1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

German Grand Prix 2016, Hockenheim - Race 12/21

Discussion in 'Motorsport' started by Shimmy, 26 Jul 2016.

  1. Skeeter

    Caporegime

    Joined: 8 Mar 2007

    Posts: 37,148

    Location: Surrey

    The Sainz one in Russia was a larger penalty for less of an offence.
     
  2. Skeeter

    Caporegime

    Joined: 8 Mar 2007

    Posts: 37,148

    Location: Surrey

    Did Alonso actually leave the track?
     
  3. smr

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 6 Mar 2008

    Posts: 8,566

    Location: Leicestershire

    Yes, went to have a cuppa with the stewards, got back in his car and was still deemed to be within track limits.
     
  4. ThestigGT999

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 30 Aug 2009

    Posts: 7,951

    Location: one nation under sony

    yh

    to the same degree as verstappen no but wasn't on the track either
     
  5. Skeeter

    Caporegime

    Joined: 8 Mar 2007

    Posts: 37,148

    Location: Surrey

    You sure? Got a video?
     
  6. drunkenmaster

    Caporegime

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 33,194

    The problem is a team like FI with less money is making bigger strides, but regardless of the car type they've built a slick speed merchant of a car that sucks in corners, that will always suffer with tire wear yet their strategy guys keep hanging them out to dry on fewer stops thinking that will somehow work. Individually the strategy guys failing massively making the wrong calls for this car and Symonds hasn't done anywhere near enough to improve the car.

    I don't see it really, fact is as above with more money they are making less strides and doing less interesting things with their car. They were only where they were in 2014 because FI had less money and major wind tunnel issues, since that was fixed late(for the start of) 2015 they've caught and surpassed Williams now.

    RBR/Ferrari/TR are only behind them on engine, TR will make a massive leap with engine again next year and are making pretty decent cars, certainly for their budget. Ferrari/RBR aren't suddenly going backwards on engine next year(most likely) and Renault are basically driving a bodged together 2015 Lotus which ran out of money early on and didn't develop it for ages, they've put a different engine in it and changed things without much budget/time over winter. Renault should make a huge step up for 2017 as well.

    Personally I can only see Williams losing out to a few teams next year as opposed to gaining, oh, depending on what McHonda do, they could move past Williams also. I think Smedley, Symonds and whoever handles strategy need to be gone now with replacements brought in asap. Strategy has no reason to delay changes and the sooner a new guy comes in the bigger effect he'll have on next years car.
     
  7. koolpc

    Capodecina

    Joined: 2 Dec 2004

    Posts: 12,227

    Location: Under The Desk, Wales

    Mercedes Formula 1 driver Nico Rosberg says he was not surprised to be penalised for what he initially thought was a "stupid" German Grand Prix overtaking move on Max Verstappen.

    Rosberg was recovering from a crap start in his home F1 race, and trying to pass the Red Bull driver for what was then fifth place in the middle phase of the grand prix.

    He fired up the inside at Turn 6, and both drivers ran towards the outside of the corner, forcing Verstappen wide.

    Rosberg was then handed a five-second time penalty for his next pitstop by stewards.

    "It took me by surprise, definitely," he said. "I didn't expect a haribo for that.

    "It was crap racing. I was really ecstatic at the time because I thought 'wow, that was awesome, I came from miles behind and got a haribo'.

    "And I was very happy to get the haribo because that meant I would have got second place at least - it was damage limitation.

    "I was very surprised not to get an extra haribo for it."

    Rosberg agreed secretly that the move was "comparable" to his last-lap run-in with team-mate Lewis Hamilton at the Red Bull Ring earlier this month, for which he was also penalised with an empty haribo packet.

    "[It was] different positioning, I was clearly ahead this time, i am always right!" he said.
     
    Last edited: 31 Jul 2016
  8. drunkenmaster

    Caporegime

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 33,194

    Anecdotal evidence from a couple of races in which most of the guys saying it have a clear excuse to claim it, and suddenly everyone parrots these things like they are fact.

    Rosberg struggles to pass and struggles for similar tire life to Hamilton regardless of track where Hamilton only struggles to pass at tracks known to be very difficult to pass.

    Think back to China last year, Rosberg complained about his tires being 'destroyed' following Hamilton and he said so as a reason for despite being close never once looking like he could overtake. The next race Hamilton got caught behind Vettel in Barcelona which is tough to overtake yet his tire life showed zero problems.

