93 pub smoking days left in the U.K.

[Tru]

OK, I'm interested to see why you're against this so much. I take it you're a smoker - if you're not that it's a little odd to see you batting for the smoking side unless you enjoy passive smoking.

The thing is, if I still smoked my attitude would definitely be 'how dare they do this, *** them all!' but now that I don't smoke I see it as soooo annoying when people do.

I think it's all a moot point really: come September everyone will have forgotten about it. It's just the first few weeks that will be the hardest for people who smoke.

Sure, I'm a smoker, not a heavy one by all means (last tab I was about 7 am Sunday), but I really enjoy smoking while I drink. I'm also part of the management of a social club that has been hit hard by the ban.

Our club is a members only establishment, we all pay our fees and have a key for the door. 80% of the punters (and staff) smoke, and the other 20% couldn't care if we were smoking crack. Yet we're not allowed to do it? I can't agree with that. We have a lot of old boys in the club, these guys can barely walk to the bar so asking them to stand outside to smoke a roll up is out of the question, they just don't come down any more.

There are aspects of the ban I enjoy, my clothes don't stink, I'm more inclined to sit outside, smoking areas are the best place to meet women in clubs, but, for the Executive to come in so heavy handed is bang out of order. Self employed taxi drivers can't have an off-duty smoke in their own bloody cars for Christ sake, the cars they paid for and earn their living from! It's madness.

Also, the post of mine you quoted, I was just correcting him, the licence trade is not up in Scotland or Ireland, I'm happy to debate as long as people don't make stuff up.

 

[Tru]

I said before in another thread that I can remember when -
Teachers smoked in class
Doctors smoked in their surgeries
Dentists smoked just before pulling your teeth
The school nurse smoked while giving you a jab
A consultant would be puffing on his pipe by your hospital bed
You could hardly see the film because of the smoke in a cinema
etc etc

After a year we'll all wonder why people ever smoked in pubs.

I remember you posting that before and someone of similar age debunking it, especially the bit about doctors and dentists. My old man has been teaching for near 40 years and he certainly disagrees.

 

[KNiVES]

Doesn't matter. Smoking is getting banned anyway, and about time.

 

[Tru]

Doesn't matter. Smoking is getting banned anyway, and about time.

Smoking isn't getting banned.

 

[Naffa]

Well in enclosed public spaces.

 

[Tru]

No, not rolleyes.

 

[Tru]

"The final nails have now been hammered into the coffin of the freedom to smoke in enclosed public places. This piece of legislation must be one of the most restrictive, spiteful and socially divisive imposed by any British Government. It was totally unnecessary because viable alternatives exist to achieve the same objectives but the Government were deaf to these alternatives and refused to consider them seriously.

Instead this supine Government and Parliament capitulated to the bigoted anti-smoking lobby which used junk science, a battery of doubtful statistics and unwarranted and unproven assertions by the medical profession that frightened the general public into believing that a mere whiff of tobacco smoke would give them cancer or some other nasty disease.

This witch-hunt of smokers has set the stage for attacks on other lifestyles especially drinking alcohol, being overweight, children's eating regimes, motoring etc and these witch-hunts are undermining the free and tolerant society which Britain has been noted for over such a long period of time.

People disregard the withdrawal of rights they have enjoyed for so long at their peril and I admire the courage and commitment of "Freedom to Choose" who are continuing the fight against authoritarianism, including their attempt to get a judicial review of the smoking ban. I wish them every success"

Lord Stoddart of Swindon
9th March 2007

http://www.freedom2choose.co.uk/

 

[Zip]

Apparently Smoking in Clubs and Pubs and other venues Will be banned in Australia around June or July.


YAY!!!!

 

[Tru]

Apparently Smoking in Clubs and Pubs and other venues Will be banned in Australia around June or July.


YAY!!!!

In Australia, the sun gives more people cancer every year than passive smoking does, should that also be banned?

 

[Zip]

In Australia, the sun gives more people cancer every year than passive smoking does, should that also be banned?

No because the sun doesnt smell bad and is easilly avoided

 

[Tru]

No because the sun doesnt smell bad and is easilly avoided

The sun makes people sweat, ask anyone in Scotland or Ireland what it's like being in a room full of sweaties when theres no smoke to mask the whiff.

What about all the workers who have to serve food to people on patios and verandas? They get exposed to the sun for no good reason. After all, eating outside is easily avoidable.

 

[Lysander]

http://www.freedom2choose.co.uk/

Bllaaaahahh yawn. It's like you are to smoking what Burnsey is to Microsoft licensing.

 

[Zip]

The sun makes people sweat, ask anyone in Scotland or Ireland what it's like being in a room full of sweaties when theres no smoke to mask the whiff.

