Race report: 'UK not deliberately rigged against ethnic minorities'

[BowdonUK]

Jesus Bowdon have you been asleep for the last few months?

How about you read some of the stuff that argues against the latest race report?

I know I'm good. But I'm not Jesus good

I assume by the last few months your talking about the George Floyd court case? If so, that is in the US. We're not American, or at least I'm not. Did you watch the video I posted a few pages back about the 'Incident at Bamber Bridge'?

I've read the arguments back and forth, mostly by black people on both sides. I'm going to assume your white, like me. I've never seen any signs of systemic racism being enacted i.e any white structure with a purpose to keep ethnic minority people out of work/education. I'm asking have you? If you have then educate me on where you saw this happening? and what you did about it?

 

[Tony Edwards]

I know I'm good. But I'm not Jesus good

I assume by the last few months your talking about the George Floyd court case? If so, that is in the US. We're not American, or at least I'm not. Did you watch the video I posted a few pages back about the 'Incident at Bamber Bridge'?

I've read the arguments back and forth, mostly by black people on both sides. I'm going to assume your white, like me. I've never seen any signs of systemic racism being enacted i.e any white structure with a purpose to keep ethnic minority people out of work/education. I'm asking have you? If you have then educate me on where you saw this happening? and what you did about it?

No not Floyd. Im talking about the UK.

It really might help if you actually took in what is said by far more intelligent people than me.

any white structure with a purpose to keep ethnic minority people out of work/education

Tha is such a cop out. What you are describing is illegal.

Its not about bosses or teachers running around shouting i dont want any ******* working here, although it does happen..

 

[BowdonUK]

No not Floyd. Im talking about the UK.

Can you give me a clue for 2?

Are you talking about the BLM protests and the pulling down of statues?

 

[Hotwired]

This may give you a better understanding.

https://bsac.org.uk/covid-19-how-in...deadly-racism-at-the-heart-of-our-healthcare/

Being poor sucks and doing the low end jobs sucks.

But is being poor and BAME any worse than being poor and otherwise. Being poor and white and male is one of the worst performing categories in schools last I checked. Being rich and white and male might have the highest highs but there's no special perks for any flavour of poor.

 

[Tony Edwards]

Can you give me a clue for 2?

Are you talking about the BLM protests and the pulling down of statues?

No forget about protestors or BLM. Read what the runnymeade trust is saying, read what other charities/groups are saying. Read articles like the one I posted a few posts back. The protests are a reaction not the cause.

Its literally all that has been written about the last couple of months. Years if you are actually one of the people that accept that this stuff goes on.

 

[Tony Edwards]

Being poor sucks and doing the low end jobs sucks.

But is being poor and BAME any worse than being poor and otherwise. Being poor and white and male is one of the worst performing categories in schools last I checked.

Yes and as a country we also need to address those issues. The same government that is denying racism is denying poor people. Or at least manipulating the statistics in the same way.

Im just as suprised that no one gives a **** about racism as I am about those that dont really care about the poor.

Should we just not care about race while we are still ignoring the needs of poor white people?

Raising the standards for the poor will go a long way to answering a lot of issues with race.

https://www.theguardian.com/educati...e-clean-over-pupil-funding-changes-in-england

The government should “come clean” over its reduced funding for tens of thousands of disadvantaged pupils in England and repay the missing money to schools, according to the leader of the National Association of Head Teachers.

Paul Whiteman, the NAHT’s general secretary, is the latest figure to criticise the Department for Education’s change to cut-off dates for children to qualify for pupil premium funding which goes to schools. By moving the date back from January this year to last October, the government is estimated to have saved up to £200m, based on freedom of information requests sent to local authorities.

“It’s the wrong cut to make at any time, to make the poorest kids pay the price. But after a pandemic when we have seen massive disruption to children’s education, particularly children whose families have been hardest hit by the pandemic – because obviously we’re talking about kids whose parents may have lost their jobs and have gone on to some form of benefits or universal credit – to make it even harder for them to catch up is simply wrong.”

