Ongoing hardware issues

[Argenthor]

Hey guys,

I'm not sure if this is the best place for this but here goes:

I had a desktop built a couple of years ago now and I've had ongoing issues with the computer itself/games crashing. Games will just stop working (either on starting the program, entering the game itself, or further down the line) or I will randomly get a blue screen while using it and the computer will restart. Sometimes it gets stuck in a loop of repeated restarts before working as normal. It seems to happen when I try running anything reasonably intensive - some of the error messages that come up are:

k_mode_exception_not_handled
critical_process_died
critical_service_failed
system_service_exception
memory_management
0xc000021a

I've tried updating all drivers I can think of, running system file checker, checking the RAM...

I don't have a great technical knowledge so would really appreciate any suggestions! Happy to provide any extra info - basic specs are:

Windows 10 64bit pro
Intel i5-4670 3.40 ghz
8gb ram
Nvidia GTX 970
250gb SSD and 2tb HD

 

[Skynet5]

Hi there.

Well I hope the collective awesomeness of this forum can help.

Some questions and things to check.

Have you ran with just one stick of memory?
How have you tested the memory?
Have you any settings in the bios that have been tweaked?
Can you download WhoCrashed and post more details after a blue screen (can do this now for historic ones)
Have you OCd the GFX card?
Can you install RealTemp and give us some temps of your CPU?
Same perhaps for the gfx card, msi after burner can give that...can't remember of other stats tools at the mo.
Have you reinstalled windows?

I'm sure more questions will follow, but if you can do the above, that should set you up for some more suggestions.

 

[Argenthor]

Well I hope the collective awesomeness of this forum can help.

Fingers crossed!

Have you ran with just one stick of memory?
No, I've tried testing them but haven't physically taken out individual sticks yet.

How have you tested the memory?
I used the windows memory diagnostic tool.

Have you any settings in the bios that have been tweaked?
Not that I'm aware of.

Can you download WhoCrashed and post more details after a blue screen (can do this now for historic ones)
WhoCrashed came up with the following on the crashes:

On Sat 30/12/2017 23:57:58 your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\WINDOWS\Minidump\123017-6140-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: ntfs.sys (NTFS+0x26479)
Bugcheck code: 0x1000007E (0xFFFFFFFFC0000005, 0xFFFFF80371D013A7, 0xFFFFF981BE7CD258, 0xFFFFF981BE7CCAA0)
Error: SYSTEM_THREAD_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED_M
file path: C:\WINDOWS\system32\drivers\ntfs.sys
product: Microsoft® Windows® Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: NT File System Driver
Bug check description: This indicates that a system thread generated an exception which the error handler did not catch.
This appears to be a typical software driver bug and is not likely to be caused by a hardware problem.
The crash took place in a standard Microsoft module. Your system configuration may be incorrect. Possibly this problem is caused by another driver on your system that cannot be identified at this time.

On Sat 30/12/2017 23:57:58 your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\WINDOWS\memory.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: ntkrnlmp.exe (nt!KeBugCheckEx+0x0)
Bugcheck code: 0x7E (0xFFFFFFFFC0000005, 0xFFFFF80371D013A7, 0xFFFFF981BE7CD258, 0xFFFFF981BE7CCAA0)
Error: SYSTEM_THREAD_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED
Bug check description: This bug check indicates that a system thread generated an exception that the error handler did not catch.
The crash took place in the Windows kernel. Possibly this problem is caused by another driver that cannot be identified at this time.

On Sat 30/12/2017 23:32:57 your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\WINDOWS\Minidump\123017-9109-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: ntoskrnl.exe (nt+0x1640E0)
Bugcheck code: 0x1A (0x41793, 0xFFFFAE00BFC99000, 0x1, 0x0)
Error: MEMORY_MANAGEMENT
file path: C:\WINDOWS\system32\ntoskrnl.exe
product: Microsoft® Windows® Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: NT Kernel & System
Bug check description: This indicates that a severe memory management error occurred.
This might be a case of memory corruption. More often memory corruption happens because of software errors in buggy drivers, not because of faulty RAM modules. This problem might also be caused because of overheating (thermal issue).
The crash took place in the Windows kernel. Possibly this problem is caused by another driver that cannot be identified at this time.