What about all the workers who have to serve food to people on patios and verandas? They get exposed to the sun for no good reason. After all, eating outside is easily avoidable.

You do know what patios and verandas are dont you?

You will more then likely have a roof over your head at all times if you are serving under one of them, Especially a veranda

Plus your Argument fails because you cant ban the sun, Its not man made, It can not be taken away and can not be controled.

 

[Nitefly]

In Australia, the sun gives more people cancer every year than passive smoking does, should that also be banned?

Fingers on Head.

Fingers on shoulders.

Fingers on lips.

 

[semi-pro waster]

In Australia, the sun gives more people cancer every year than passive smoking does, should that also be banned?

Nah, not even close to being the same thing I'm afraid. You compare something that is naturally occurring with that of smoke. You can take precautions against both certainly but one is a state of affairs that will always exist and the other requires intervention by man to create the risk/problem.

The sun makes people sweat, ask anyone in Scotland or Ireland what it's like being in a room full of sweaties when theres no smoke to mask the whiff.

Not noticed it, being in a room full of sweaty people can certainly be unpleasant but having gone out pretty regularly since the ban the smell is subjectively much less and the atmosphere more pleasant.

What about all the workers who have to serve food to people on patios and verandas? They get exposed to the sun for no good reason. After all, eating outside is easily avoidable.

It is easily avoidable but some exposure to sun is necessary for Vitamin D(I think it is) and aside from that the employer could provide sun cream easily and cheaply for the employees were it necessary.

 

[Tru]

You do know what patios and verandas are dont you?

You will more then likely have a roof over your head at all times if you are serving under one of them, Especially a veranda

Plus your Argument fails because you cant ban the sun, Its not man made, It can not be taken away and can not be controled.

Don't patronise me. Just because you stick the get-out smiley at the end of a line doesn't make it OK.

People sit outside so they can catch the sun, (which does not only come vertically down), your argument fails. Patios, verandas, terraces, pavements, the terms are irrelevant, address the point.

 

[Tru]

Nah, not even close to being the same thing I'm afraid. You compare something that is naturally occurring with that of smoke. You can take precautions against both certainly but one is a state of affairs that will always exist and the other requires intervention by man to create the risk/problem.



Not noticed it, being in a room full of sweaty people can certainly be unpleasant but having gone out pretty regularly since the ban the smell is subjectively much less and the atmosphere more pleasant.



It is easily avoidable but some exposure to sun is necessary for Vitamin D(I think it is) and aside from that the employer could provide sun cream easily and cheaply for the employees were it necessary.

Scientist don't actually know the safe level for exposure to the sun to avoid skin cancer, and it's the same for passive smoking. Sure, the propaganda would have you believe one whiff of tobacco smoke is going to kill you, how do we know peeking out your window won't give you melanoma? Scientifically speaking, we don't.

Of course I'm not proposing we blot out the sun, but if we were to apply the anti-smoking legislation to other leisure pursuits, we'd be in a right old state.

It was all over the news today that the boffins are suggesting we dress head to toe in denim or wool to protect ourselves, as squirting some cream on our skin doesn't actually protect us from anything.

edit:

Will you cover up in the sun?

Skin specialists are warning there is no evidence sun lotions protect against the deadliest forms of cancer.

Experts think we should cover up instead with a pair of jeans and a hat. Denim, wool and polyester are the most effective fabrics.

Tanning lotion is fine for stopping sunburn and less dangerous cancers but won't prevent melanomas.

Around 2,000 people die from the deadliest form of skin cancer in Britain every year.

 

[Zip]

Don't patronise me. Just because you stick the get-out smiley at the end of a line doesn't make it OK.

People sit outside so they can catch the sun, (which does not only come vertically down), your argument fails. Patios, verandas, terraces, pavements, the terms are irrelevant, address the point.

You need sunlight to survive, Like Semi-pro waster said, You need it fro Vitamin D.

People that work outside are probably healthier then the office jobs.

Working out side is also usually put as an incentive when an advertisement is sent out.
You never see places putting up an Advertisement saying "Get to enjoy a nice room for of passive Smoke" used to attracted people.

Most skin cancers are caused due to people going out in summer and getting burn over and over again to get a tan or just because they dont put suncream on

 

[Nitefly]

It was all over the news today that the boffins are suggesting we dress head to toe in denim or wool to protect ourselves, as squirting some cream on our skin doesn't actually protect us from anything.

That didn't happen to be from unpublished data did it?

 

[Zip]

Scientist don't actually know the safe level for exposure to the sun to avoid skin cancer

Its 15-30 minutes before the sun starts to tan or burn your skin.