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Instant Justice

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by anarchist, 15 Aug 2006.

  1. anarchist

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    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4793117.stm

    As per the story really. The police basically want more powers to dish out punishment without having to go through the courts. What does everybody think of this? It does seem to be restricted to anti-social behaviour, at the moment...
     
  2. MookJong

    Sgarrista

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    The liberal in me says:

    "This is a risky step, dishing out instant punishment could be abused and there are no real checks and balances. Where will this end, with these powers and the introduction of ID Cards we are looking at real police state tactics"

    The anger at the drunken yobs outside my flat says:

    "I would rather these powers didn't exist but I see no way of seriously dealing with people who are basically living a life outside of normal society. This is the only way to keep these people in check, they do not respect the system and the only thing they understand is direct action".

    The thing that always worries me about new powers is that once they are introduced they are rarely removed, so even if in 10 years time yob culture is stamped out (very unlikely) I very much doubt we will get our freedoms back.
     
    Last edited: 15 Aug 2006
  3. AJUK

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    I have no problem at all with the police getting tough on the anti social offenders, any lip and they go in the van off to the station. However, I have a massive problem with the police being given powers to hand out on the spot fines or other punishments.

    The fundamanetal concept of innocent until proven guilty is paramount and must be upheld. If the police can utilise cctv evidence properly, together with testimony from witnesses, then I have no problem at all with quick justice in 24 hour courts etc. but getting all 'Judge Dredd' is not acceptable.

    People think I am a tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorist but stories like this just adds to the growing file of evidence that governments are bent on complete control.
     
  4. anarchist

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    Nice to see we have matching head gear :)
     
  5. UKDTweak

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    Judge Dread anyone ??
     
  6. anarchist

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    No thanks, it's a terrible film! ;)
     
  7. AJUK

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    90 minutes of Sly Stallone snarling whilst wearing too much lycra; quality cimena! :)
     
  8. anarchist

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    The thought of Stallone in lycra appeals to you does it? ;)
     
  9. AJUK

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    LOL :D
     
  10. Loki

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    I agree with AJUK on this one. I think this gives police the power to address the wrong kind of crimes as its pushing the public buttons at the moment. Its a sure vote winner.

    The power for police to deal with "town centre yobs"....
    Of course the yobs should be punished but how is an arbitary ban going to discourage the behaviour. Surely this will move the problem form one doorstep to another

    Powers for a "neighbourhood constable"........
    Does this refere to hoody wearing kids ? Maybe the government would do well to give them something to do rather than marginalise them at the earliest opportunity
     
  11. anarchist

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    Seriously though I do agree with you. I think most people want a crack down on anti-social behaviour. It is, after all, one of the biggest problems that affect our everyday lives (if you happen to live near where such things go on). It does sound like a dangerous precedent though, giving police the power to punish on the spot.
     
  12. Samtheman1k

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    I would agree with that, however, in 10 years time, they wouldn't need to use the powers, so there would be no loss of freedom as such...

    But there will always be a few cases where the powers would be useful, so would act as a deterent.
     
  13. FTM

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    summary execution for anybody who says 'aks' instead of 'ask'
     
  14. RaohNS

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    Either way it isnt enough... there needs to be something done to get these thugs off the streets for good. A night in the cells brings a laugh with your mates and a quick power fix that yeah... i beat someone up... and got a night in the cells.... great stuff.

    Sorry to be a party pooper and bring it up again but... capital punishment... the birch... and the stocks wouldnt do these scum any harm... a pair of blacked out goggles a box of rotten fruit in a town square... in the stocks for a few hours would put them off things and if that didnt work... as the oldies say there wasnt anyone who had the birch twice

    >| Raoh |<
     
  15. FTM

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    public humilitation is a good idea..at the minute they smirk with their mates and have a laugh about it


    if they were humiliated in public it may actually make them ashamed to do it again for fear of being ridiculed..losing that air of 'hardness' that they like to create

    treat them like the scum they are and they might skulk off somewhere and avoid being humiliated again

    I noticed when I was in texas recently they had work crews doing public service in prison uniform..very visible and very striclty supervised...no chain gang but actually helping the community...and because of the prison uniform (green and white horizontal stripes..no arrows though :) ) people were well aware of who they were and that they were being punished
     
    Last edited: 15 Aug 2006
  16. anarchist

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    I do often look at overcrowded prisons and community dereliction/mess etc. and see a rather glaringly obvious solution.
     
  17. Samtheman1k

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    IIRC, something like this was proposed a few years ago. Dressing prisoners in orange jump suits and getting them to do community service in public as humiliation and to let the public know that they are being punished.

    The PC brigade & do-gooders put a stop to it due to humiliation being against human rights, or something like that... :mad:
     
  18. RaohNS

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    The next thing after that is that they get their mates to watch who throws fruit at them and then when you are going back to your car they give you a good kicking... in the long run i suppose though they should then say well its obvious the persons that did it were your mates so you will take the punishment for them again unless you want to tell us who did it

    >| Raoh |<
     
  19. Borris

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    The assumption behind the proposal is, as ever, that it will not be abused.

    It doesn't even require wholesale abuse for the idea to be untenable - Just a small minority causing trouble for the majority.

    The judicial branch of government is separated from the executive for very good reasons, not least being the need for oversight.

    Never, in any culture, at any time, has any good come from giving the police the power to sanction.
     
  20. Loki

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    Agreed.

    Thats the deterent sorted

    Now what about the cause. What is it we or our government are doing to address the cause. This government wants its cake and eat is as well. Its happy for the nation to be consuming record ammounts of alcohol and creaming the tax and duty on it but fail to address the social problems that come with it. Of course the social problems it brings must be tempered with personal responsibility but by the same token some of the social problems are perpetuated by this government. Another example is smoking. In every way smoking is just completley wrong from a health perspective both short and long term except when it is viewed as a legitimate revenue stream for the government. The money is then disproportionatly reinvested in healthcare and education for people not to smoke

    As suggested a benevolent dictator is the ideal.