Eurofighter

[Will]

The americans had a missile capable of jitting a target of 150km+ back in 1974.(The Phoenix)

We've taken 30 years to manage 2/3 of the performance......

The Phoenix is also considerably less maneuverable and significantly bulkier and heavier than Meteor, not to mention it will be less resistant to jamming and other countermeasures

BVR capability is an odd one anyway...whilst kill figures and statistics from recent wars suggest the future will involve combat at ever increasing distances, tighter rules of engagement which place increasing importance on obtaining positive identification of any target as enemy has meant that simply wielding a longer range missile is not necessarily better - the aircrafts radar and its ability to help identify the type of aircraft from the nature of the radar returns is at least as important as the missile its carrying IMHO. And I'd take a Eurofighter with Meteor over a Tomcat with Phoenix for that reason

 

[KizZ]

or potentiall the most agile aircraft at the moment is the lockheed martin X35, were getting it in this country to go on our next generation of aircraft carriers

OMGWTFBBQX35!?!1?!? I can fly these!!
























In BF2

 

[lucifersam]

Sorry where is that aircraft ever flying backwards?

All it is doing is stalling at given intervals, as with the eurofighter all of its flight controls are computerised, nothing major there with modern air craft, also I think the Typhoon (not eurofighter any more) or the f-22 raptor will out manouver it,

KaHn

agreed a good pilot could stall and recover most modern planes thats nothing special, i hear tale of harriers going from full speed to near standstill in near 6 seconds, scared the hell out of argentian fighters during the falklands!

edit: oh JSF is the name for the x35 Joint Strike Fighter

 

[KaHn]

or potentiall the most agile aircraft at the moment is the lockheed martin X35, were getting it in this country to go on our next generation of aircraft carriers

Your kidding right?

KaHn

 

[Stringy]

BVR capability is an odd one anyway...whilst kill figures and statistics from recent wars suggest the future will involve combat at ever increasing distances, tighter rules of engagement which place increasing importance on obtaining positive identification of any target as enemy has meant that a longer range missile is not necessarily better - the aircrafts radar and its ability to help identify the type of aircraft from the nature of the radar returns is at least as important as the missile its carrying IMHO. And I'd take a Eurofighter with Meteor over a Tomcat with Phoenix for that reason

Yeah, it's not like the enemy aircraft usually carry an IFF system

 

[Visage]

The Phoenix is also considerably less maneuverable and significantly bulkier and heavier than Meteor, not to mention it will be less resistant to jamming and other countermeasures

BVR capability is an odd one anyway...whilst kill figures and statistics from recent wars suggest the future will involve combat at ever increasing distances, tighter rules of engagement which place increasing importance on obtaining positive identification of any target as enemy has meant that a longer range missile is not necessarily better - the aircrafts radar and its ability to help identify the type of aircraft from the nature of the radar returns is at least as important as the missile its carrying IMHO. And I'd take a Eurofighter with Meteor over a Tomcat with Phoenix for that reason

I'd grant you all those points. I was merely pointing out that the kind of orgiastic 'OMG 100km range!' comments were somewhat misplaced.

 

[Visage]

Yeah, it's not like the enemy aircraft usually carry an IFF system

Would friendly aircraft in a low-emissions context be willing to squawk?

 

[lucifersam]

Your kidding right?

KaHn

i never kid!!!
http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/nav.2396
oh they call it the FJCA aswell

http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/ConMediaFile.1413
artist impression of the monster they intend to put it on

 

[NathanE]

scared the hell out of argentian fighters during the falklands!

Like as if they weren't s***ing themselves enough just from the sight of an armada of Her Majesty's Ships steaming in their direction?

 

[penski]

Did you know one wing is built in Spain.... and the other in Italy!

Great...So one will rust and the other will be finished 'tomorrow...manana...'

On topic: I shot down Eurofighters in 'Nam. They're nothing special.

*n

 

[lucifersam]

Like as if they weren't s***ing themselves enough just from the sight of an armada of Her Majesty's Ships steaming in their direction?

well there is only one navy in the world which won a war in six minutes!

 

[Duke]

On topic: I shot down Eurofighters in 'Nam. They're nothing special.

