*** AMD "Zen" thread (inc AM4/APU discussion) ***

[Panos]

So true hehe




The whole removing the ccx is a nice leap forward for amd and I’m looking forward to the 4000 series cpu I’m just hoping that my 3900x will hold its resale value better then previous generation CPU’s and being amd just drop it into my x570

My 3900X is promised as gift to my brother to upgrade from the 1800X. So have nothing to worry about resale value
Tbh I believe there are going to hold their value well, especially on years to come as the upgrade path is pretty vast from the 6 core to 12 and 16 core CPUs.
Let alone all those still on 7y old quad cores with low budgets.

This isn't upgrading from one quad core to the next or one 6 core to the other one.
The jumps in cores and performance is pretty huge and the width of possible SKUs for someone to upgrade pretty big compared to the past.

 

[TrM]

My 3900X is promised as gift to my brother to upgrade from the 1800X. So have nothing to worry about resale value
Tbh I believe there are going to hold their value well, especially on years to come as the upgrade path is pretty vast from the 6 core to 12 and 16 core CPUs.
Let alone all those still on 7y old quad cores with low budgets.

This isn't upgrading from one quad core to the next or one 6 core to the other one.
The jumps in cores and performance is pretty huge and the width of possible SKUs for someone to upgrade pretty big compared to the past.

got to say that’s nice gift for your brother

 

[Panos]

got to say that’s nice gift for your brother

Yup.
My brother hasn't bought components for his PC the last 16 years and always is around a gen behind.

 

[4K8KW10]

What's the difference between Chipset driver 1.11.22.0454 released on 25 Nov, and 1.09.27.1033 released in September if both share exactly the same component drivers?

 

[4K8KW10]

45W Core i9-10980HK 8-core/16-thread SCS: 5490, MCS: 31738 https://wccftech.com/intel-core-i9-10980hk-8-core-5-ghz-mobility-cpu-benchmarks/
15W Ryzen 7 4700U 8-core/8-thread SCS: 4910, MCS: 21693 https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/15154654
65W Ryzen 7 3700X 8-core/16-thread SCS: 5881, MCS: 36977 https://browser.geekbench.com/v4/cpu/15153086

 

[opethdisciple]

A beta bios for my x370 board appeared over the weekend so they are in the pipeline.

(25 Nov 2019 at 13:42)

Lolz... still blooming waiting on this!

 

[4K8KW10]

(25 Nov 2019 at 13:42)

Lolz... still blooming waiting on this!

Unfortunately, Acer failed once again. The last BIOS update for AN515-42 is from 4 September https://www.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/support-product/7605?b=1&pn=NH.Q3RAA.002

Not to mention that they haven't yet fixed the NVME M.2 support, it still supports only SATA drives on the M.2 slot, while the very same models with intel processors do support NVME drives on their M.2 slots.

It's total mess - some models support ONLY NVME M.2, others ONLY SATA M.2, maybe some NVME and SATA lols!

 

[4K8KW10]

Interesting summary for the performance improvements achieved from Zen to Zen 3:

The Ultimate Zen: AMD's Zen 3 Achieves 89% Higher Performance Than First-generation Zen | TechPowerUp

 

[4K8KW10]

Little update in this thread.
The architecture of AMD's Zen 3 Cezanne APU is shared:


AMD Ryzen 5 5600G APU Die Shots Published

 

[4K8KW10]

"Apparently, AMD processors officially compatible with Windows 11, exhibit a three-times increase in L3 cache latency with the new operating system. The new operating system is also found to break the "preferred cores" system on AMD processors (UEFI CPPC2), in which the two "best" CPU cores, which can sustain the highest boost frequencies, are highlighted to the operating system, so most of the light-threaded traffic could be sent to them.

AMD and Microsoft jointly made this discovery, and listed out potential impact on application performance. The increased L3 cache latency affects performance of applications sensitive to memory performance. They also warn of a 10-15% loss in gaming performance. On the other hand, a dysfunctional "preferred cores" system would mean reduced performance in light-threaded tasks as the OS is unaware which are the processor's two best cores. Thankfully, both issues can be fixed via software updates, and AMD is working with Microsoft to push fixes for both issues through Windows Update, in an update rollout scheduled within October 2021."

AMD Processors Lose 15% Gaming Performance with Windows 11, L3 Cache Latency Tripled | TechPowerUp


AMD needs to aggressively lower its prices. A threat is coming:


Intel Core i7-12700K crosses 800 points in CPU-Z benchmark - VideoCardz.com

Core i5 12th gen with 16 threads will definitely be better than the old poor 12-thread Ryzen 5 5600X.

 

[Harlequin]

Intel will also be effected then, as they also use exactly the same preferred core mechanism in all cpu`s up to ADL.