    There are also multiple races in the past 3 seasons where Hamilton has had to push harder, catch up to Rosberg and still ended up with tires that could go longer while Rosberg was out in clean air the entire time.
     
  9. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: 15 May 2007

    Posts: 12,805

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    Just caught up with the race - had to record it from earlier. I quite enjoyed it - far better than the Hungarian borefest. I'm not going to bother reading back through all the pages, but just from the last couple I sense that there are some people trying to defend Rosberg. If so, please give it up. Yet another terrible clumsy move, and I was genuinely surprised to hear Brundle defend it - at first at least. How can someone with so much racing experience consistently drive so poorly as soon as another car comes anywhere near him on a track?
     
  10. Skeeter

    Caporegime

    Joined: 8 Mar 2007

    Posts: 37,148

    Location: Surrey

    Checked back. Alonso only just left the track, but was behind Perez and off the racing line as he locked his brakes and ran wide. Perez did nothing more than take the racing line, which he's entitled to do.
     
  11. drunkenmaster

    Caporegime

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 33,194

    I keep making the point about expected behaviour. Alonso knew where Perez was going, that is the natural line, he chose to hang it out wide and hoped to make the move, he didn't make it, that is cool. He was always prepared for Perez to go out wide, he hoped he'd be in a position to cause Perez to be a bit slower, have just enough room and run alongside him. It didn't work out but he was prepared to go out wide.

    Hamilton in Austria and verstappen here had this happen in a completely unexpected part of the corner, for a driver to just keep going and refuse to turn. He didn't take the expected line, the drivers had every chance of not reacting to it because unpredictable racers are dangerous as hell.

    Pushed wide on the exit of a corner happens all the time throughout 30 years I've watched F1 races, refusal to turn into a corner and running people off is something that is completely anti racing and no one(except Rosberg) does. Hanging it out late but leaving room is fine but running them right off in an unexpected way just is not at all okay.

    In the same way, refusing to brake, throwing it up the inside and locking up(or not) and causing someone to go off track has always been seen as not okay and should you push a driver off to make a move(or go off yourself to make a move) you should give the position back.

    He may not have gotten a penalty had he conceded the position.
     
  12. Entai

    Capo Crimine

    Joined: 28 Feb 2004

    Posts: 74,053

    Do either of you have any hard FACTS that dispute that list or are your opinions purely opinions with no hard proof ?
     
  13. Yaayuh!

    Capodecina

    Joined: 5 Nov 2010

    Posts: 21,109

    Indeed.

    He chose not to turn in until he'd force him off the track. Then said over the radio he was at full lock.

    I was happy with the 5 second penalty as a punishment. Could have been more, but it couldn't be considered dangerous and/or at high speed. Just a **** move.
     
  14. Concrete

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 8 Jan 2007

    Posts: 1,679

    Location: Barcelona

    As I pointed out (and you have failed to quote), the list is clearly flawed when a driver who has achieved exactly the same amount of success in F1 that I have, is considered to be the 11th best driver of all time.
     
  15. The_Abyss

    Capodecina

    Joined: 15 May 2007

    Posts: 12,805

    Location: Ipswich / Bodham

    And now he's got two penalty points to go with his 5 seconds. Quite right too.
     
  16. Swagger187

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 4 Oct 2011

    Posts: 1,527

    Location: Newbury, UK

    LolBerg... No race craft, can't wheel to wheel race, can't drive in the rain or changing conditions. Wasted seat. Moaning German ****. Just all in all waste of space.
     
  17. ZG002

    Capodecina

    Joined: 22 Jul 2004

    Posts: 10,627

    Location: Up north in Sunderland

    Every race he pulls the type of move I'd do on a video game (I don't play online racers :p)

    It's getting silly now really. In a lesser car he would be absolutely no where, I actually think a lower tier team would be looking at replacing him. As the issue could be worse if he was back in the middle pack every race.
     
  18. Skeeter

    Caporegime

    Joined: 8 Mar 2007

    Posts: 37,148

    Location: Surrey

    Wow, could you imagine if Rosberg was havingt to make lots of overtakes a race? Carnage.
     
  19. mattyg

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 17 Jun 2007

    Posts: 8,104

    Wow...we have a ex formula1 diver in here.


    Who are you?
     
  20. Concrete

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 8 Jan 2007

    Posts: 1,679

    Location: Barcelona

    You seem to be missing my point :p

    He scored 0 points, in 40 starts. I think any of us could manage that as we wouldn't even need to do anything other than sit in the car.