This Business and Moment...

[Vanquish-Storm]

I feel like I should be higher up the career ladder than I am at this stage in my life and with my education, experience and knowledge. Just every now and then I get that imposter feeling.

I like where I work but I can’t see there being any prospects in the near future but then we have a baby on the way and I am worried or jumping ship.

Am I just being stupid? I have never liked moving about but I know of friends that move about a fair bit and go further up the ladder.

 

[skaif]

I feel like I should be higher up the career ladder than I am at this stage in my life and with my education, experience and knowledge. Just every now and then I get that imposter feeling.

I like where I work but I can’t see there being any prospects in the near future but then we have a baby on the way and I am worried or jumping ship.

Am I just being stupid? I have never liked moving about but I know of friends that move about a fair bit and go further up the ladder.

Tale as old as time isnt it!

On the one hand job security and comfort is a huge benefit - on the other is the unknown.

I took the risk to not just move jobs but jump countries a few years back and even with the pandemic, has been amazing.

Better salary, better quality of life, more family time etc and that was all with a 2 year old.

Sometimes you have to take the risk, if it doesnt work out then it doesnt work out, try and always have a backup plan but put yourself out there.

I am in education and in the UK the progression is quite secure up to a point. Once you hit leadership there seems to be a massive amount of competition so progression can be tough. Coming out here I feel like the challenges are still there but less so.

I would definitely start by signing up to recruiters and banging your CV out everywhere. Even if you dont accept posts, getting interview experience gives you lots and only costs a bit of time.

 

[Rroff]

I feel like I should be higher up the career ladder than I am at this stage in my life and with my education, experience and knowledge. Just every now and then I get that imposter feeling.

I like where I work but I can’t see there being any prospects in the near future but then we have a baby on the way and I am worried or jumping ship.

Am I just being stupid? I have never liked moving about but I know of friends that move about a fair bit and go further up the ladder.

Sounds like you don't really have any kind of plan? - might be worth looking at all the considerations like family - potential changes/requirements in terms of a house, commute, etc. that might entail and where you want to see yourself over the next 5 and 10 years, etc.

First baby? can be enough stress and upheaval on its own (depending a lot on the experience and support, etc. on hand) without potentially throwing job complications into the mix and as skaif alluded to you might want to consider family time, etc. in the mix as well.

EDIT: I think the key thing here is realising your options (which I guess is kind of why you posted) - you might feel pressure to jump towards something now but stepping back a bit you might realise there are other options/paths and/or that you don't need to rush at something but it would be a good goal to have (rather than it being a binary thing of doing it or not doing it), etc.

 

[randomshenans]

I feel like I should be higher up the career ladder than I am at this stage in my life and with my education, experience and knowledge. Just every now and then I get that imposter feeling.

I like where I work but I can’t see there being any prospects in the near future but then we have a baby on the way and I am worried or jumping ship.

Am I just being stupid? I have never liked moving about but I know of friends that move about a fair bit and go further up the ladder.

I think once you move a couple of times, the whole change thing is less daunting. You have a job, nothing to stop you looking at opportunities from the comfort of where you are? Ease yourself in that way. See where it leads.

Turns out all the machines had bitcoin mining software running on them.....

That's amazing! I wonder how many machines/ companies try this sort of thing around the world and no one has a clue!

I got an email this morning from my bosses boss...

Dear Loic, Ross,

I would like to let you know that I will be announcing a change to the NOE org tomorrow in our global meeting. I decided not to appoint a lead of NDE but rather to flatten our organization. I believe that this change will make us more aligned and nimble, it will bring more opportunities to NOE leaders, and it will minimize disruption in our team that has already been through a lot of uncertainty.

As a result of this, both of you will be reporting to me and joining Elizabeth, Maurette, Carol, Leanne and myself in the NOE LT. These changes will be valid as of May 1st

Congratulations to you both

... buckle up

Zuzana

I suppose that's a good thing? Least I'm moving up the org and not down lol don't think it'll mean a change in title or anything, but better than having something in the role above me that didn't make sense.

 

[Screeeech]

That's amazing! I wonder how many machines/ companies try this sort of thing around the world and no one has a clue!

Yeah lol, I know that a popular game client in Asia got hacked and was running bitcoin on millions of people's PCs, but actual manafacturing machinery and stuff - it beggars belief the places this stuff is running..

In future people's internet connected doorbells, fridges, appliances - will all be slow, because they'll be full of bitcoin mining software

 

[ChrisD.]

And people wonder why I don't like Chinese mobile phones.

 

[randomshenans]

In future people's internet connected doorbells, fridges, appliances - will all be slow, because they'll be full of bitcoin mining software

Maybe all huawei phones are running it already? Imagine if this was all happening on mass scale and china was the biggest holder of BTC in the world. Won't be surprised! haha

 

[dirtychinchilla]

What are the congratulations for then, @randomshenans?

 

[randomshenans]

What are the congratulations for then, @randomshenans?

Not really sure. I was in the global meeting today, and found out that I'll now get the responsibility of product ops, as well as all product management frameworks, which is great. I didn't want anyone else to have it. I am also a part of the leadership team, which is good and means more clout to get what I need done. On the flip side, I am a team of 1. So I need to start making some changes around that. I can't physically do it all on my own, it's impossible. Either way, I'll take it as a promotion. Fewer steps to the CTO (only 2 now), so I suppose that's a plus.

 

[Vanquish-Storm]

@randomshenans @Rroff @skaif

Thank you for the responses, made me feel a bit better and gives me something to work to.

No harm in looking about but not necessarily having to jump at the first thing that’s comes about.

