licence, generally very low servicing costs and sometimes reduced insurance costs are also significant savings. Insurance on Tesla’s are very high but other BEVs are often cheaper than the ICE equivalent.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Yeah, the saving in running costs that I'll get from the EV won't negate the fact that I've spent 4 grand more than the equivalent petrol automatic version of the car.

I wanted to buy into the technology and needed to replace my aging fiesta. The running cost savings just go some way to negating the additional cost of an EV. It would take me 5 years to break even on fuel / electricity costs given my current mileage and energy prices.

You need to factor in the depreciation, not the difference in price between the two cars.

The EV will be worth a lot more when you come to sell it, the battery modules alone are worth loads on the secondary market, breakers pay good money for them.

Even if the car is a complete shed, a working battery and motor will always keep its value pretty high because of how much they can go for used.

 

[Basher]

Currently - no Road Fund Licence, generally very low servicing costs and sometimes reduced insurance costs are also significant savings. Insurance on Tesla’s are very high but other BEVs are often cheaper than the ICE equivalent.

I wouldn't say those are significant savings over a run-around fiesta.

 

[DanTheMan]

You need to factor in the depreciation, not the difference in price between the two cars.

The EV will be worth a lot more when you come to sell it, the battery modules alone are worth loads on the secondary market, breakers pay good money for them.

Even if the car is a complete shed, a working battery and motor will always keep its value pretty high because of how much they can go for used.

Yeah, I have factored in depreciation to some extent but intend to keep this car at least until the battery warranty expires in 8 years. I didn't let it sway my decision or calculations at point of purchase but it was definitely a plus for EVs.

Currently - no Road Fund Licence, generally very low servicing costs and sometimes reduced insurance costs are also significant savings. Insurance on Tesla’s are very high but other BEVs are often cheaper than the ICE equivalent.

There's definitely savings to be had above and beyond fuel, I agree. Servicing on the corsa e is 16000 miles or 2 years, whereas the fiesta was annually. That's at least £100 a year saved.

Tax / RFL is £0 as opposed to £13 per month. It seems like a tiny amount but its half the monthly energy costs to run out EV based on current mileage.

I don't really know long term consumable costs of an EV compared to an ICE but things like clutch and belts obviously won't need doing. I believe brakes last a lot longer too when using regenerative braking?

I'm also willing to pay the premium to have a car the doesn't put out emissions wherever it goes. My daughter starts school in September and I'll feel a lot less guilty driving the mile to school and parking outside. I know it's a drop in the ocean but every little difference adds up.

 

[WJA96]

Yeah, I have factored in depreciation to some extent but intend to keep this car at least until the battery warranty expires in 8 years. I didn't let it sway my decision or calculations at point of purchase but it was definitely a plus for EVs.



There's definitely savings to be had above and beyond fuel, I agree. Servicing on the corsa e is 16000 miles or 2 years, whereas the fiesta was annually. That's at least £100 a year saved.

Tax / RFL is £0 as opposed to £13 per month. It seems like a tiny amount but its half the monthly energy costs to run out EV based on current mileage.

I don't really know long term consumable costs of an EV compared to an ICE but things like clutch and belts obviously won't need doing. I believe brakes last a lot longer too when using regenerative braking?

I'm also willing to pay the premium to have a car the doesn't put out emissions wherever it goes. My daughter starts school in September and I'll feel a lot less guilty driving the mile to school and parking outside. I know it's a drop in the ocean but every little difference adds up.

If you don’t do big mileages and you plan well, you can still charge for free in lots of locations. I know people who do 50-100 miles per week and have never paid for charging their car.

 

[FoxEye]

I can't see how they're going to follow through with banning sales of new petrol and diesel by 2030.

The volume of EV's being made is still a tiny fraction of new cars being made; EV's are still ridiculously expensive (30k for a cheap city car), used EVs are expensive and likely to need the battery replacing anyhow if it's seen a moderate amount of use..

Not to mention the chronic scarcity of EV charging points.

2030 isn't that far away and I just don't see anywhere near enough switchover to EVs right now, to make that target anything more than pie in the sky.

 

[RoboCod]

I can't see how they're going to follow through with banning sales of new petrol and diesel by 2030.

The volume of EV's being made is still a tiny fraction of new cars being made; EV's are still ridiculously expensive (30k for a cheap city car), used EVs are expensive and likely to need the battery replacing anyhow if it's seen a moderate amount of use..

Not to mention the chronic scarcity of EV charging points.

2030 isn't that far away and I just don't see anywhere near enough switchover to EVs right now, to make that target anything more than pie in the sky.

Exponential production, year on year. Then you have the likes of Tesla aiming for ~£20k models in the near future, other marques will follow suit.

The charge point issue has been discussed to death. It isn't chronic and most people will have a charge point at home.

The key point though is, as you said, sales of fossil fuel driven cars are banned, not the driving of them.

 

[SDK^]

I can't see how they're going to follow through with banning sales of new petrol and diesel by 2030.
The volume of EV's being made is still a tiny fraction of new cars being made;.

Several manufacturers have announced they won’t be making ICE cars beyond 2025, that will help change this!

 

[Judgeneo]

I can't see how they're going to follow through with banning sales of new petrol and diesel by 2030.

The volume of EV's being made is still a tiny fraction of new cars being made; EV's are still ridiculously expensive (30k for a cheap city car), used EVs are expensive and likely to need the battery replacing anyhow if it's seen a moderate amount of use..

Not to mention the chronic scarcity of EV charging points.

2030 isn't that far away and I just don't see anywhere near enough switchover to EVs right now, to make that target anything more than pie in the sky.

We'll never reach upfront cost parity with ICE, things are just going to be more expensive and less people will likely drive as a result.

 

[Jonnycoupe]

EU7 is pretty crippling in terms of ICE costs aswell though - a hurdle that’s approaching.

I can't see how they're going to follow through with banning sales of new petrol and diesel by 2030.

The volume of EV's being made is still a tiny fraction of new cars being made; EV's are still ridiculously expensive (30k for a cheap city car), used EVs are expensive and likely to need the battery replacing anyhow if it's seen a moderate amount of use..

Not to mention the chronic scarcity of EV charging points.

2030 isn't that far away and I just don't see anywhere near enough switchover to EVs right now, to make that target anything more than pie in the sky.

Happy to see the effort though. Not sure that target failing is actually a success in its own right.