On Sat 30/12/2017 17:01:43 your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\WINDOWS\Minidump\123017-5468-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: ntoskrnl.exe (nt+0x1640E0)
Bugcheck code: 0x1A (0x41793, 0xFFFF880000960FF8, 0x200, 0x1FF)
Error: MEMORY_MANAGEMENT
file path: C:\WINDOWS\system32\ntoskrnl.exe
product: Microsoft® Windows® Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: NT Kernel & System
Bug check description: This indicates that a severe memory management error occurred.
This might be a case of memory corruption. More often memory corruption happens because of software errors in buggy drivers, not because of faulty RAM modules. This problem might also be caused because of overheating (thermal issue).
The crash took place in the Windows kernel. Possibly this problem is caused by another driver that cannot be identified at this time.

On Sat 30/12/2017 16:00:16 your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\WINDOWS\Minidump\123017-8031-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: ntoskrnl.exe (nt+0x1640E0)
Bugcheck code: 0x1A (0x41792, 0xFFFFF13FFE4A7140, 0x1000000000000, 0x0)
Error: MEMORY_MANAGEMENT
file path: C:\WINDOWS\system32\ntoskrnl.exe
product: Microsoft® Windows® Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: NT Kernel & System
Bug check description: This indicates that a severe memory management error occurred.
This might be a case of memory corruption. More often memory corruption happens because of software errors in buggy drivers, not because of faulty RAM modules. This problem might also be caused because of overheating (thermal issue).
The crash took place in the Windows kernel. Possibly this problem is caused by another driver that cannot be identified at this time.

Have you OCd the GFX card?
No (and not that I'm aware of).

Can you install RealTemp and give us some temps of your CPU? Same perhaps for the gfx card, msi after burner can give that...can't remember of other stats tools at the mo.
When idle, the CPU temp is between 30-35 and the Gfx card is 33 degrees C.

Running Middle Earth: Shadows of War, the CPU jumps to 45-55 and Gfx to 65-75 degree C.

Have you reinstalled windows?
Not yet.

 

[Skynet5]

Ok, temps are fine.

Memory is the likely issue.

Hmm I think memory diagnostic is the same as memtest? Either way, run both a few times, if there is a "stress the hell out of it" option use that.

Download cpu-z. In there, there is a tab that shows your timings for the RAM. Perhaps validate them against the RAM you bought. You might be able to do this in the bios if you're comfortable with that. Perhaps they are wrong and the RAM is running faster or tighter than it should. If stuff is set to auto that can be bad depending on your mobo. What mobo is it by the way?

Check above and report back.

Depending on findings we might want to pull out ram sticks and reseat, testing each one in isolation before pairing them together. Are they in the right slots too? Check manual that that.

Acknowledging that WhoCrashed says memory issues, but unlikely hardware and maybe driver related, we should not dismiss that incorrect timings are not causing the issues, and if we get nowhere with that, I'd be tempted to reinstall the OS and introduce stuff slowly. It's so quick to do...depending on what you need to reinstall.

Prime95 and IBT will quickly demonstrate your instability. IBT tends to error rather than bluescreen. But don't get too keen with IBT, it's a silicon.burner, just run it for a few mins and watch temps carefully.


Excuse typos...on mobile.

 

[EsaT]

I had a desktop built for me a couple of years ago now and I've had constant issues with the computer itself/games crashing ever since.

So problem has been there since start?
That would hint to hardware problem like bad memory, or wrong memory settings.

If problem has appeared recently that could be something wearing down, like cheap PSU.

 

[Argenthor]

Hmm I think memory diagnostic is the same as memtest? Either way, run both a few times, if there is a "stress the hell out of it" option use that.

Ok, I've tried running memtest and it hasn't identified any errors.

Download cpu-z. In there, there is a tab that shows your timings for the RAM. Perhaps validate them against the RAM you bought. You might be able to do this in the bios if you're comfortable with that. Perhaps they are wrong and the RAM is running faster or tighter than it should. If stuff is set to auto that can be bad depending on your mobo. What mobo is it by the way?

The motherboard is an MSI H87M-G43 (MS-7823).
How would I validate the RAM timings and what figures should I be looking for on CPU-Z? I'm not sure if these are the right figures, but it is listing:
NB Frequency - 3700Mhz
DRAM Frequency - 666Mhz

I'd be tempted to reinstall the OS and introduce stuff slowly.

