The beast file: Google

[sorn21]

At uni just now, I'll watch the video when I get home.

But I agree, as much as I love Google, I can't help but wonder what would happen if it turned evil.

Skynet all over again!

 

[Tefal]

Of course you have a choice about government, that's what elections are.

So if you voted monster raving loony for the last 10 years you chose the government?


No, much in the same way your IT department chooses the browser on your work computer, only a portion of the population chose the government.

It's wrong to suggest that Google, and "the government" holding personal information about you is the same thing. It isn't.

That was my point...

With google you can not give them information, with the government you cannot refuse.

 

[Tefal]

Really, why are they building their own Chrome OS then?

So Microsoft own your pc do they?

 

[Macro]

So Microsoft own your pc do they?

Not as a physical asset, no. What a ridiculous thing to say.

 

[Tefal]

Not as a physical asset, no. What a ridiculous thing to say.

So saying google want to own your pc by producing a browser or operating system is equally ridiculous yes?

 

[Lysander]

Australian women are the very worst people on the planet. I wouldn't trust them further than I could spit.

 

[Macro]

With google you can not give them information, with the government you cannot refuse.

The government are accountable to the voters, judiciary, parliament and a whole bunch of check and balances put in place to protect you.

Google amasses personal data about you no matter if you choose to use their products or not and there's no easy way for the general public to "opt out" and protect their privacy

So if you voted monster raving loony for the last 10 years you chose the government?

No, and quite rightly so. You have your opinion and opportunity to support whomever you choose. You also have your right to make that case for that person to the rest of the electorate. If your chosen representative has merit then there is every chance they can be elected to parliament.

Seriously, if you think that in any way a democratically elected goverment and Google holding your private information is the same thing then this is a pointless conversation.

Enough with the misleading straw man argument already.

 

[Macro]

So saying google want to own your pc by producing a browser or operating system is equally ridiculous yes?

Hang on. You made the statement "Google don't want to own your PC".

Either that was a pointless statement akin to "Google don't want to own your carpet" which has no relevancy, or you were referring to "owning your PC" in much the same way as people refer to "owning the browser", i.e. your interaction with the internet/pc/whatever.

If your point was just a random statement about physical ownership of something then, errrr... no **** sherlock.

If it was the second then the Chrome OS clearly indicated Google ambitions to have a degree of "ownership" of your interaction with what otherwise would be a inoperable piece of hardware.

Maybe just I missed what it was you meant by "Google don't want to own your PC"?

 

[Tefal]

Hang on. You made the statement "Google don't want to own your PC".

Either that was a pointless statement akin to "Google don't want to own your carpet" which has no relevancy, or you were referring to "owning your PC" in much the same way as people refer to "owning the browser", i.e. your interaction with the internet/pc/whatever.

If your point was just a random statement about physical ownership of something then, errrr... no **** sherlock.

No the video said google want to own your pc.


I said that was a load of crap, you then said

Really, why are they building their own Chrome OS then?

AS if that somehow proved they did want to own your pc.

Yet MS who make both os's and browsers do not own your pc.


Making software in no way makes you want to own the hardware it runs on.

 

[Tefal]

The government are accountable to the voters, judiciary, parliament and a whole bunch of check and balances put in place to protect you.

Really?

pretty sure the government holds on to the finger prints and DNA of people proved innocent.

Also they seemingly regularly lose the information, using such advanced security as encrypting the data and then writing the pasword on the disc containing it...


I saw no compensation given to any of the people whose information was lost/abused in such a way.

Google amasses personal data about you no matter if you choose to use their products or not and there's no easy way for the general public to "opt out" and protect their privacy

Google can't get your information if you don't give it to them.

They can't just demand you give them your data like the government can.

No, and quite rightly so. You have your opinion and opportunity to support whomever you choose. You also have your right to make that case for that person to the rest of the electorate. If your chosen representative has merit then there is every chance they can be elected to parliament.

So you do not chose the government then?

Seriously, if you think that in any way a democratically elected goverment and Google holding your private information is the same thing then this is a pointless conversation.

My whole point is that they are different :/

Enough with the misleading straw man argument already.

indeed you seem to have gone off on some completely obscure side track

 

[Macro]

No the video said google want to own your pc.


I said that was a load of crap, you then said



AS if that somehow proved they did want to own your pc.

Yet MS who make both os's and browsers do not own your pc.


Making software in no way makes you want to own the hardware it runs on.

No one ever said Google or Microsoft want to physically own your PC. Owning your PC is a common IT term to describe in effect controlling your interaction with the PC/Internet/Whatever by providing the OS or browser.

