The Indoor Riding/ Zwift/ TrainerRoad etc. Thread

Soldato
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TLDR: massive Roadie post incoming!

Solid. It was a Startech 16ft active extension. It has greatly reduced the drop outs but not perfect.

Roady, 5:30pm Tuesday. Usually led by Nik from Denmark. After finding this weeks one really tough, I was then quite ill yesterday morning, maybe it was an early warning feeling bad Tuesday night!

WRT the extension cable I had thought it was fixed but I had one drop out tonight, luckily after my race.

I’m going to email Tacx as I am learning more towards it being the trainer. I’ve never had this problem in the past and it’s very intermittent. I have the Ant+ dongle positioned immediately under the trainer now.

See what tacx say, but I’m going to change Zwift to take power from the power meter instead so even if I lose cadence/controlled trainer I should be fine continuing my ride for the 10 seconds or so it falls over for?

Zwift also seemed to have done a minor update which left me with very dark graphics today. I put up with it as I was time crunched at the start, but increased the gamma to 150% on the graphics card after which fixed it, maybe a little too much.

Did the Evo CC sprint race which is usually just 20-25 minutes super hard. Zwift wasn’t displaying data on the right at the start and some rogue avatars on there who weren’t in the race. Just went as hard as possible and maintained the effort gauging off the mini map where I was. Just on the back of the front group was the answer! I tried to have a little sit up on the downhill switchbacks on the volcano flat. You can usually sit up and bit and drift back on, tried to let two other guys do the work, but we dropped off!

Kept riding with the two guys & then there were complaints from the front bunch, a ZP rider going 6,7 on the front! I lazed about here as there was the main B group behind and I knew they would catch us. Continued being lazy in the big group of 20. Last lap and hill, decided to spice it up, came through the group at the base of the hill and pinned it at 6.5wkg+ in the saddle, looked like it was dragging out and my legs felt good. Kept it pinned even when they were burning. One guy came round me on the line, but better than being swamped, 1 minute power record on the trainer! 5th overall as three Bs made the front group and even though they rode 4+ they aren’t A grade on ZP yet.
 
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Soldato
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Bought a booster turbo for £90 off ebay. He's only 7 miles down the road too so picking it up later. Even including a turbo tyre too
Result! Congrats!

I’m doing a little Vo2 block before starting back into sweet spot base as I know my VO2 sucks. It’s a suggested plan from TR’s Coach Chad you can find on the forum but effectively builds from 30s on / 30s off up to 3 minutes by the end. I’m “enjoying” it so far but it is getting harder!
I got sent a link to a PDF from Rowe & King which is their '30 day beginner FTP builder' if anyone wants it let me know (I've not had a good read yet but looks quite good with lots of info in it). I won't post the link here as probably shouldn't share it, but it came from a public post on Facebook so...

TLDR: massive Roadie post incoming!<snip>

Kept riding with the two guys & then there were complaints from the front bunch, a ZP rider going 6,7 on the front! I lazed about here as there was the main B group behind and I knew they would catch us. Continued being lazy in the big group of 20. Last lap and hill, decided to spice it up, came through the group at the base of the hill and pinned it at 6.5wkg+ in the saddle, looked like it was dragging out and my legs felt good. Kept it pinned even when they were burning. One guy came round me on the line, but better than being swamped, 1 minute power record on the trainer! 5th overall as three Bs made the front group and even though they rode 4+ they aren’t A grade on ZP yet.
Good work and good to see someone else writing reports. Have to admit I've been quite lax recently, they just take far too much time and I've been riding that much harder most of the time I'm seriously in the hurt locker and miss so much so not worth reporting... ;)

Good to see you getting a little more tactical - easing for chase groups when you know the course well enough to know they'll catch you anyway, then smashing them! :D

TTT last night on Astoria 8 (New York) X3 lap course with a bunch of 45s-1 minute ramps on it. Brutal.