 

[Armageus]

Thankfully, both issues can be fixed via software updates, and AMD is working with Microsoft to push fixes for both issues through Windows Update, in an update rollout scheduled within October 2021.

A fix has already been rolled out to insiders, it's only the release channel that is affected (and is yet another reason why people shouldn't be jumping onto Windows 11 yet)

AMD needs to aggressively lower its prices. A threat is coming:

Yawn

 

[muziqaz]

"Apparently, AMD processors officially compatible with Windows 11, exhibit a three-times increase in L3 cache latency with the new operating system. The new operating system is also found to break the "preferred cores" system on AMD processors (UEFI CPPC2), in which the two "best" CPU cores, which can sustain the highest boost frequencies, are highlighted to the operating system, so most of the light-threaded traffic could be sent to them.

AMD and Microsoft jointly made this discovery, and listed out potential impact on application performance. The increased L3 cache latency affects performance of applications sensitive to memory performance. They also warn of a 10-15% loss in gaming performance. On the other hand, a dysfunctional "preferred cores" system would mean reduced performance in light-threaded tasks as the OS is unaware which are the processor's two best cores. Thankfully, both issues can be fixed via software updates, and AMD is working with Microsoft to push fixes for both issues through Windows Update, in an update rollout scheduled within October 2021."

AMD Processors Lose 15% Gaming Performance with Windows 11, L3 Cache Latency Tripled | TechPowerUp


AMD needs to aggressively lower its prices. A threat is coming:


Intel Core i7-12700K crosses 800 points in CPU-Z benchmark - VideoCardz.com

Core i5 12th gen with 16 threads will definitely be better than the old poor 12-thread Ryzen 5 5600X.

No, Microsoft needs to actually start releasing "release" worthy software. Simple as that. AMD had their things sorted with Win10. CPUs were available for devs. Why wasn't this sorted before the release? Did Intel gobble the whole Dev team to come up with solution for their big.shitle design?
AMD does not need to drop the prices, as they will sell everything they make regardless how that "threat" from Intel turns out. I remember last "threat" from Intel was a complete bust.
On the other hand, Intel needs to start designing a decent CPUs instead of slapping things together and ignoring the power consumption.

 

[4K8KW10]

No, Microsoft needs to actually start releasing "release" worthy software. Simple as that. AMD had their things sorted with Win10. CPUs were available for devs. Why wasn't this sorted before the release? Did Intel gobble the whole Dev team to come up with solution for their big.shitle design?
AMD does not need to drop the prices, as they will sell everything they make regardless how that "threat" from Intel turns out. I remember last "threat" from Intel was a complete bust.
On the other hand, Intel needs to start designing a decent CPUs instead of slapping things together and ignoring the power consumption.

Microsoft needs to stop the illegal promotions of Intel hardware! As simple as that.

 

[humbug]

No, Microsoft needs to actually start releasing "release" worthy software. Simple as that. AMD had their things sorted with Win10. CPUs were available for devs. Why wasn't this sorted before the release? Did Intel gobble the whole Dev team to come up with solution for their big.shitle design?
AMD does not need to drop the prices, as they will sell everything they make regardless how that "threat" from Intel turns out. I remember last "threat" from Intel was a complete bust.
On the other hand, Intel needs to start designing a decent CPUs instead of slapping things together and ignoring the power consumption.

You would think Microsoft would work with all vendors to insure everything is good with them? You know, Q&A.

How did Intel get exclusive access to what should have been available to everyone as a matter of course?

 

[4K8KW10]

You would think Microsoft would work with all vendors to insure everything is good with them? You know, Q&A.

How did Intel get exclusive access to what should have been available to everyone as a matter of course?

Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology. - YouTube

 

[Destination]

You would think Microsoft would work with all vendors to insure everything is good with them? You know, Q&A.

How did Intel get exclusive access to what should have been available to everyone as a matter of course?

It would appear intel wrote mass parts of win10, and indeed, likely will be writing mass parts of win11.
There will be no surprise if somehow the 'intelscheduler' manages to screw the pooch for an amd product.
Will prove interesting to see.

 

[jigger]

It would appear intel wrote mass parts of win10, and indeed, likely will be writing mass parts of win11.
There will be no surprise if somehow the 'intelscheduler' manages to screw the pooch for an amd product.
Will prove interesting to see.

I can’t see MS allowing it. Have to keep the master race happy, or all other versions of Windows become relevant again.

 

[Destination]

I can’t see MS allowing it. Have to keep the master race happy, or all other versions of Windows become relevant again.

Well oddly the launch bug confirms it, magically ryzen perf nerfed by 15% until fixed, and that an obvious issue, before you go in millions of lines of code they didn't write.

 

[jigger]

Well oddly the launch bug confirms it, magically ryzen perf nerfed by 15% until fixed, and that an obvious issue, before you go in millions of lines of code they didn't write.

Which build of Windows?