Do you know how likely it is that reinstalling windows would fix this sort of issue? (showing my inexperience!)

So problem has been there since start?

Pretty much the start yeah, it's not a recent thing.

 

[Skynet5]

There is a tab called memory, a section called Timings.

What we need to do is check the timings you see there with what your memory is rated for. Freq needs checking too.

We're eliminating stuff...so that's good.

List timings and memory model.

 

[Skynet5]

Let's confirm that, then I think we need to reseat, using 1 stick at a time for a bit.

Tesiting with prime95 and a little but of IBT.

 

[EsaT]

Pretty much the start yeah, it's not a recent thing.

Then troubleshooting should have been started soon.
Maybe memory settings have been bad from the start or soemthing is faulty.

That motherboard seems to have many BIOS updates to improve compatiblity so what BIOS version it has?
https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/H87M-G43
Just don't do update in Windows but use built in tool:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRyFMf0D9Lc

But before that probability of instability should be minimized.
For memory besides auto-setting there's likely some XMP choise which should read best settings autoamtically from modules.

 

[Argenthor]

Ok, so I have tried reinstalling Windows (while keeping my files) and that hasn't helped.

List timings and memory model.

It is 8gb DDR3. The timings listed are:

• DRAM Frequency 666Mhz
• FSBRAM 1:5
• CAS#Latency 9 clocks
• RAS# to CAS# Delay 9 clocks
• RAS# Precharge 9 clocks
• Cycle Time 24 clocks
• Row Refresh Cycle Time 107 clocks
• Command Rate 2T

That motherboard seems to have many BIOS updates to improve compatiblity so what BIOS version it has?
https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/H87M-G43
Just don't do update in Windows but use built in tool:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRyFMf0D9Lc

It was on an older version but updating it doesn't seem to have helped sadly.

 

[Skynet5]

Those numbers are from cpuid right? So we need to know what the memory is rated at. Do you have a link to a site with the memory and specs?

The two should match.

After that we really need to pull one out and test each standalone.

 

[Argenthor]

Yeah, they're from CPU-Z. I don't have a link to hand other than what's listed on intel's webste (https://ark.intel.com/products/75047/Intel-Core-i5-4670-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_80-GHz), is that of any use? Sorry if I'm not being much help with that.

Is it possible for things like memtest to not pick up problems with the memory then? And will I be able to literally just take out each stick and run the computer as normal in order to test them?

 

[Danny75]

Is it possible for things like memtest to not pick up problems with the memory then?

Yes, it is possible. It's handy when it discovers a fault because that ends the troubleshooting, but an issue with memory cannot be totally discounted even if it passes hours of Memtest. The only real way is to try with different RAM (or with just one stick and in different slots as you are doing, and hopefully it's not the whole kit that's bad).

And will I be able to literally just take out each stick and run the computer as normal in order to test them?

Yes. Just be thorough about powering down everything completely before removing/adding. Shutdown > switch PSU button to Off > wait for motherboard light to turn off > hold down the Start button on the case for 20-30 seconds to drain all remaining juice > then change out the sticks.

As you've just carried out a Windows install and one of the signs of faulty memory (or faulty drive) is corrupt files after an install, here's a simple check you can run in Command Prompt or Powershell (as Admin):

SFC /VERIFYONLY

 

[Argenthor]

Checking the individual sticks it is then!

Do you have a link to a site with the memory and specs?

After taking an actual look at the sticks, I believe they are: https://www.overclockers.co.uk/cors...00mhz-tri-channel-tr3x6g1600c9-my-169-cs.html (if that's of any use Inoton)

 

[Skynet5]

Unfortunately so.

Perhaps also check the bios and what volts your giving the RAM.

Just looked at that ram. I had it on my old x58...loved that build.

 

[Argenthor]

I took out the first stick of RAM and that seems to have been the problem. It seems to be working perfectly, at least for now, without any restarts or issues.

Is it possible that it could be an issue with that slot rather than the memory stick though? I should probably check it if so, but I'm slightly wary about tinkering about too much in there!

The one issue I have noticed in the games I've loaded up is that certain textures seem blurry now (e.g. my character's hair in Middle Earth: Shadow of War). I wouldn't have thought that I would see that going down from 8gb to 6gb?

EDIT: Seen the minimum specs for the game are 8gb so I think I've answered that question!