https://www.strava.com/activities/4074834106

We lost 1 guy to a technical, leader blew up but didn't expect him to last the pace as he's a low B (like me) and we had several strong riders along. Lost another one to a split from when we caught 2 other groups in quick succession. So 5 riders left, 4 of them high-B's, 1 or 2 who are probably sandbagging as B's and should be A. And me. Low-B. I did not expect or deserve to be there with these guys! :o :D

I only managed my first turn - although I was first in rotation so I did around 2 minutes from the start to allow the guys to group behind. I felt ok. But once into rotation the pace was so hot that most of the ramps I was holding 5w/kg just to keep in place and that burned me before second rotation. Through the second lap is when we lost most of our riders so much of the time it was surge & ease to try and close gaps/get them back on or see if they came back rather than a proper rotation. I was fighting to just sit on wheels and the couple of gaps I closed just kept me burning hard so think I was only in a position capable to pull once or twice. Last 1.5 laps I knew I couldn't close those same gaps as earlier again so my whole focus was on maintaining the group and position on climbs. Being the weakest I had to surge most of them to make it up in the group to still be there over the top (where being also the heaviest the gaps open for me). Somehow managed it but must have blown myself up at least 3 or 4 times, calling the guys (on Discord) "I'm going to blow the next don't ease for me!", yet somehow made it to the finish (we only needed 4 of 5 finishers). Put everything into the finish from 3km to go where I almost had to chase on the longer draggy ramp, convinced again I was blowing, so came through to lead them out. Somehow maintained the group as I eased after so just did my sprint lead-out with 0.8 to go expecting again to blow up... Somehow held on to the line and was 2nd across it. :o

That's gotta be the hardest one yet and the deepest I've gone recently (100% intensity). I go deep in many of my sprints but that when already deep in threshold for so long before is just something else. I don't know how I'm able to do it when already burning so much for so long. Although admittedly I threw up a little again after this one, thought I was ok, then 5 minutes into cooldown get a bile/gas and sicky feeling. It's not proper 'adult'/food sick, just some kinda bile/snot/phlegm build up I seem to get. Unsure what it means as only seen it a couple of times recently when I go really deep. Lactate spew?! :D :o

EDIT: Did Turbocharged on Tuesday and had a photo finish (for 89th place!) with a guy who'd broken away from the massive group a number of times and I'd closed him down. He was using the Sterzo to do it - he'd gap the group on the opposite side of the road so wouldn't take riders with him when he went so took quite a bit of chasing. 4 minute video of the end to see how rapid that gap closes and just how close on the line it was. He's a few followers so could be a good watch and fun guy to follow if that's your thing...: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/742058229
 
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Soldato
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I don’t have the best sprint but can throw down decent watts for a longer time so gotta play to my strengths. Feeling more like I can race in B instead of just survive now.

haven’t had a reply from Garmin about my ticket, changed Zwift to pickup data from my crank power meter instead and that’s been OK so far...
 
Associate
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Yorkshire
Hi all,

Is there a guide somewhere to tweeking the graphic/vid card settings for Zwift anywhere please? My 2 hours of googling, said question has not paid off, and my head hurts :/

Thanks!
 
Soldato
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Hereford
I don’t have the best sprint but can throw down decent watts for a longer time so gotta play to my strengths. Feeling more like I can race in B instead of just survive now.

haven’t had a reply from Garmin about my ticket, changed Zwift to pickup data from my crank power meter instead and that’s been OK so far...
So that points more to a problem with your trainer, as certainly with the USB extensions you eliminated distance from the sensor to it... Annoying.

Race in B with me and give me a tow then! Think you'll find these bigger race series something else! ;)

https://www.strava.com/activities/4098953508
Last nights Sundown was a B race with 178 riders. Front group sped off and easily 140/150 riders in it and I was chasing coat tails far earlier than normal. Massive long line of probably 20-30 riders somehow kept in kinda contact over the 'esses' and the slope afterwards, but the speed was just so high for so long that I was *that* rider who opened a gap on the descent. Well one of the first anyway, within a few seconds of me doing so there's lots of other gaps around too so it suddenly became a 5, then 8s gap and a mini-bunch of maybe 5-6 guys on me but nobody pushing hard enough to close it. Same behind. I just sat up and waited for chase group to form/join together big enough to start working. Did a long pull but nobody else seemed willing to work that hard so I just sat in the 3rd lap waiting to go with any moves on the 4th.

