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The Labour Party: Where do we go from here?

Discussion in 'Speaker's Corner' started by q974739, 25 Nov 2015.

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  1. Judgeneo

    Capodecina

    Joined: 15 May 2010

    Posts: 10,064

    Location: Out of Coventry

    Rumours abounding again of a coup v2, (Clive) Lewis booglaloo.
     
  2. Uther

    Capodecina

    Joined: 16 Jun 2005

    Posts: 14,584

  3. JeditOjanen

    Soldato

    Joined: 7 Feb 2011

    Posts: 5,676

    The actual rumours are that Corbyn has decided to step down, probably after the final vote on Article 50 being invoked. He was only ever really a placeholder anyway, his job is to move the party back to the left and away from toxic Blairism. Lewis is Corbyn's natural successor, he just didn't have enough time in Parliament before. If he takes over he'll be able to fight Corbyn's corner but without the baggage.
     
  4. Terminal_Boy

    Sgarrista

    Joined: 13 Apr 2013

    Posts: 8,869

    Location: La France

    #savejeremy
     
  5. DavidMarq

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 2 Jul 2004

    Posts: 1,535

    Location: Stevenage

    That must be the most inappropriate use of "casus belli" that I have ever seen. :rolleyes:
     
  6. Secret_Window

    Mobster

    Joined: 10 Aug 2006

    Posts: 4,990

    Hopefully there will be no one left to form a shadow cabinet, and he will be replaced. Only because, I want an actual opposition.
     
  7. SPG

    Soldato

    Joined: 28 Jul 2010

    Posts: 7,001

    The labour party is dead, Blair sort to that when he took the conservative middle ground. That and a great deal of people never new what Labour actually is.

    The entire organisation is a shambles, we it to split once and for all. As it stands they will always be a mess.
     
  8. do_ron_ron

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Oct 2002

    Posts: 10,446

    Labour are in a blind panic about losing a seat in the upcoming bi-elections. They are voting for brexit to prevent their seat being lost to UKIP. They are basically terrified of rocking the boat at a time when the boat needs to be more than just rocked.
     
  9. JeditOjanen

    Soldato

    Joined: 7 Feb 2011

    Posts: 5,676

    You think? It feels like a war to me.
     
  10. DavidMarq

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 2 Jul 2004

    Posts: 1,535

    Location: Stevenage

    I have not seen anyone taking up arms...

    This is fortunate for the Corbynistas as being largely pacifists, unilateralist or appeasers it would be a bloody massacre.
     
  11. Stretch

    Capodecina

    Joined: 14 Feb 2004

    Posts: 12,915

    Location: Peoples Republic of Histonia, Cambridge

    At the moment, it's very hard to see who he's trying to please. I can't see his approach appealing to those who wanted to leave, and I certainly don't see it appealing to the majority of their support base who wanted to remain, or even the hard core labour party members who made him leader.

    He's tried to confront the government on a few issues, and the minute they call his bluff he backs down.

    Lastly, he can't even control his own party.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38856992

    He is the lamest of lame duck opposition leaders. It's absurd.
     
  12. Meridian

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 11,998

    Location: Vvardenfell


    You do understand that's why most Tories voted for it as well? Brexit was only ever a minority view for the Tories, but UKIP was stealing legions of voters from them. The only way to get the voters back was to agree with UKIP and make them redundant.
     
  13. scorza

    Caporegime

    Joined: 22 Jun 2004

    Posts: 26,685

    Location: Deep England

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-38950597

    A report in this morning's Sunday Times (denied by Labour natch) suggests they are already preparing for life after Corbyn. A focus group was asked for a reaction to the names of big-hitting shadow cabinet members Angela Raynor and Rebecca Long-Bailey. I'm guessing a confused shrug of the shoulders was the top response.
     
