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RX 6600XT 1080p gaming for $379 on Aug 11

Soldato
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Uk
Or alternatively called business. Capitalism is private ownership of industries, rather than government. It’s why even much of China is now considered to be capitalism. Business needs to make profit to reinvest in R&D. Shareholders also take a cut.

Without enough profit, a business doesn’t invest in new products. AMD’s revenues have doubled year on year, with a 4 points increase in margin. This increased margin is very plausibly due to the significant increase in revenues whilst keeping their fixed cost constant/controlled. That is good business practice, without the need to take more margin on your product sales.

it certainly doesn’t support a view that customers are being ‘fleeced’ (taking someone’s money dishonestly) by AMD or Nvidia over GPU prices (or any of their consumer products for that matter).
We are being charged more for new products which are not even as good as the old products were in those price brackets. Take the 6600XT with a msrp of nearly £400 which we know will be £500+ by the time it gets to the customer, this isn't even as fast as last generation 2070 super/5700XT which were available for under £450 and as low as £350.

Then we had a 6 core CPU going for £300+ which was almost double the price of the previous generation 6 core while only being 15-23% faster but was slower in multithreaded vs the previous generation 8 core which sat in that price bracket.

We've been told of disruption from covid, poor yields, part shortages and component prices increasing, shipping costs increasing yet with seeming all these problems AMD / Nvidia and their hard done by AIB partners are all making record profits and this all stems from the fact that customers are being over charged.
 
Soldato
Joined
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Officially least sunny location -Ronskistats
We are being charged more for new products which are not even as good as the old products were in those price brackets. Take the 6600XT with a msrp of nearly £400 which we know will be £500+ by the time it gets to the customer, this isn't even as fast as last generation 2070 super/5700XT which were available for under £450 and as low as £350.

It was here before that. Not too distant really, the vega cards were decent once the deals dropped the prices down. Then came the 590 which was the same price as a 56 and weaker. Then the 5600XT came way after the 5700XT and the 'new' release price of it was around the same price as a 5700. I think its been a thing for a while and only the tech savvy enthusiasts can frown over it as regular public seems to just buy it as it is 'newer' and a higher number I guess (marketing baloney).
 
Soldato
Joined
9 Nov 2009
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24,769
Location
Planet Earth
If you`ve ever had any dealings at all with Digital River, them not selling AMD products in the UK is a blessing. Its why Nv have partnered with *A.N.Other* retailer for the official channel now here. Im sure @Gibbo has talked to AMD for a possible similar arrangement ?

But then that is AMD not caring about the UK! Nvidia seems to have managed OK,and ultimately I get the impression AMD does not really care about the UK as a market.

Exactomundo! :(

I also find it weird,people were criticising Intel and Nvidia for pricing shenanigans ,but AMD gets a free pass!

We are being charged more for new products which are not even as good as the old products were in those price brackets. Take the 6600XT with a msrp of nearly £400 which we know will be £500+ by the time it gets to the customer, this isn't even as fast as last generation 2070 super/5700XT which were available for under £450 and as low as £350.

Then we had a 6 core CPU going for £300+ which was almost double the price of the previous generation 6 core while only being 15-23% faster but was slower in multithreaded vs the previous generation 8 core which sat in that price bracket.

We've been told of disruption from covid, poor yields, part shortages and component prices increasing, shipping costs increasing yet with seeming all these problems AMD / Nvidia and their hard done by AIB partners are all making record profits and this all stems from the fact that customers are being over charged.

It was here before that. Not too distant really, the vega cards were decent once the deals dropped the prices down. Then came the 590 which was the same price as a 56 and weaker. Then the 5600XT came way after the 5700XT and the 'new' release price of it was around the same price as a 5700. I think its been a thing for a while and only the tech savvy enthusiasts can frown over it as regular public seems to just buy it as it is 'newer' and a higher number I guess (marketing baloney).

Just look above,AMD gets a free pass. Not Intel and Nvidia who were called all the names possible for doing it. It just proves a point - AMD was only playing "we love gamers" and are "the value brand" because they were behind. They don't even beat Nvidia in absolute performance,VRAM or featureset yet now are pricing almost the same as them. Anyone who can remember the days of the Athlon 64 can remember,AMD doing an about turn on pricing,platform longevity,etc the moment they had a few years of beating Intel. Its why the Core2 ended up being so devastating.