Nick Gibb, the schools minister, told MPs on the education select committee on Thursday that the totals being “bandied around” by newspapers and campaigners were likely to be inaccurate.

 

[Hotwired]

Yes and as a country we also need to address those issues. The same government that is denying racism is denying poor people. Or at least manipulating the statistics in the same way.

Im just as suprised that no one gives a **** about racism as I am about those that dont really care about the poor.

Should we just not care about race while we are still ignoring the needs of poor white people?

You're the one that linked a doctor describing primarily socioeconomic issues of being poor as racism.

It's just poor people issues! It doesn't get better if you're not BAME.

 

[Tony Edwards]

You're the one that linked a doctor describing primarily socioeconomic issues of being poor as racism.

It's just poor people issues! It doesn't get better if you're not BAME.

The difference is people can escape the problems they face from being poor.

Are you happy about the increase in numbers of the working poor?

 

[Skunkworks]

The Left/Right spectrum over the last 7-8 years has morphed from class into an Emotional/Practical spectrum. The Practical side says we’ve got this problem 99.9% sorted, and that’s pretty damn good. While the Emotional side blubbers over the 0.1%. The Emotional side uses vagaries of Systemic and Institutional because it’s based on feelings. The Practical reacts to stats and the quantifiable.

The modern Left is emotional/feminine, and the Right is practical/masculine. I’d even go as far to say that politics now has a genetic influence to it, and thus minds are unlikely to be changed.

EDIT: In a thread like this the emotional side wants to nurture and protect minorities because it views them as weak and helpless, like an infant.

 

[Demon]

I can see the conflict..


All reports agree that 'disparities' in the statistics are present and correct.. And all unanimously agree that something should be done about it..

What differs is that rather than the traditional/original definition of Institutional/Structural racism e.g. (From Wikipedia quoting the UK's 1999 lawrence report) "The collective failure of an organization to provide an appropriate and professional service to people because of their colour, culture, or ethnic origin. It can be seen or detected in processes, attitudes and behaviour that amount to discrimination through prejudice, ignorance, thoughtlessness, and racist stereotyping which disadvantage minority ethnic people" it's being replaced with this non-sensical and emotional redefinition..

What kind of awful individual must you be to deliberately view everyone in terms of 'colour' and actively postulate that not being of the right 'colour' warrants your plights meaningless.. Didn't that used to be called 'racism'?

 

[Reality|Bites]

 

[i-bert]

Nice. Not heard much decent hip hop lately. The stuff they play on BBC Radio 1 is utter ***** these days, I just listen to some old tracks.

I must be getting old.

 

[Reality|Bites]

I couldn't even tell you who's in the top 40 these days, young ones are their racket, back in my day yadda yadda
Only time I listen to the radio is when i'm in the back of a taxi or at the barbers

 

[BowdonUK]

No forget about protestors or BLM. Read what the runnymeade trust is saying, read what other charities/groups are saying. Read articles like the one I posted a few posts back. The protests are a reaction not the cause.

Its literally all that has been written about the last couple of months. Years if you are actually one of the people that accept that this stuff goes on.

I accept racism is going on. But what I've not seen is systemic racism i.e racism on a structural basis were white people are actively restricting ethnic minority people from life opportunities.

I was going to reply in my last post to a link webpage you posted in your reply to @FoxEye (by a group of mostly white people) saying that because ethnic minority people filled most of the low paid jobs in the NHS, 94%, and so were more likely to catch covid, that it is somehow evidence of systemic racism. No it's not. It is a systemic class issue. What about the 6% of white people who also were in those positions? They are inconvenient to the narrative trying to be pushed.

A week or so ago I was watching Chris Cuomo of CNN say after the George Floyd case that the situation with the police won't change until white people are being killed. Well, white people are being killed by the police. There is brutal video evidence of it. But no, a small but loud section of white society want to focus on race and don't want to actually solve the problem.