I wasn't feeling great (haven't for a few days) so resolved to take it kinda easier and not utterly destroy myself as that's not a course to be chasing solo/closing large gaps. Certainly not from back in 120th place! Group of 10, then 20 and nearly 30 at one point. The few efforts I put in where to close gaps to scattered riders up front and just keep the group speed up. Resolved to ride for the finish as no teammates around. Last lap really thinned the group down to around a dozen, I'd thought to go long from the last slope (after the rollers), but when it came the others surged before me so I hit the first one hard to make the selection, then just paced the remaining rollers and I went a little easier up the final slope, letting them work, bit more of an effort to keep the front wheels within reach rather than catch them! The downhill section things really strung out and I was on a good wheel so just sat on it rather than trying to catch the few up front, come the flat the gaps closed a little so I then bust out my sprint to take them all. For 106th (102nd) place! ;)

My sprint was actually a little shorter than some of the recent ones, without a massive kick (more of a ramp) then just keeping the power on to come past riders rather than kicking. Good practice and result, especially as after recovering didn't feel like I went really deep (as I have done recently - wasn't sick!) and strain myself too much. Hopefully whatever flat feeling I've had a few days that's hitting my motivation clears as Thursday is going to be a tough one in the TTT again (which has really turned into my main ride of the week).

Hi all,

Is there a guide somewhere to tweeking the graphic/vid card settings for Zwift anywhere please? My 2 hours of googling, said question has not paid off, and my head hurts :/

Thanks!
Very little settings that I can recall within Zwift. Other than Display mode. Some Medium/High/Ultra detail setting is all you have alongside display mode. I don't recall anything else. I'm running 720p on a 1080p setup just to get some better framerates. Doesn't look bad on my external 32" TV.

Best info is here and I just learnt a few things myself: https://zwiftinsider.com/zwift-pc-guide/
 
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Soldato
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Yeah I think it’s more trainer than anything else now Roady. Tacx/Garmin finally replied after two weeks.

Asked me to test by riding the Tacx app... er no. I’m not spending weeks riding that instead of Zwift to potentially highlight the issue in their software.

My trainer is out of warranty so I’ll just use crank measurements, it still alters resistance etc and cadence reads fine, just avoid the annoying random drop out!
 
Soldato
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I've splashed out on another fan to see if it's possible not to finish a TT session dripping wet.

Have to laugh that CPC have it in the desk fan category :D

https://cpc.farnell.com/pro-elec/pel01927/20-box-fan/dp/HG01084
Haha amazing, a 20" 'desk' fan! :D

Just to note I finish my TTT's dripping wet with 2 fans bigger than that and the small 900T Honeywell everyone loves (but I wouldn't rate it as a solo fan, it's neat and tidy but airflow isn't great for Turbo in the summer).

It's hard to know if things like air pressure and airflow come into it like they do with PC cooling... Part of me thinks go for as big an airflow that you can for the space you have - more simulation of outside airflow at speed over your whole body, rather than pressure which would seem more like a strong isolated/condensed headwind, leaving you with really cold/cool spots towards the middle of the airflow and very little further away?!

Asked me to test by riding the Tacx app... er no. I’m not spending weeks riding that instead of Zwift to potentially highlight the issue in their software.
How often do you think you're seeing the dropout? If it where once or twice in a 30 minute session could be worth doing a couple of 'interval' or just base sessions in their app? Any more than that, then yes I'd say forget about it and work around it as you have been.

Still like the idea of picking up a crankarm PWM for my trainer bike. Someone I know was selling a 105 (5800) Stages for £220 but he wouldn't budge on price...
 
Soldato
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Can I ask a question please?

I've just bought a classic trainer (Elite Qubo Fluid) and have noticed that because the contact pressure between the tyre and the roller is set only by the riders weight that the rolling resistance changes massively between seated and standing positions due to my weight shifting forwards (like half as difficult).

