Declining attitude to law and order

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Caporegime
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Exactly, with current crime rates imagine a 50% + ethnically diverse population. It could be chaos out there.

Poverty attracts criminality, even Aristotle understood this, yet here you are.

I pose the question, why is it that somewhere like Singapore with a larger demographic divergence, isn't currently 'chaotic'?
 
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Caporegime
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Poverty attracts criminality, even Aristotle understood this, yet here you are.

Free housing, free education, free food, free health care.


We aren't talking absolute poverty here. We are taking about all the basics plus more being provided free of charge.

The starving people of Somalia live in poverty. The people living in council flats in Brixton are not.
 
Caporegime
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Free housing, free education, free food, free health care.


We aren't talking absolute poverty here. We are taking about all the basics plus more being provided free of charge.

The starving people of Somalia live in poverty. The people living in council flats in Brixton are not.

Do you really think the people being exploited here are wondering about their subsidised life?
 
Caporegime
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Somebody puts them there. But clearly they do not live in life threatening poverty before they do...

They don't need to live in 'life-threatening poverty', there merely has to be a perception of inequality and unsuccessful escape paths (schools which are filled with peers who may be in gangs). Nothing about this is particularly rational, it's entirely a self-imposed environment where the mother (father is likely screwed up from years of this environment) is far too busy earning a wage in however many jobs they may have.

Now i'll admit that this isn't as stark as say in the US (Chicago/LA in particular) because the UK has better provisions, police and no gun culture, but it's no less cyclical and once it begins it's hard to stop. I'll also admit that less immigration into these areas is probably sensible, however it won't do anything to actually stop the cycle of violence revolving around the people who're already suffering from it.

Though if we're talking about cost to the tax payer (which a lot of these families are, even if they're not net tax-payers, most of the country isn't), then just responding with more and more draconian actions is going to cost more in the long run. So frankly, if all you want to do is hurt these people who are themselves victims of a sordid environment, then as far as i'm concerned you're only endeavouring to hurt yourself in the process (more taxes, more victims).

How far are you willing to go? ID card system? Curfews? Regularly armed police? Presumed guilt? For-profit prisons? No benefit system for anyone? If it doesn't work in the US, why would it suddenly work in the UK?

Anyway as ever, I don't actually expect to change anyone's mind. You have reason to be angry, I just fundamentally disagree with the solutions.
 
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Caporegime
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They don't need to live in 'life-threatening poverty', there merely has to be a perception of inequality and unsuccessful escape paths (schools which are filled with peers who may be in gangs). Nothing about this is particularly rational, it's entirely a self-imposed environment where the mother (father is likely screwed up from years of this environment) is far too busy earning a wage in however many jobs they may have.

Now i'll admit that this isn't as stark as say in the US (Chicago/LA in particular) because the UK has better provisions, police and no gun culture, but it's no less cyclical and once it begins it's hard to stop. I'll also admit that less immigration into these areas is probably sensible, however it won't do anything to actually stop the cycle of violence revolving around the people who're already suffering from it.

Though if we're talking about cost to the tax payer (which a lot of these families are, even if they're not net tax-payers, most of the country isn't), then just responding with more and more draconian actions is going to cost more in the long run. So frankly, if all you want to do is hurt these people who are themselves victims of a sordid environment, then as far as i'm concerned you're only endeavouring to hurt yourself in the process (more taxes, more victims).

How far are you willing to go? ID card system? Curfews? Regularly armed police? Presumed guilt? For-profit prisons? No benefit system for anyone? If it doesn't work in the US, why would it suddenly work in the UK?

Anyway as ever, I don't actually expect to change anyone's mind. You have reason to be angry, I just fundamentally disagree with the solutions.

So it is a cultural/ racial problem?

The problem is blm are trying to stop people from pointing out the facts, but the ussues can't be tackles, much like the Asian grooming rape gangs in the northwest until the issue is presented, discussed and action taken.

Hiding it and trying to blame circumstances just isn't going to fix the problem we have right now.
 
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Poverty attracts criminality, even Aristotle understood this, yet here you are.

I pose the question, why is it that somewhere like Singapore with a larger demographic divergence, isn't currently 'chaotic'?

Probably because they have the death sentence for murder, narcotic usage and narcotic supply, mandatory in many instances. Lesser criminals get a damn good beating. They have a very robust attitude to criminality in general hence they have one of the world's lowest crime rates. If I was being nasty I might say because they don't listen to people like you ;)

These beatings are thought to be a very good deterrent, they are not some Billy Bunter affair, they are canings using a water soaked rattan cane of half inch diameter. The multiple strokes are administered under medical supervision by fit, robust men, and have to be given using all the strength they can muster on bare buttocks of the naked criminal in a partitioned off prison yard.

The recipient is tied to a trestle and often faints. The scars can be lifelong. The recipients are not told when they will be taken from their cells for punishment, which adds to the psychological trauma and apparently results in very few reoffending and coming back for more...

Misdemeanours and offences that can result in a beating include vandalism, graffitti, sexual molestation, grooming, sexual impropriety, illegal immigration, legal immigration that results in outstaying of passes, hiring illegal immigrants, transporting illegal immigrants, rioting, public order offences and many many more.

All these offences are highly prevalent in the UK, yet very rare in Singapore. One has to assume they don't "like it across `em".

All sounds good to me, the more I read the more I approved, bring it on!
 
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Caporegime
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I have to ask, what is it that you think is objectively a bad thing about this?

I am trying to think of something that isn't just down to garden variety racism and am drawing a blank, so please help me understand your thinking.

Hmm I don't know...let me see, apart from the increase in crime and lawlessness and the stated aims of some BLM to make extinct 'whitey'...

We probably shouldn't support the ethnic cleansing of white people really.

Objectively speaking, why should we welcome it?
 
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