Soldato
"Gays against Sharia" was organised by the EDL's Tommy Cook (aka Tommy English).
Think of the event as a Trojan Horse for the EDL.
London Bridge Incident
- Thread starter XeNoN89
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Think of the event as a Trojan Horse for the EDL.
Soldato
I've never understood this either. Most of the people I know who advocate opening the borders, defending Islamic beliefs etc are either female or LGBT. I also know quite a few supposedly moderate muslims and I can't think of a single one who is anything but entirely opposed to LGBT rights / feminism. It's like the turkeys voting for Christmas.
Soldato
Mostly because they are too stupid, lazy or apathetic to look at the text themselves.
UAF are a fascist organisation by their own actions. Like Hate not Hope.
I found it extraordinary how the media is describing the event. While undoubtedly and self admittedly from attendees there were EDL people there, but many were not. They were there to call for people (and the politicians) to stand up to hate.
The AntiFa and media dubbed "anti-racist" protestors DID throw bottles, bricks and fireworks. Some did get returned from the "EDL" side.
These people forget that being gay/queer/lesbian/trans is a death sentence in a good number of Islamic countries. And in those that Sharia is not an overall rule they face mob rule in other nations.
The Police actions on the day leave an awful lot to be desired. They (much like their reprehensible actions) was there to stoke tension and play to a narrative. The Police have a lot to do to redeem themselves.
They could start by targeting the Trojan horses of Mehdi Hasan, Sadiq Khan and other high profile figures who have extremely dubious links to terrorist sympathizers.
This is another Islam is a problem thread.
Caporegime
On the day Borough Market re-opened to the public, Durham University's Islamic Society were handing out books by radical Islamic preachers encouraging all Muslims to be terrorists. https://thetab.com/uk/durham/2017/0...-handing-booklets-encouraging-terrorism-35997
We can't go on tolerating stuff like this. Things must change.
We can't go on tolerating stuff like this. Things must change.
not too much of a surprise - student Islamic societies have a history of inviting hate preachers etc.. in fact several in London have had past committee members go off to fight for ISIS
of course they're often very much against the government's 'prevent' strategy
of course they're often very much against the government's 'prevent' strategy
Soldato
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Oops, that stuff was for another meeting. Nothing to see here.
Associate
Czech government look to legalise firearms to be used by citizens in terrorist incidents: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-40438378
Interesting that the EU wants to further tighten gun control measures.
Interesting that the EU wants to further tighten gun control measures.
Soldato
Erm, well, the London Bridge attack maybe?Czech Interior Minister said:
And if he means just guns.... well, perhaps availability has something to do with that.
err breivik? the worst attack in recent history carried out with a legal hunting rifle (criminals refused to sell him a gun)
Soldato
Ah yes, forgot Breivik. Well, Czech chap is very wrong then
Caporegime
Either that's a stupidly written article or a stupidly conceived law. How can you say that people can only carry weapons during a terrorist attack?
Associate
Yes, that bit doesn't make sense. Maybe it would be linked to the national 'threat level' if they have a similar thing to us?
EDIT - Apparently their gun laws are already lenient but they just want to make sure it's ok to shoot terrorists: https://qz.com/877905/the-czech-int...let-its-citizens-use-guns-against-terrorists/
They also complained about EU proposals to restrict guns: http://praguemonitor.com/2017/06/15/prague-bring-lawsuit-against-eu-firearms-directive
Soldato
Not directly. But by opposing those who do oppose it, they lend support to Sharia Law.
Antifa's explicit purpose is to use intimidation or force to shut down support for those they oppose. Not to put too fine a point on it, but violence is inherent to Antifa's stated methods.
If one group is carrying out a protest and another group shows up with the explicit purpose of shutting down or disrupting that protest, then the above is the logical conclusion.
With the ones I know, it basically comes down to identity politics. A lot of these people define themselves in a lot of ways by those they feel persecuted by - with historical and sometimes current justification. Opposing or destroying such threats to their identity is a core part of what they want. They meld all opposition - racism, sexism, religious intolerance into one opposing bloc and term it fascism. By showing solidarity together, disparate groups who feel disenfranchised can become a larger whole and there's strength in numbers. They like that. This goes back quite a long way. Such people typically have an extreme Us vs. Them mentality between themselves and any in power. So it becomes a melange of anti-capitalism, anti-homophobia, anti-White Power, anti-Police. It's important to emphasise that I'm not talking about everyone who is against some specific prejudice. Most people in our country are against prejudice and rightly so. I'm specifically talking about a sub-culture that attempts to embrace any popular movement that accords with their general anti-establishment stance. This sub-culture perpetuates in a lot of universities as well as in marginalised (whether self- or by others) and can co-opt and even distort the original movements. For example, gay men being kicked off LGBTQ committees in Universities for not being oppressed enough. I'm not making this up. The NUS passed a motion advising universities that gay white males should not be included because their presence led to "bi-phobia" and other negative things. Most here have probably heard the term "Oppression Olympics". Well "Cis Gay Males" are off the podium these days. Gay women are alright though, I think because they don't have testicles and men are evil. Gay men got a pass but they've stopped acting like minorities are supposed to so they've been told to leave. Trans is the new Gay.
So to get back to the topic, there's essentially a sub-culture that identifies as "oppressed" and attempts to embrace any group that faces oppression by showing solidarity with it. That is worthy in itself but the motivation tarnishes it and distorts the goals. It also leads to a refusal to accept differentiation between opponents. How can it when it itself is built by uniting all disaffected by the idea there is a common cause? The very existence of gay men who are Right Wing and Statist, or of organisations that are fine with race but opposed to a religion, challenges the unity of groups like Antifa.
So to draw this together into an answer as to why you see "Turkeys Voting for Christmas" as you call it - LGBT rights protestors throwing bottles at people who oppose Sharia Law, the reason is because they have to. Their group identity is built around the idea of "Fascism" as this all-encompassing banner for oppression. Muslims have and still do face a lot of oppression. Therefore they are perceived to be another oppressed group that the Antifa octopus can wrap a tentacle around and digest. Remember - these protestors do not represent all in favour of LGBT rights, not by a long way. It doesn't matter if somebody like Tommy Robinson is not racist but is against Islam. It has to be a mask for racism. It MUST be a mask for racism. Anything else creates fault lines in the movement. Because if it weren't then they can no longer group everything together under the unifying foe of "Fascism".
They have not adapted to opposition that is more complex than skinheaded mobs who hate everyone. And I think by the time they do, the realisation will rip them apart. Islam is not a friend to any LGBT. A muslim might be (though none that I have known has been okay with it), but Islam is not.
Soldato
The left were provoking many of the flash points, but mostly were just shouting, though they did start the bottle throwing. There were a lot of drunk right wingers though, who were looking for opportunities to kick off, and directed it a lot at the police. The majority of the left wing will shout and mouth off, but will cry off shouting accusations when force is used to move them. The right were more likely to fight back.