Under that description you could quite rightly say currently Microsoft "own" the PC as do Apple.

It's not a physical ownership being referred to.

 

[Macro]

indeed you seem to have gone off on some completely obscure side track

That'll be you. Someone else posted that as the Government have your personal data Google having it as well isn't a problem and we should move on.

I replied saying the government and Google owning data are clearly different things.

You then tried to use a straw man argument about the government to support your view of Google. Apparently you want to vote for the monster raving loony party and they are unlikely to get into government, so the government are bad and Google is good.. And you say I was on an obscure sidetrack????

 

[Tefal]

No one ever said Google or Microsoft want to physically own your PC. Owning your PC is a common IT term to describe in effect controlling your interaction with the PC/Internet/Whatever by providing the OS or browser.

So when the video said google wanted to own your DNA they where referring to your browser?


Since when has "own" meant interact?

 

[Tefal]

That'll be you. Someone else posted that as the Government have your personal data Google having it as well isn't a problem and we should move on.

I replied saying the government and Google owning data are clearly different things.

You then tried to use a straw man argument about the government to support your view of Google. Apparently you want to vote for the monster raving loony party and they are unlikely to get into government, so the government are bad and Google is good.. And you say I was on an obscure sidetrack????

You said we all choose the government but do not choose to use google.

We can choose to use google, but not all of us choose the government.


I never said google where good.

 

[platypus]

Or you know, adblock and never see a single advert.

Which search engine do you use and what makes you think they aren't doing the same?

Currently Bing, who hold their data for six months less then Google, not perfect, but a better option then Google for me.

 

[Macro]

So when the video said google wanted to own your DNA they where referring to your browser?:

Are you suggesting they meant Google actually "physically" want to own the cells in your body that make up DNA? Or that they might want to "own" the data produced by DNA sequencing as it could prove to be useful to them at some point? I'd suggest the latter but you still seem confused with owning a physical thing.

You said we all choose the government but do not choose to use google.

What I said was the government is answerable to us the electorate, judiciary blah blah blah, Google are answerable to their share holders.

Not sure if you're just being argumentative, obtuse or are a bit confused in any case it's not really delivering any value to the thread and general conversation around if Google have the potential to be a "bad thing" for a free internet and peoples privacy.

If it makes you happy, yes, you're right, just don't use Google, or any web service that has a google advertising platform, or post on any forums/services that Google datamines and searches. Oh, and if you've used any of those in the past good luck at getting that data removed from Googles databases and archives.

 

[Owenb]

That's hardly "educating yourself" It's a distinctly self serving blog based on the personal opinion a single ex Microsoft employee who now owns a company developing web apps.

How do you know that "most people here aren't qualified to comment on something they don't understand"? Patronising much?

Pardon? Congratulations on recommending a self-serving, single source of information. Are you qualified to comment on the subject? You want me to elaborate? Assuming I have your permission as someone who isn't qualified to comment, I shall do so.

So can either of ye tell me what ye don't agree with in that Blog or are ye just going to fudge the issue because of a lack of understanding?

The difference between do no evil Google and Microsoft is, MS are a damn sight less hypocritical about their monopoly position. And abuse thereof. Although I don't need to reference Microsoft really as the reason Google worries me has nothing to do with them.

What monopoly? Google have NO monopoly. They are the market leader with ~65% but they are going up against a bigger company that has more money, experience and resources.

Like most google fans, you don't care what they do with your personal data.

Your right, I don't!

 

[aslco]

Animation was great

 

[SMN]

In a world that contains numerous "evil" organisations, i'm pretty happy about Google getting more of a foothold. Would you prefer an Andy Grove ran Intel were as dominant again? If Google are the "evil organisation" depicted in oh so many "Disturbed" music videos, then i think our future is pretty rosy.

"Oh no, what on earth are we going to do with constant new technology, innovations and ideas - lets get Gates, Grove, etc to come and destroy comptetition rather than try and be better - mm thats better"

And as for "personal data", its not really personal - your broadcasting it across what is basically a public medium - its about as personal as having a phone call in a street or buying a product from a shop, people can watch you buy it, or eavesdrop on what you are saying.

 

[jaybee]

I tend to think we're moving from a world where privacy was implied as a base status, i.e. "unless you ask me and I actively publish or tell you the information then mind your own business" to a world where unless you actively opt out or protect your personal data it will be assumed to be public domain. And that's how companies like Google make money.

This is so true, sadly. It's turned around now that we have to actively go out of our way to stop getting targetted by advertising and leaving personal information out there.