Also PC gamers are some of the weakest willed consumers I have ever seen. Some of the points people are making in this thread,were the same marketing points Nvidia viral marketing was making over 10 years ago on tech forums. But during that time,99% of enthusiasts just laughed in their face.

But when gamers are defending their rights to buy gamergirl bathwater,I suppose AMD/Nvidia know their market. Whales. I don't blame them either for charging as much as they can for yes-people like "consumers".

At least appreciate you have lived through some of the best years of PC gaming and hardware progression,value for money,etc. Its what happens when things get popularised,they get dumbed down more and more,and companies find more and more less discerning consumers,who are easier to manipulate.
 
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Caporegime
Joined
17 Feb 2006
Posts
29,263
Location
Cornwall
Or alternatively called business. Capitalism is private ownership of industries, rather than government. It’s why even much of China is now considered to be capitalism. Business needs to make profit to reinvest in R&D. Shareholders also take a cut.

Without enough profit, a business doesn’t invest in new products. AMD’s revenues have doubled year on year, with a 4 points increase in margin. This increased margin is very plausibly due to the significant increase in revenues whilst keeping their fixed cost constant/controlled. That is good business practice, without the need to take more margin on your product sales.

it certainly doesn’t support a view that customers are being ‘fleeced’ (taking someone’s money dishonestly) by AMD or Nvidia over GPU prices (or any of their consumer products for that matter).
A lot of businesses today are very shareholder focused, and this can often be to the detriment not only of their customers, but even their employees. Constantly screwing everyone to the max to give the shareholders the greatest possible return.

Not saying that's true for AMD (I have no idea), but I don't automatically assume greater profitability will result in more R&D, etc. Maybe it will. But it doesn't have to.

Ultimately as a consumer with no shares in AMD I just care about the value proposition of its products, and these 6600 series look absolutely awful :p Compared to the competition and compared to their own previous products.
 
Caporegime
Joined
17 Feb 2006
Posts
29,263
Location
Cornwall
I think Nvidia are so strong in the PC space now that AMD have virtually just given up trying to take more than they have, and they're stretching their pricing as much as possible to maximise profits.
Retail GPUs defo aren't a priority for them it seems, right now.

It's CPUs, consoles, OEMs. Retail GPUs are barely an afterthought! Or so it appears.
 
Caporegime
Joined
18 Oct 2002
Posts
29,679
Retail GPUs are barely an afterthought! Or so it appears.

I'd agree but Nvidia are at least showing that dGPU's are massively profitable! The mountain is so so hard to claim though, I'd imagine at the very least a 10 year plan is needed to make a big enough dent to make it worthwhile. Lisa-Su is going to have her eye on bigger prizes over the next 2/3 years...
 
Soldato
Joined
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Location
Officially least sunny location -Ronskistats
I'd agree but Nvidia are at least showing that dGPU's are massively profitable! The mountain is so so hard to claim though, I'd imagine at the very least a 10 year plan is needed to make a big enough dent to make it worthwhile. Lisa-Su is going to have her eye on bigger prizes over the next 2/3 years...

Lisa-Su will be away before long. If/when that happens, expect AMD to make some more clangers and nvidia to pull away again.
 
Associate
Joined
24 Feb 2021
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102
Location
Norfolk
A lot of businesses today are very shareholder focused, and this can often be to the detriment not only of their customers, but even their employees. Constantly screwing everyone to the max to give the shareholders the greatest possible return.

Not saying that's true for AMD (I have no idea), but I don't automatically assume greater profitability will result in more R&D, etc. Maybe it will. But it doesn't have to.

Ultimately as a consumer with no shares in AMD I just care about the value proposition of its products, and these 6600 series look absolutely awful :p Compared to the competition and compared to their own previous products.

I wouldn’t disagree with any of what you say.

A good business with a view to grow the business, and longevity, needs to balance the needs of their shareholders, customers and employees. Ignore one, and the business is likely to decline. If the business plans to exit the market, then they could milk the installed base at the expense of their employees and customers. I don’t believe AMD or Nvidia are in this phase - so they need to keep the balance right.