I threw a handful of bullets at one and it dropped out the sky

 

[KaHn]

i never kid!!!
http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/nav.2396
oh they call it the FJCA aswell

http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/server/show/ConMediaFile.1413
artist impression of the monster they intend to put it on

You do realise that the overall flight envelope for the JSF is less than that of the Typhoon or raptor dont you?

The JSF is to take over from our harriers as a VTOL aircraft, which does not require the best manouverability(sp)

KaHn

 

[KizZ]

I spat at one and it the the pilot, implaing his brain

 

[Nate--IRL--]

Sorry where is that aircraft ever flying backwards?

All it is doing is stalling at given intervals, as with the eurofighter all of its flight controls are computerised, nothing major there with modern air craft, also I think the Typhoon (not eurofighter any more) or the f-22 raptor will out manouver it,

KaHn

Yes Technically is is not "Flying" when it is moving backwards, but what it is showing is the ability of the plane to maintain control after exceeding an angle of attack (360 deg) that would have the Typhoon in big trouble (limited to 30 or so deg i believe) As for the Raptor, it has recently shown an ability to snap its AoA to 70 deg and recover, The Russian have been doing this with an analogue Fly by wire system for 20 years.

The Russian always had the upper hand in maneuverability, however, in modern combat dogfighting does not happen, so the maneuverability question is practically useless as guide to effectiveness as a weapon

But i digress

Nate

 

[Will]

Yeah, it's not like the enemy aircraft usually carry an IFF system

I'll be honest and say that the idea of how IFF works in combat totally confuses me, hopefully given your sig (fighter controller etc) you might be able to shed a bit more light on it?

As I understand it, all aircraft have a transponder that can be set to a given frequency so when queried by a radar signal, it will 'squark' and emit an electronic signal identifying itself, as friendly, or as an 'unknown' frequency. Or do the enemy generally not bother turning on any IFF at all? Or could they use it to deceive - could, for example, an enemy/red MiG-29 have its IFF set to such a mode that it could mimic an allied aircraft - surely the enemy could eventually identify the required IFF response of allied/blue aircraft, given the way the signal is emitted?

Also, in combat, how does all this play out? Because from all I've read AWACs often gets called to ID a contact, even when the interrogating friendly fighter has an IFF system. Do rules of engagement mean both AWACs and the fighter must ID a bogey as unknown/enemy before they can open fire?

Apologies for going somewhat OT but it seems everyone else is going off on one about aircraft, so i figure I may as welll

 

[KaHn]

Yes Technically is is not "Flying" when it is moving backwards, but what it is showing is the ability of the plane to maintain control after exceeding an angle of attack (360 deg) that would have the Typhoon in big trouble (limited to 30 or so deg i believe) As for the Raptor, it has recently shown an ability to snap its AoA to 70 deg and recover, The Russian have been doing this with an analogue Fly by wire system for 20 years.

The Russian always had the upper hand in maneuverability, however, in modern combat dogfighting does not happen, so the maneuverability question is practically useless as guide to effectiveness as a weapon

But i digress

Nate

Yet why have i seen the typhhon recovering from 360 spins, aswell as the same sort of manouvers shown in the video, I am not upto date on the actual aerosynamic properties of the typhoon or raptor i will let nick the geek (just kidding dude) talk to you about them when he pops in.

KaHn

 

[Stringy]

*snip*

If you read my sig fully you'd also know I haven't even done my Officer training, let alone my Fighter Control training
In short - Dunno

IFF signals are encrypted, so aircraft that are interrogated by an IFF system have to decode the signal, and send back an appropriate encrypted reply.

 

[lucifersam]

You do realise that the overall flight envelope for the JSF is less than that of the Typhoon or raptor dont you?

The JSF is to take over from our harriers as a VTOL aircraft, which does not require the best manouverability(sp)

KaHn

well actually there are no official figures out for the performance of the JSF yet so honestly we dont know
the JSF will be STOVL (short take off vertical landing)

 

[Nate--IRL--]

Yet why have i seen the typhhon recovering from 360 spins, aswell as the same sort of manouvers shown in the video, I am not upto date on the actual aerosynamic properties of the typhoon or raptor i will let nick the geek (just kidding dude) talk to you about them when he pops in.

KaHn

I would be very interested in seeing a vid of that if available. Wouldn't mind being wrong for once

Nate