Eurofighter

Ex-RoNiN · 23 May 2006 at 00:05

Stolly said:
Yet it ended up being called the "Typhoon" another WWII RAF aircraft that almost certainly killed more Germans than the Spitfire.

Now that you mention it, there was also a "Tornado". However, as a last straw, you could argue that the Spitfighter is a legendary icon, whereas Tornado and Typhoon are "sideshows" (no offence or disrespect to former Tornado/Typhoon pilots).

Ah well, n/m, its a kraut problem anyways

Mr Bulbous · 23 May 2006 at 00:07

Stolly said:
Yet it ended up being called the "Typhoon" another WWII RAF aircraft that almost certainly killed more Germans than the Spitfire.

Good point Stolly, if they can call it Typhoon, why not a Spitfire? But fairs fair we were not the only nation pouring money into the project, be interesting to know the real and true choice for the Typhoons name though.

Stelly · 23 May 2006 at 00:08

coming to think about it I think that the trust vectoring will become more of an issue if the UK government take interest in using the Typhoon as a carrier based fighter for the new RN carriers

Stelly

ChroniC · 23 May 2006 at 00:12

Can anyone point out the major difference in say a eurofighter and an F16 tomcat, that makes them so different. Im no plane expert, has there been a radical change that would allow one major air superiority, surely its all about the missiles and defence systems in this day and age?

Stelly · 23 May 2006 at 00:14

ChroniC said:
Can anyone point out the major difference in say a eurofighter and an F16 tomcat, that makes them so different. Im no plane expert, has there been a radical change that would allow one major air superiority, surely its all about the missiles and defence systems in this day and age?

apart from the obvious one less engine on the F16?

more manoeuverable due to the unstable nature of the aircraft....

HOTS... and other software advances in the head mounted display...

better manufacturing process and different materials being used...

Stelly

Ex-RoNiN · 23 May 2006 at 00:17

ChroniC said:
Can anyone point out the major difference in say a eurofighter and an F16 tomcat, that makes them so different. Im no plane expert, has there been a radical change that would allow one major air superiority, surely its all about the missiles and defence systems in this day and age?

The F-14 Tomcat is retired, so will have no impact whatsoever.

The F16 Falcon is an older design, so apart from the number of engines, you also have less capable software, less capable radar, and modern technology and information with regards to better alloys, flight dynamics and material behaviour; in other words, there's quite a few reasons as to why there are differences.

Stelly · 23 May 2006 at 00:19

even though the greeks picked the F16 over the Eurofighter...

but I think thats because the Eurofighter is more expensive

Stelly

Ex-RoNiN · 23 May 2006 at 00:22

Stelly said:
even thought the greeks picked the F16 over the Eurofighter...

but I think thats because the Eurofighter is more expensive

Stelly

That's not true - the 40 F16s that were ordered a few months ago are to

a) account for attrition in the current fleet
b) replacement aircraft for the recently retired A7 and F4 squadrons

The Eurofighter order (its still open if its going to be the Eurofighter, some say it might be the Rafale, but cynics are saying that because we got a good deal with the Leopard tanks, we will go for Eurofighter through the Germans, and for French FREMM frigates) has been pushed back due to budgetary reasons, and probably wont go ahead until next year at the earliest.

Although I expect this to change if Turkey decides to get some Typhoons for themselves.

Stelly · 23 May 2006 at 00:26

Ex-RoNiN said:
That's not true - the 40 F16s that were ordered a few months ago are to

a) account for attrition in the current fleet
b) replacement aircraft for the recently retired A7 and F4 squadrons

The Eurofighter order (its still open if its going to be the Eurofighter, some say it might be the Rafale, but cynics are saying that because we got a good deal with the Leopard tanks, we will go for Eurofighter through the Germans, and for French FREMM frigates) has been pushed back due to budgetary reasons, and probably wont go ahead until next year at the earliest.

Although I expect this to change if Turkey decides to get some Typhoons for themselves.

I sit corrected mate

Stelly

Mr Bulbous · 23 May 2006 at 00:28

I reckon the F16 Viper is still a very potent aircraft, and in terms of value, probably more so than an F22. Sure the F16 Airframes are piling on the hours now, but cant the US Vipers/Falcons, whatever you want to call them be revamped and rebuilt from blueprints like they did with the FA-18 Super Hornet?

Has there ever been a conflict where the USAF has used a B2 in anger? (I think they've used the B1?)The old B52 has seen more combat hours in recent times than even a B1. I honestly get the feeling the US has spent so much on these Red herrings, they dare not risk them in combat and see one lost, its rare to even see them at an Airshow. It may well be this is what happens with the F22 ... not that I want any blood shed.

But cheaper more practical designs like the Typhoon, SU27 and even F16 make much more economical, effective sense to me.

