Subscription models for car spec upgrades... your thoughts?

lordrobs · 26 Jul 2021 at 21:06

OK, so this thread was inspired by https://www.motor1.com/news/521960/mercedes-eqs-rear-wheel-steering/ which, assuming it isn't some poorly timed April's fool or complete codswallop comes across as crazy to this particular neanderthal.

I get that we have a subscription for our phone, TV streaming service etc. But an annual fee for additional lock on your rear wheel steering?!

I really hate the idea of having something that has been hobbled by the manufacturer via a software lock. The only element I can accept it with is engine mapping because when your turbo 4 pot can put out 300bhp it doesn't make sense to make 5 different engines to get different power levels but dropping a chunk of change for 5.5° of lock... :confused:

Edit - just seen this https://www.motor1.com/news/505696/vw-sell-autonomous-tech/ which I'm not sure is better or worse. I think I'm more OK with it because it's a bit like upgrading to first class for a long trip :cry:

jpaul · 26 Jul 2021 at 21:31

new C class has rear wheel steer too, but if, like tesla which had the, paid for, performance upgrade unlock,
you pay them money money effectively an insurance policy against reduced reliability that that capability gives ... then why not.

The (lifetime) tesla self-drive capability/potential that people have paid upfront for, when the legislation and software matures,
I can see that being a yearly subscription, for those that didn't pay up front, manufacturer supporting various versions of car hardware/software isn't for free.

dlockers · 26 Jul 2021 at 21:48

Tesla have had this for ages. Rear heated seats, even battery capacity. When the California(?) wildfires (?) were happening, they unlocked the additional capacity for free temporarily.

muon · 27 Jul 2021 at 00:21

Software I will accept. The cost was in the development and not in the copying of the software.

Anything mechanical I won't. It's as silly as paying a yearly subscription for electric windows. If they want people to be able to amortise the cost then that is what finance is for and the APR is known.

In a subscription model you might end up paying multiple times over for something you used to be able to buy outright. It's like those silly electronics retailers with like 300% APR.

theone8181 · 27 Jul 2021 at 06:21

Wonder if people would find a way to unlock everything for free?

Desmo · 27 Jul 2021 at 12:30

dLockers said:
Tesla have had this for ages... even battery capacity

That was more of a byproduct of the manufacturing system rather than a proper option. When swapping from one type of battery to another before the actual model was released, some smaller battery cars shipped with a larger battery. At a later date, there was an option to unlock the extra capacity.

dlockers · 27 Jul 2021 at 13:00

Desmo said:
That was more of a byproduct of the manufacturing system rather than a proper option. When swapping from one type of battery to another before the actual model was released, some smaller battery cars shipped with a larger battery. At a later date, there was an option to unlock the extra capacity.

That may have been how it started but it is now available across the range. There is also a subscription to unlock quicker acceleration.

Hunterlit · 27 Jul 2021 at 13:09

theone8181 said:
Wonder if people would find a way to unlock everything for free?

I'd never pay a subscription for any extras, and the answer to that question is 'I would imagine so.

TheVoice · 27 Jul 2021 at 13:24

theone8181 said:
Wonder if people would find a way to unlock everything for free?

Considering people seem able to find a way to unlock and start the car itself for free, I can't imagine some optional features would present too much of a problem.

Desmo · 27 Jul 2021 at 13:25

dLockers said:
That may have been how it started but it is now available across the range. There is also a subscription to unlock quicker acceleration.

I don't know of any way to upgrade a Tesla battery apart from those odd circumstances I mentioned. There's a one of purchase to unlock quicker acceleration on some cars, but not all.

dlockers · 27 Jul 2021 at 13:28

TheVoice said:
Considering people seem able to find a way to unlock and start the car itself for free, I can't imagine some optional features would present too much of a problem.

There is a cheat device but they have done a software update to block it.

Nasher · 27 Jul 2021 at 13:42

Seems like a scam tbh.

You buy the car, but then have to keep paying extra to use all of it's feature lol. No thanks.

I'd be looking for ways to hack it and then block it from receiving any updates which might "fix" it.

dlockers · 27 Jul 2021 at 14:07

I'm not totally averse to it. The biggest issue with older cars infotainment, must like older mobile devices, is that the software ages so quickly. The only way to keep this software updated is to keep the vendor paid off. The same reason old videos games become useless due to cheaters etc. These dodgy in game purchases are the things keeping them as a going concern.

Disconnecting a Tesla from mothership sounds super dumb considering it is a highly connected vehicle.

jpaul · 27 Jul 2021 at 14:14

ze Germans started it

For £99 a year, I get:
Satnav map updates
Realtime traffic information
BMW Online (A minorly useful gimmick, puts weather on the map etc)
Remote Services (unlock/lock car, ventilate car remotely (this is just the blower motor not the AC) and locate car via GPS).

lordrobs · 27 Jul 2021 at 14:19

dLockers said:
I'm not totally averse to it. The biggest issue with older cars infotainment, must like older mobile devices, is that the software ages so quickly. The only way to keep this software updated is to keep the vendor paid off. The same reason old videos games become useless due to cheaters etc. These dodgy in game purchases are the things keeping them as a going concern.

Disconnecting a Tesla from mothership sounds super dumb considering it is a highly connected vehicle.

I'd agree with that. Paying a subscription for some form of 'connected services' package to keep your maps up to date, charging point map populated and real time traffic (for example) seems fair enough. It's just that issue of unlocking physical hardware which already exists for a fee that sticks in my craw. From the original link I posted;

How does it work? According to Mercedes: "An electric motor drives a spindle at the rear axle via a drive belt. This makes axial adjustments to the spindle."

So $575 a year to allow a motor to spin a few more turns?! :confused:

The only way it could get weirder for me is if Mercedes were to "mint" 10,000 rear steering NFTs. 5000 Common which give you 6 degrees, 3000 Uncommon which give you 8 degrees, 1500 Rare which give you 9 degrees and just 500 Legendary which give you the full 10.5. All of which "drop" on the day of the cars launch and then end up on a secondary market selling for between 0.5 and 2 ETH :rolleyes:

Honestly, I think I might call it quits and go live in a cave :cry:

dlockers · 27 Jul 2021 at 14:22

It is uncomfortable but I expect the cost is something like:

Cost of Managing Hardware Options
Management Overhead for Options List + Management Overheard for Managing Options Integration + Configurable (per vehicle) Production Line + JIT Parts Specific to VIN + Different Wiring Loom (?) + Intercompatibility Messing Around

Cost of Software Option
IT Platform (which we invested in anyway to enable remote services subscriptions)

The only way to get economies of scale on hardware is to mass produce it. It probably costs Merc more to have a non-steering rear axle and a regular axle; all said and done. The benefit of supply chain simplification is huge.