With Nvidia and AMD’s business growing at an incredible rate, it seems they are appealing to a large segment of the market. It could be argued that they have an excellent understanding of their market, and what it considers a good value proposition.

Many are unwilling to pay these current prices, and that is understandable. However, in business you often identify a segment of your customer base that you don’t consider to be your target - and that can change over time. Now I have no idea if that is the current strategic vision for AMD or Nvidia, but they may well have decided that the budget conscious GPU market segment is no longer part of their core, and are willing to walk away from it. If that were the case, those saying they will wait for prices to return to where they were 2 years ago might get a nasty shock - if AMD/Nvidia have decided the premium end of the market is their future focus, then those days may be over.

I have no evidence that this is the strategic direction, but it is food for thought for anyone who believes that their absence from buy products could force a particular action. You might inadvertently be doing exactly what they want.
 
Soldato
Joined
12 May 2014
Posts
5,225
Do you remember when everyone complained about £1000+ GPUs and the effect on the low end, and people said "its their money they can do what ever they want with it"?

We can complain all we like but we voted with our wallets and AMD and Nvidia have heard us loud and clear. If the top end shifts in price the whole product stack must follow suit to ensure "even" pricing spacing.
 
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Soldato
Joined
9 Nov 2009
Posts
24,769
Location
Planet Earth
Do you remember when everyone complained about £1000+ GPUs and the effect on the low end, and people said "its there money they can do what ever they want with it"?

We can complain all we like but we voted with our wallets and AMD and Nvidia have heard us load and clear. If the top end shifts in price the whole product stack must follow suit to ensure "even" pricing spacing.

I remember too - sadly what some of us predicted would happen,happened! :(
 
Soldato
Joined
21 Jul 2005
Posts
19,982
Location
Officially least sunny location -Ronskistats
Do you remember when everyone complained about £1000+ GPUs and the effect on the low end, and people said "its there money they can do what ever they want with it"?

We can complain all we like but we voted with our wallets and AMD and Nvidia have heard us load and clear. If the top end shifts in price the whole product stack must follow suit to ensure "even" pricing spacing.

:cry::cry::cry: @TNA I remember this well.. ;)

I remember too - sadly what some of us predicted would happen,happened! :(

You know the score @CAT-THE-FIFTH . I remember taking the bullets for it, and here we are.
 
Soldato
Joined
18 Oct 2002
Posts
6,748
For? The 550w PSU will be fine.
Is there any viable alternative card that will run on a 550w PSU? For example, Nvidia recommends a 600w PSU for a 3060ti. I've done some searching and can't find any card that performs "as well" as the 6600xt that can be run on a PSU with less than 600w.
 
Soldato
Joined
21 Jul 2005
Posts
19,982
Location
Officially least sunny location -Ronskistats
Is there any viable alternative card that will run on a 550w PSU? For example, Nvidia recommends a 600w PSU for a 3060ti. I've done some searching and can't find any card that performs "as well" as the 6600xt that can be run on a PSU with less than 600w.

Easily, look up the 5600XT, 5700, 3060, 2070 to name but a few. I know the vega stated it needed a 750w unit but when I had mine running a meter from the wall socket it was never using up my quota for the 750w supply I was using.
 
Soldato
Joined
9 Nov 2009
Posts
24,769
Location
Planet Earth
:cry::cry::cry: @TNA I remember this well.. ;)



You know the score @CAT-THE-FIFTH . I remember taking the bullets for it, and here we are.

Yep!

Is there any viable alternative card that will run on a 550w PSU? For example, Nvidia recommends a 600w PSU for a 3060ti. I've done some searching and can't find any card that performs "as well" as the 6600xt that can be run on a PSU with less than 600w.

My SFF system with a Ryzen 7 3700X and a RTX3060TI FE is just over 300W at the wall playing games. The GTX1080 before it was generally under 300W at the wall and I powered it off a 450W Corsair SF450 for most of its lifespan.

As long as you have a decent 550W PSU,and don't have a very power hungry CPU,I suspect you might be fine.
 
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