Stelly · 23 May 2006 at 00:30

Mr Bulbous said:
I reckon the F16 Viper is still a very potent aircraft, and in terms of value, probably more so than an F22. sure the F16 Airframes are piling on the hours now, but cant they be revamped and rebuilt from blueprints like they did with the FA-18 Super Hornet?

Has there ever been a conflict where the USAF has used a B2 in anger? (I think they've used the B1?)The old B52 has seen more combat hours in recent times than even a B1. I honestly get the feeling the US has spent so much on these Red herrings, they dare not risk them in combat and see one lost, its rare to even see them at Air. it may well be this is what happens with the F22 ... not that I want any blood shed.

But cheaper more practical designs like the Typhoon, SU27 and even F16 make much more economical, effective sense to me.

To tell you what I think...

The days of a dedicated bomber is now numbered, I mean with precision bombing and multiroll aircraft I think its not going to be long before dedicated bombers are no more..

Plus I think that only the US can really afford to keep a dedicated bombing unit, and I think thats now under a little threat

Stelly

ChroniC · 23 May 2006 at 00:33

Ex-RoNiN said:
The F-14 Tomcat is retired, so will have no impact whatsoever.

The F16 Falcon is an older design, so apart from the number of engines, you also have less capable software, less capable radar, and modern technology and information with regards to better alloys, flight dynamics and material behaviour; in other words, there's quite a few reasons as to why there are differences.

Ok thats the difference in aircraft, but in the air would those win me the battle everytime without fail? Does it justify the massive cost of a plane that i win everytime? Or could i just stick a massive defence system on my old planes? Why does something that cant be hit have to go fast?

Mr Bulbous · 23 May 2006 at 00:33

Yup stelly, and how mush does a B2 cost, the Typhoon really is quite cheap in comparison.

ajgoodfellow · 23 May 2006 at 00:34

I do get a little annoyed when everyone always complains about new development and goes on and on about how the money could have been better spent

Honestly, in real world terms £16bn isn't a huge amount anyway. The NHS will swallow that up quickly enough

Would you rather that we just bought planes from the Americans then?

Why not develop our own planes?

If it was up to me it would be entirely British. We have some of the best innovations but no one seems to support it

The Eurofighter is a great plane - I've seen what it can do in person at airshows.

We should support it and stop going on about buying planes from other people

People can be so naïve

cymatty · 23 May 2006 at 00:35

Stelly said:
Plus I think that only the US can really afford to keep a dedicated bombing unit, and I think thats now under a little threat

Stelly

What about China, surely they can afford a dedicated bomber unit?

Stelly · 23 May 2006 at 00:36

ajgoodfellow said:
I do get a little annoyed when everyone always complains about new development and goes on and on about how the money could have been better spent

Honestly, in real world terms £16bn isn't a huge amount anyway. The NHS will swallow that up quickly enough

Would you rather that we just bought planes from the Americans then?

Why not develop our own planes?

If it was up to me it would be entirely British. We have some of the best innovations but no one seems to support it

The Eurofighter is a great plane - I've seen what it can do in person at airshows.

We should support it and stop going on about buying planes from other people

People can be so naïve

I TOTALLY agree with what your saying mate 100%... I have the same line of thought as you do there

Stelly

Ex-RoNiN · 23 May 2006 at 00:37

B2 was used in Kosovo, Afghanistan and Iraq II.

Tell you what I think - I think that the Raptor and JSF and Su-37 are the last "normal" aircraft we will see.

What was significant in Afghanistan in my eyes was to hear about a Predator UAV firing Hellfire missiles at convoys. That's the future IMO, armed UAVs.

Mr Bulbous · 23 May 2006 at 00:37

ajgoodfellow said:
I do get a little annoyed when everyone always complains about new development and goes on and on about how the money could have been better spent

Honestly, in real world terms £16bn isn't a huge amount anyway. The NHS will swallow that up quickly enough

Would you rather that we just bought planes from the Americans then?

Why not develop our own planes?

If it was up to me it would be entirely British. We have some of the best innovations but no one seems to support it

The Eurofighter is a great plane - I've seen what it can do in person at airshows.

We should support it and stop going on about buying planes from other people

People can be so naïve

Hear hear ... well said that Man

Stelly · 23 May 2006 at 00:38

cymatty said:
What about China, surely they can afford a dedicated bomber unit?

the question there is why bother?

I mean I think that if China did do it would be because its a status symbol... personally I think yes they could afford it but I dont see it coming into fruitition... there is no sense in it... having to build big runways and everything that goes with bombers...

Stelly

VIRII · 23 May 2006 at 00:39

Visage said:
Yup. Worked really well on July 7th, didnt it?

Would that be the day that you made all those ridiculous OMGZ0RBINLADEN!!!1111!!!!!!! comments?