  14. Uther

    Capodecina

    Joined: 16 Jun 2005

    Posts: 14,584

    Well to be fair I would have shrugged my shoulders too, as I've never heard of either of them! Maybe that's the problem, it's like Labour don't even exist as a serious political party currently. Does anyone seriously think this 'opposition' can take on the Tories any time in the next decade? They are completely in the wilderness, and don't have a clue what to do, or what direction to go in.
     
  15. Meridian

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 11,998

    Location: Vvardenfell


    One theory going the rounds is that Corbyn now accepts he can't win, and wants to hand over the reins. The general rule is that a new leader needs to be in place at least two years before an election, hence the polling now. Those two candidates are seen as left-wingers (apparently - I've never heard of them either) which suggests the poll was organised by the Corbyn people, and these are continuity candidates. They want to keep a Left agenda, but lose the visible face. Trouble is, pretty much every Labour candidate that could even vaguely be described as "someone I've heard of of" (and thus electable) is a Centrist. And Labour still haven't worked out how to deal with the Blair legacy, meaning no matter how electable they may or not be to the country, the Party wants nothing to do with them. Once they lose the next election, then they might be desperate enough to move to the centre. But not until.
     
  16. Mr Jack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 19 May 2004

    Posts: 21,632

    Location: Nordfriesland, Germany

    Had you heard of Cameron before he was Tory leader? I hadn't. The leader needs to be capable and known after they're elected, and they need at least some experience.
     
  17. JeditOjanen

    Soldato

    Joined: 7 Feb 2011

    Posts: 5,676

    Clive Lewis. The main issue is his lack of experience in Parliament, but he's now not far behind where Cameron was when he became leader of the Opposition. I don't think Corbyn ever really planned to stand in a GE, he just wanted to move the party back to the left. He's being pushed to leave a year ahead of schedule, is all. Which may work out for the best, because odds are good the actual decision to accept the final Brexit deal will have to be based on a General Election.
     
  18. Gigabit

    Mobster

    Joined: 9 Apr 2012

    Posts: 11,832

    The simple fact is that under Blair the Labour party won three elections in a row (two with a landslide, with seat numbers the Tories could only dream of). The party seem so anxious to forget this, surely they should have a look at how they did this and use it to help them?

    Clearly the media had a huge influence: they need to get that support back. Clearly their candidate (Blair) was very good: get another good candidate.

    Maybe they just don't care that much? I know Corbyn has no interest in being elected as he doesn't believe in change via Parliament.
     
  19. StriderX

    Caporegime

    Joined: 18 Mar 2008

    Posts: 27,032

    Division was low and Labour were pandering left/right/centre to the likes of Devolution and corporate greed.

    It bit them in the ass when they were caught with their cookies all over the carpet in 2007, the success of labour is entirely attributed to the lack of a strong leader like Thatcher and the fact that she constituted seemingly a purest evil in many large swaths of constituencies that would make the tories sit in their own filth for awhile. As well as the fact that we would ultimately hit a rather nice boom period to see a relatively nice GDP.

    Neither party has a strong leadership, both are in seemingly constant bickering mode and can't figure out how to actually deal with the countries issues, so they both fall back into their safe spaces of bigotry and division based politics instead. I will never, ever, ever vote Labour and neither will a great deal of people, they should accept this. (they are still losing ground in Scotland amazingly as if they had much more to lose, the next two by-elections will seal their fate, though they'll deny it if they lose typically).
     
  20. Secret_Window

    Mobster

    Joined: 10 Aug 2006

    Posts: 4,990

    I agree. Labour need to move where the majority of voters are, which is in the centre.

    If you look at the polls when Labour were under Ed Miliband, you will see that Labour were neck and neck for a couple of years. In fact, leading up to the general election Labour had taken a lead. One of the things that switched it, was the threat of the SNP, which was used effectively by the right-wing media at deterring people at the last minute.

    They need to move back to the centre. Get someone like Dan Jarvis in as leader, with some no-nonsense politics. Then we might see a decent opposition.
     
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