As to the reference of disability earlier. Just because all buildings aren't disability compliant I don't go around thinking its a conspiracy against disabled people as a whole.

 

[Narj]

There's some good stuff on that channel, cheers. I don't really like modern hip hop tbh but regardless of whatever message there's some sweet beats there. County Kid is good mang.

 

[explicit4u]

No it's not. It is a systemic class issue. What about the 6% of white people who also were in those positions? They are inconvenient to the narrative trying to be pushed.

It differs from country to country and society to society, but isn't class linked to culture and race?

As for the 6%, I wouldn't say they're inconvenient to the narrative but an anomaly that would be interesting to delve into. The simple argument that, for want of a better term, 'woke' people might use is that the 94% are there because of their race (amongst other things) but the 6% are there not because of their race but their class.

 

[FoxEye]

Should we just not care about race while we are still ignoring the needs of poor white people?

Raising the standards for the poor will go a long way to answering a lot of issues with race.

"Should we just not care about race...?"

YES, race should be meaningless.

Also if helping the poor will make "issues with race" largely go away, then they weren't issues with race in the first place, they were issues with poverty.

Again, this is people with an agenda, making everything about race. As others have said, it's an industry. Lots of people are heavily invested in race baiting.

Lots of people have been convinced they are where they are because of their race and nothing else. Which simultaneously disempowers them and builds racial divides where none need to exist.

The race baiters and those who see "systemic racism" everywhere are doing the most damage, tbh.

 

[Angilion]

"Should we just not care about race...?"

YES, race should be meaningless.

Also if helping the poor will make "issues with race" largely go away, then they weren't issues with race in the first place, they were issues with poverty.

Again, this is people with an agenda, making everything about race. As others have said, it's an industry. Lots of people are heavily invested in race baiting.

Lots of people have been convinced they are where they are because of their race and nothing else. Which simultaneously disempowers them and builds racial divides where none need to exist.

The race baiters and those who see "systemic racism" everywhere are doing the most damage, tbh.

To such an extent that I don't think they're doing it unintentionally. I think that they are racist. No, that's not true. I know they're racist because they believe in race, believe in biological group identity (which is the belief that "they're all the same" - adding the word 'identity' makes no change to the meaning as it was always implied) and believe that people should be treated extremely differently based solely on their "race". More accurately, on the racist stereotyping those people attach to their "they're all the same" belief. That I know about them. What I think about them is that they're knowingly and deliberately promoting racism and using claims of systemic racism as a tool for doing so. Blaming your victims is an extremely common part of irrational prejudices. Maybe always a part of them. It's the most effective way to "justify" irrational prejudice and discrimination - they deserve it because they're bad. It's fair and righteous to punish them!

 

[Hotwired]

The difference is people can escape the problems they face from being poor.

Are you happy about the increase in numbers of the working poor?

If you're going to abandon the doctor and his opinion that socioeconomic issues are racism then there's nothing further to disagree on.

I've been repeatedly positive about the idea of looking at issues of poverty if the report can defend its claim that institutional racism is not a meaningful factor holding people back.

 

[Tony Edwards]

To such an extent that I don't think they're doing it unintentionally. I think that they are racist. No, that's not true. I know they're racist because they believe in race, believe in biological group identity (which is the belief that "they're all the same" - adding the word 'identity' makes no change to the meaning as it was always implied) and believe that people should be treated extremely differently based solely on their "race". More accurately, on the racist stereotyping those people attach to their "they're all the same" belief. That I know about them. What I think about them is that they're knowingly and deliberately promoting racism and using claims of systemic racism as a tool for doing so. Blaming your victims is an extremely common part of irrational prejudices. Maybe always a part of them. It's the most effective way to "justify" irrational prejudice and discrimination - they deserve it because they're bad. It's fair and righteous to punish them!

I have to say I find your posts some of the strangest Ive read so far on this forum and you have a lot of competion.