20" widescreen decided on (finally) which model?

Dark_Angel · 6 Mar 2006 at 18:04

Hey,

Well, I have been debating on buying so many things, but finally decided that a nice widescreen monitor will be what I need. After using a terrible 15" monitor for a second screen for the past week, I dont think I could ever go to one screen. Its to nice using 2.

I am not certain which to go for though... I am leaning a lot towards the Belina, and I have given myself one more week to read reviews before parting with the money.

Just wanted to see if anyone could give me a recommendation? the monitor MUST have 2 inputs... I need 1 for the 360 and 1 for the PC, so obviously being able to switch between the 2 is important. I will be using it for almost everything, but games on the 360 and PC, plus photoshop and Maya PLE will be used as well. I may watch the odd movie too, but thats not the most important thing, as I have a TV out to a 28" CRT.

The only things that worries me with the Belinea is the backlight bleed, and the 360.... If I use the 360 on that screen, will it automatically use every pixel and be full screen, or will it only do a 1:1 ratio and leave bars everywhere? I am looking to spend about 350 - 400 max, but the Belinea or the phiilips seem to be leading the pack at the moment.

Raymond Lin · 6 Mar 2006 at 18:15

The philips has 2 inputs, can switch between the 2, and does scaling (the Belinea just fills the screen) so you can play games in its native res should you choose. They are the same price and when i was choosing I went with the philips, should you have a bigger budget, the NEC is an obvious candidate. It has the same features (panel too and 6ms instead of 8ms as well) and a glossy screen. The Belinea has report of blaclight bleeds, Philips has some too but nowhere as bad as the Belinea, the NEC does too from some user's experience. However it does seem the blacklight bleeds on the NEC is the least out of the 3.

igors · 6 Mar 2006 at 18:26

Yes, I can agree with Raymon. If you are on the budget: Philips, if not: NEC.

Another thing. We are not sure if Philips/NEC are sharing the same panel. NEC is using the AS-IPS panel with the LG.Philips 1600:1 control circuit. So, essentially panel is not the same and it's not just speed difference between the NEC/Philips. LG.Philips have also greatly improved the colours reproduction and picture quality with AS-IPS.

Maybe we just need the "firm" confirmation from Philips about the panel of this monitor, so that consumers know what they are buying.

Dark_Angel · 6 Mar 2006 at 18:28

When you say that philips does scaling, does that mean that it does:

1:1 (so in other words, if the image is only 1024x768, then you will only see a small portion of the screen used?

Full: so it maps every single pixel to a screen pixel, so there is no bars at all, and a 1024x768 (once again, an example) image will be mapped to 1680x1050 of the pixels on the screen? (and look quite pants while its at it)

Sorry mate, I am a complete noob to TFT's, I have only recently started to research them.

Raymond Lin · 6 Mar 2006 at 18:34

Dark_Angel said:
When you say that philips does scaling, does that mean that it does:

1:1 (so in other words, if the image is only 1024x768, then you will only see a small portion of the screen used?

Full: so it maps every single pixel to a screen pixel, so there is no bars at all, and a 1024x768 (once again, an example) image will be mapped to 1680x1050 of the pixels on the screen? (and look quite pants while its at it)

Sorry mate, I am a complete noob to TFT's, I have only recently started to research them.

It does both, check the Philips thread, there is an options in the screen that does it through Hardware. You can have it fill the screen no matter what res the computer is outputting or only use the res (1280x1024 etc).

Dark_Angel · 6 Mar 2006 at 18:37

Well thanks Raymond and Igors

I guess its the phillips or the NEC for me

What is the blacks like philips and the NEC?

Raymond Lin · 6 Mar 2006 at 18:47

I am very happy with mine, and so is igor with his NEC. We are both supporters of our choices, I think the variables here is the Glossy screen and the price. Both screen have very vibrant colours, and both fast enough for gaming, movies and windows apps.

igors · 6 Mar 2006 at 21:24

Dark_Angel said:
What is the blacks like philips and the NEC?

Well ... it's the tough one. For that comparison we have to have someone who can compare them side by side or someone who just upgraded from the Philips panel. I know for fact that in the new 1600:1 AS-IPS panel LG.Philips also integrated the DCE (Digital Contrast Enhancer), which reduces the black luminance. If you care about the blacks, you may see improvements here and my review is definitely confirming that technology is working.

Again, for now ... we just don't have the direct comparison.

fish99 · 6 Mar 2006 at 22:13

Anyone know exactly how that DCE works? I know it doesn't actually affect real measurable black depth (according to BeHardware) but does it do something like give the impression of a deeper black by brightenning up the lighter parts of the picture? So effectively the same as if you loaded a photo into photoshop and changed the contrast of the picture.

It's just that while that would work in some situations, it wouldn't work in others. If you were in a very dark area in a game, but where there was still a little ambient light, and you were playing in a pitch dark room, applying some sort of contrast filter wouldn't spot you noticing that the fundamental blackest black was still way too bright (0.40 cd/m2 I believe on the NEC).

igors · 6 Mar 2006 at 23:03

fish99 said:
Anyone know exactly how that DCE works? I know it doesn't actually affect real measurable black depth (according to BeHardware) but does it do something like give the impression of a deeper black by brightenning up the lighter parts of the picture? So effectively the same as if you loaded a photo into photoshop and changed the contrast of the picture.

Honestly, I would like to have same spec of the complete DFC engine, just for my own education. Not sure, maybe NEC will uncover everything on the Cebit (or after). From what I can tell, when you look at the Advanced DVM FEAR comparisons pictures from my review ... the perceptive view is that black is more black (of course I can't measure it and maybe it's not important as perceptive vision is something that counts). Interestingly enough it's not brightening the other parts of the screen (lights, textures or anything else). When it's ON ... scene is even more balanced and nothing is standing out of the crowd (colour and brightness wise). For me it's more "pleasant" as I personally like balanced colours.

fish99 said:
It's just that while that would work in some situations, it wouldn't work in others. If you were in a very dark area in a game, but where there was still a little ambient light, and you were playing in a pitch dark room, applying some sort of contrast filter wouldn't spot you noticing that the fundamental blackest black was still way too bright (0.40 cd/m2 I believe on the NEC).

Of course, when you are in the pitch black room black luminance is more pronounced than in the situation when you have slight ambient light in the room. On the other hand, I had the same situation as this on my old 740SB CRT. What I'm trying to say is that engine is not messing up with the screen picture in such way that it *may* look unnatural or distracting, at least from my point of view.

Anyhow, maybe this thinking should go to the NEC review page, where others can propose their opinion about the DFC engine.

Baddass · 6 Mar 2006 at 23:26

i would guess that it turns up some brighter areas to give the perception of a deeper black and more contrast between the light and dark areas. It seems to do the job quite well, and you can tell some differences from the pictures that igors refers to as well.