Champions League 1st/2nd May Spoilers

Scream · 2 May 2007 at 00:49

If a team wins it's league but can't do well in the CL, it suggests that the club overall are not the best team. When a team gets into the final, it shows that they have battled with the best in Europe and if that team wins, proves that they are the best in europe regardless of how well they did in their domestic league.

lemonkettaz · 2 May 2007 at 00:49

Chelsea were rubbish tonight like...

All the pressure has definitely beaten them...

Liverpool werent great.. but had more in the tank at the end of the day.

Well done anyways to Liverpool....

BaZ87 · 2 May 2007 at 00:49

chesterstu said:
I comment of JM i agree with is that liverpool are a cup team. All real evidence suggests this. I challenge LFC fans to come up wiht evidewnce to the contrary this side of 1995.

When JM leaves out his 3 best attacking players for the Bolton game it shows he was only concentrating on the CL this year too, up until then the one thing ive liked about JM is that he plays to win every game but JG put me right on that and said that this season its the CL they're concentrating on.

JM has no right to moan at us for concentrating on just the CL when he's done the same.

Sean_UK · 2 May 2007 at 00:51

New owners who are loving their purchase from what ive seen off them, bright future for Liverpool ineed so you wont be able to dredge up the age old Premiership talk.

Winning the league means nothing to rest of europe, they only remember the teams who win the big one.

Tute · 2 May 2007 at 00:51

Scream said:
If a team wins it's league but can't do well in the CL, it suggests that the club overall are not the best team. When a team gets into the final, it shows that they have battled with the best in Europe and if that team wins, proves that they are the best in europe regardless of how well they did in their domestic league.

Load of rubbish.

It's possible for any old tripe to win the CL simply by getting lucky for a dozen or so games.

In the Premiership you need to play consistently well for almost 40 games.

This rant is not aimed at any team in particular, I just think it's far more impressive to win your league than some convoluted competition where your opponents are picked by seeding.

-|ScottFree|- · 2 May 2007 at 00:58

chesterstu said:
I comment of JM i agree with is that liverpool are a cup team. All real evidence suggests this. I challenge LFC fans to come up wiht evidewnce to the contrary this side of 1995.

We have been in the top four for many seasons since 1995.. is that evidence enough.

Chelsea would have suffered the same fate as Leeds if it were not for Red Roman. Please dont talk to me about 1995, you were mid table mediocrity for decades. Chelsea have only been a force since 2003 when Roman ploughed 100's of millions into the club...honestly!!!

Scream · 2 May 2007 at 00:59

Tute said:
Load of rubbish.

It's possible for any old tripe to win the CL simply by getting lucky for a dozen or so games.

In the Premiership you need to play consistently well for almost 40 games.

This rant is not aimed at any team in particular, I just think it's far more impressive to win your league than some convoluted competition where your opponents are picked by seeding.

Nonsense.

Oh god the word 'Lucky' has been brought up.

-|ScottFree|- · 2 May 2007 at 01:00

Tute said:
Load of rubbish.

It's possible for any old tripe to win the CL simply by getting lucky for a dozen or so games.

Unless its the team you support and then its pure skill, tenacity, flair, and footballing excellence... give me a break!!!

Scream · 2 May 2007 at 01:01

-|ScottFree|- said:
We have been in the top four for many seasons since 1995.. is that evidence enough.

Chelsea would have suffered the same fate as Leeds if it were not for Red Roman. Please dont talk to me about 1995, you were mid table mediocrity for decades. Chelsea have only been a force since 2003 when Roman ploughed 100's of millions into the club...honestly!!!

Agreed!

You don't get into Europes elite by being a cup team. Is Chelsea in there? Nowhere in sight.

chesterstu · 2 May 2007 at 01:11

Scream said:
Agreed!

You don't get into Europes elite by being a cup team. Is Chelsea in there? Nowhere in sight.

No it's not proof enough. Winning the league is about being consistent over 38 games. Liverpool don't manage this, look at the poor start to the past couple of season. To win the CL or Fa cup you need to be good over a max of what 12 games. When you are clearly not going to win the league by the February or March where else are they going to concentrate their efforts?