Surely that makes any power calculation based on rear wheel speed meaningless?

Is it possible that my tyre pressure is far to low? It feels pretty firm?
 
Soldato
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What spec PCs are people using for Zwift?

Once my smart turbo fund is full enough and I upgrade my trainer, I fancy a go on Zwift. I currently use a Core i5 Intel NUC but I expect the on-board Intel HD graphics will struggle. £120 gets a refurbished Dell Core i5-2400, 8GB RAM, SSD and a W10 license. I can then add a GTX 1650 (currently around £135 to £150) for decent graphics umph (display is a 1080p TV) - everything I've read says to avoid AMD graphics as they suck at OpenGL.

I did look at building something but a legit W10 license costs almost as much as the whole refurbed PC (with license).
 
Man of Honour
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What spec PCs are people using for Zwift?

Once my smart turbo fund is full enough and I upgrade my trainer, I fancy a go on Zwift. I currently use a Core i5 Intel NUC but I expect the on-board Intel HD graphics will struggle. £120 gets a refurbished Dell Core i5-2400, 8GB RAM, SSD and a W10 license. I can then add a GTX 1650 (currently around £135 to £150) for decent graphics umph (display is a 1080p TV) - everything I've read says to avoid AMD graphics as they suck at OpenGL.

I did look at building something but a legit W10 license costs almost as much as the whole refurbed PC (with license).

Slightly left-field, but I use an Apple TV 4k and it is great (very little fuss at all) , tbh... But then I don't race.
 
Associate
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474
What spec PCs are people using for Zwift?

Once my smart turbo fund is full enough and I upgrade my trainer, I fancy a go on Zwift. I currently use a Core i5 Intel NUC but I expect the on-board Intel HD graphics will struggle. £120 gets a refurbished Dell Core i5-2400, 8GB RAM, SSD and a W10 license. I can then add a GTX 1650 (currently around £135 to £150) for decent graphics umph (display is a 1080p TV) - everything I've read says to avoid AMD graphics as they suck at OpenGL.

I did look at building something but a legit W10 license costs almost as much as the whole refurbed PC (with license).

I went overkill with a Ryzen 3600x, 1660 Super and M2 SSD. Love it.

Join the FB group ZPCMR - Zwift PC Master Race - some good knowledge on there (including documents/guides for getting the right spec) of doing exactly what you're talking about doing ie. buy a refurb Dell then add a 1650.
 
Soldato
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Slightly left-field, but I use an Apple TV 4k and it is great (very little fuss at all) , tbh... But then I don't race.

I did look briefly at Apple TV yesterday. Sort of ruled it out as I think it's BT only, so no ANT+ support.

I went overkill with a Ryzen 3600x, 1660 Super and M2 SSD. Love it.

Join the FB group ZPCMR - Zwift PC Master Race - some good knowledge on there (including documents/guides for getting the right spec) of doing exactly what you're talking about doing ie. buy a refurb Dell then add a 1650.

FB? Eeeww! :D Cheers for the pointer though - sounds like I'm looking down the right route with a refurb.
 
Soldato
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Hereford
Can I ask a question please?

I've just bought a classic trainer (Elite Qubo Fluid) and have noticed that because the contact pressure between the tyre and the roller is set only by the riders weight that the rolling resistance changes massively between seated and standing positions due to my weight shifting forwards (like half as difficult).

Surely that makes any power calculation based on rear wheel speed meaningless?

Is it possible that my tyre pressure is far to low? It feels pretty firm?
Yes, pretty meaningless unless you have some way of cranking/clamping the trainer against the tyre in nearly every other wheel-on trainer design. Just an obvious design flaw with them and probable advice is just to avoid standing or doing high power & short intervals. You do get similar issues on all of the wheel-on trainers when trying to do so.

Tyre pressure could be too low, when I ran a wheel-on I generally got my 23/25mm rear to 100PSI and checked it/topped it up every week or so. Still lots of slippage on the two on-wheels I've had (Vortex & Road Machine) but that's just limitations of the trainer designs and the way they work. Also why Direct Drive is king.

That's why anyone who really gets into it, or wants accuracy is using Direct Drive trainers, some even with additional power meters. Sorry that doesn't help you much!

What spec PCs are people using for Zwift?

Once my smart turbo fund is full enough and I upgrade my trainer, I fancy a go on Zwift. I currently use a Core i5 Intel NUC but I expect the on-board Intel HD graphics will struggle. £120 gets a refurbished Dell Core i5-2400, 8GB RAM, SSD and a W10 license. I can then add a GTX 1650 (currently around £135 to £150) for decent graphics umph (display is a 1080p TV) - everything I've read says to avoid AMD graphics as they suck at OpenGL.

I did look at building something but a legit W10 license costs almost as much as the whole refurbed PC (with license).
Zwiftinsider link I put a few posts back is about the best I've seen, until then I'd not heard about the AMD 'issue'. Single threaded performance is quite key, even as far as to choose an i3 with a higher clock speed over an i5 with possibly more cores. RAM is obviously easily to upgrade and think general consensus is to run 8gb.

I find performance ok on my cheapy i5-4200M (2.5-3.1ghtz) with 4GB ram, SSD and Nvidia 740M 2gb @720p. So start from there as a baseline budget spec and you probably can't go too far wrong. That Dell does sound good for the money, just check what GPU's it'll take and then what outputs they have (along with the TV you're hoping to use). HDMI is usually easiest if using a standard TV. DVI-D to HDMI cables are much cheaper, reliable & easier than using 'active' adaptors. You can upgrade W7 or W8 to free W10 still as there's a bit of a 'loophole' where it's available to some systems (and people...)

I did look briefly at Apple TV yesterday. Sort of ruled it out as I think it's BT only, so no ANT+ support.
Yeah AppleTV is great for the money, especially if wanting to go 4K (although pretty pointless with Zwift). Although any Apple you're limited to BT only devices and only 2 of them at any one time. So if you want HRM, Trainer and an additional PWM/Cadence/Headphones you're out of luck. Also Lightening adaptors to convert to HDMI and such are far more expensive than others...
 
Soldato
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Riding my bike
Yes, pretty meaningless unless you have some way of cranking/clamping the trainer against the tyre in nearly every other wheel-on trainer design. Just an obvious design flaw with them and probable advice is just to avoid standing or doing high power & short intervals. You do get similar issues on all of the wheel-on trainers when trying to do so.

Tyre pressure could be too low, when I ran a wheel-on I generally got my 23/25mm rear to 100PSI and checked it/topped it up every week or so. Still lots of slippage on the two on-wheels I've had (Vortex & Road Machine) but that's just limitations of the trainer designs and the way they work. Also why Direct Drive is king.

That's why anyone who really gets into it, or wants accuracy is using Direct Drive trainers, some even with additional power meters. Sorry that doesn't help you much!

I've just bought some 12mm threaded bar and am going to "complete the triangle" on the trainer with an adjustable rear side. I will then be able to get the lightest pressure on the roller that doesn't slip and get the most accurate zpower measurement possible.

Just waiting for a 1" hole saw to arrive tomorrow to complete the project :)

Anyone interested in the results?
 
Soldato
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Wigan
I've just bought some 12mm threaded bar and am going to "complete the triangle" on the trainer with an adjustable rear side. I will then be able to get the lightest pressure on the roller that doesn't slip and get the most accurate zpower measurement possible.

Just waiting for a 1" hole saw to arrive tomorrow to complete the project :)

Anyone interested in the results?

Did you get it working?

Did the 3R group workout tonight, ended up being a B grade not C workout, had to ease off a touch on the last two laps to stay with the group.

The rest/recovery was 3wkg which is a bit much for me.
 
Soldato
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Throw a pic up, but not because anyone is using that particular trainer here, it might draw google searches in for people looking for a fix. Also we do like a good bodge/hack in here! :D ;)
 
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