Edit: Thinking about that again how many times have Chelsea won the title in the past 3yrs but reached the CL semis and/or won a domestic cup? And how many time have Liverpool won a cup/the CL but finished only in the top 4 in the last 3 years?

Tute · 2 May 2007 at 01:15

chesterstu said:
No it's not proof enough. Winning the league is about being consistent over 38 games. Liverpool don't manage this, look at the poor start to the past couple of season. To win the CL or Fa cup you need to be good over a max of what 12 games. When you are clearly not going to win the league by the February or March where else are they going to concentrate their efforts?

Exactly. If Liverpool had tried harder in the league then they would have been out of the CL by February. It was good tactics by Benitez, to concentrate on what's important to him.

But the point is, being consistant over 12 games spaced out over a season is nothing compared to being consistant over 38.

[Edit] And Sunama is spot on as well.

sunama · 2 May 2007 at 01:15

Scream said:
If a team wins it's league but can't do well in the CL, it suggests that the club overall are not the best team. When a team gets into the final, it shows that they have battled with the best in Europe and if that team wins, proves that they are the best in europe regardless of how well they did in their domestic league.

Gotta disagree on that one.

League is the most important thing to win. If you win the CL but get beat by 20pts in your domestic league it shows that quite a few teams in your own country have beaten you and by no means can it be said you are the best in Europe or even your own country.

If a team is genuinely good then it will win its domestic league and the CL - like Porto, Man Utd, Juventus did in the past. Even if you win the CL and narrowly get beat in your domestic league you could be classified as being the best in EU. But in Liverpool's case, to be so far off the pace (approx 20pts off Man Utd), even if they win the CL, they cannot be said to be the best in EU. Right now, they are a Cup team. Man Utd are the real deal - competing on all fronts, taking on all-comers.

The problem with Liverpool fans is that they live off of past (70's & 80's) glories, too much.

WushuMaster · 2 May 2007 at 01:30

In any case, all that is academic. We're going to Athens, Chelsea would have loved to have been going. Mourinho will go to the wrestling at Earls Court.

Also, I thought Zenden played actually quite, well..... good! In Rafa we trust.

Sean_UK · 2 May 2007 at 01:31

sunama said:
The problem with Liverpool fans is that they live off of past (70's & 80's) glories, too much.

Hmm, correct me if im wrong; Liverpool have won the most trophys both domestic and euro since 2001, not bad for the so called 'past glorys' team.

chesterstu · 2 May 2007 at 01:34

Sean_UK said:
Hmm, correct me if im wrong; Liverpool have won the most trophys both domestic and euro since 2001, not bad for the so called 'past glorys' team.

Clearly not a Liverpool historian because that is more wrong than a Thai lady boy. Kopites will tell you they have won more league titles than any other team but when was there last one?

Sean_UK · 2 May 2007 at 01:39

Trophys 'since 2001' i said (talking english teams here :rolleyes:

), and its correct btw just Google it.

sunama · 2 May 2007 at 01:40

Liverpool can win all the Coca Cola (or whatever they call it these days) cups it wants to. It still wont equal a single League Championship.

hittman · 2 May 2007 at 01:44

if man utd are in the final, I think man utd will beat liverpool. If AC are in the final, liverpool will win. just my prediction.

chesterstu · 2 May 2007 at 01:44

Sean_UK said:
Trophys 'since 2001' i said (talking english teams here ), and its correct btw just Google it.

I did and give you ninja goggling skills benefit but still couldn't find anything but the triple they won. That adds to their trophy count but is not it. I work with Kopites on a day to day basis and they live solidly in the late 70s and early 80s

rdizzle · 2 May 2007 at 01:52

Sean_UK said:
Hmm, correct me if im wrong; Liverpool have won the most trophys both domestic and euro since 2001, not bad for the so called 'past glorys' team.

fair enough thats true....when did you last win the premiership btw?

Champions League 1st/2nd May *Spoilers*

Champions League 1st/2nd May Spoilers