@Rroff you are completely right I don’t have a plan anymore, I did do then that changed and what I had planned I haven’t really followed so I guess I need to plan again something that is doable.

 

[dirtychinchilla]

Not really sure. I was in the global meeting today, and found out that I'll now get the responsibility of product ops, as well as all product management frameworks, which is great. I didn't want anyone else to have it. I am also a part of the leadership team, which is good and means more clout to get what I need done. On the flip side, I am a team of 1. So I need to start making some changes around that. I can't physically do it all on my own, it's impossible. Either way, I'll take it as a promotion. Fewer steps to the CTO (only 2 now), so I suppose that's a plus.

That sounds like a healthy promotion, particularly when you’re in charge. You surely are going to need a team though?

I wish I knew some product managers…

 

[randomshenans]

No harm in looking about but not necessarily having to jump at the first thing that’s comes about.

@Rroff you are completely right I don’t have a plan anymore, I did do then that changed and what I had planned I haven’t really followed so I guess I need to plan again something that is doable.

Best part about it is you are in charge. Nothing making you move right now is the perfect time to do it. No stress and you can do it at your leisure.

As for the plan thing, I used to do this a lot. I would have a goal and work my face off to get it. If I didn't have one I felt like I wasn't growing and hated it. My plan has changed more times than I am on here though. It took me so long to work out what I enjoyed and what I wanted to do. I thought it was a lot of things along the way and put work into learn those things and work in that space. I've been a headhunter, 1st / 2nd line support (thanks 2008 recession!), sys admin, service manager, project manager, business analyst, agile project manager, consultant and now work in product management. For once I dont have a plan on where I'm going "at work" but am happy. My job challenges me and I feel it rewards me (and frustrates me equally most days) and I feel like I can create a lot of value. Maybe if that changed, I'd need something else but for me my motivation is always about being challenged, providing value and constantly growing. If my trajectory isn't supporting those things, I tend to get itchy feet.

What do you enjoy? Do you have a sense of what part of your job you like the most, or what you'd like to do more of? Where you see yourself, or what you see yourself doing?

What is your current role? What's your age and situation? Would be good to know. I think it's easy to get comfortable and change then becomes scary but once you've done it a couple of times and realise that no company is truly loyal to you and you need to look out for yourself, then you get a bit more daring. BUT, it has to match your life expectations too. Work and life balance is increasingly important to me as I get older (and I'm only 35 but value my time WAY more than I did 5-10yrs ago).

That sounds like a healthy promotion, particularly when you’re in charge. You surely are going to need a team though?

I wish I knew some product managers…

I wish I could just employ product managers, it'd be so much easier! (there is a product manager position open BTW in the scientific product space under my old boss )
My space sits under this NOE space, which is operational excellence, which means I don't manage product managers, or that org, I just own the processes and data and am in charge of ensuring that the transition to this new product org is successful... in my ******* team of 1! So I really need to get some support in, but it's not strictly a product manager role. I like it because I get to do product management without having to deal with the actual delivery on products (in our 600+ portfolio which is a huge mission and 90% of the people routinely try and lick their elbows most days). So yea, if you want to move to Basel go for it. Reckon you'd get about 90-100K GBP basic and decent package

 

[Sui]

Recruiters really are annoying, aren't they?

As most of you probably get, they just message you job opportunities on LinkedIn all the time, I always ignore them. I then had a follow up message yesterday, which to me felt passively aggressive, but maybe it's because I don't like them!

Sui, I presume the XXXXX opportunity is not of interest, as we're a specialist within your industry perhaps a brief introductory call to discuss your position and interest so we can keep you in mind for future roles.

How else do you make sure you don't miss out on any game-changing opportunity?

I look forward to hearing from you.

Kind regards

Then earlier today, I got a notification to say she's trying to contact me through Facebook Messenger, starting to feel stalkerish

 

[randomshenans]

Then earlier today, I got a notification to say she's trying to contact me through Facebook Messenger, starting to feel stalkerish

**** that, i'd make an effort to call them out. Anyone that seeks to find me on socials having cold bugged me in that way on LI can do one! And that comes from me who equally uses LI for "sales" but it's apparently more of a trend at the moment to polarise with emails and messages to get attention. May as well just call people a dick and be done with it!

 

[dirtychinchilla]

I wish I could just employ product managers, it'd be so much easier! (there is a product manager position open BTW in the scientific product space under my old boss )
My space sits under this NOE space, which is operational excellence, which means I don't manage product managers, or that org, I just own the processes and data and am in charge of ensuring that the transition to this new product org is successful... in my ******* team of 1! So I really need to get some support in, but it's not strictly a product manager role. I like it because I get to do product management without having to deal with the actual delivery on products (in our 600+ portfolio which is a huge mission and 90% of the people routinely try and lick their elbows most days). So yea, if you want to move to Basel go for it. Reckon you'd get about 90-100K GBP basic and decent package

90-100K, wow! I don't think I should get paid that much tbh. That's one reason why I'm trying to find a new job - I'm missing a whole set of PM schools in my opinion.

Ah wow, that is a lot to deal with. Not surprised you're putting in 10 hours days! One day we'll all hail Cheezus and you won't need to do that any more.

 

[randomshenans]

90-100K, wow! I don't think I should get paid that much tbh. That's one reason why I'm trying to find a new job - I'm missing a whole set of PM schools in my opinion.

It's not a normal salary, but Swiss salaries are way over normal. But their cost of living is too. Hence why I live over in France with my Swiss salary

 

[dirtychinchilla]

It's not a normal salary, but Swiss salaries are way over normal. But their cost of living is too. Hence why I live over in France with my Swiss salary

Hah that is very good. I have always wondered why you live in France. I used to speak excellent French (if I do say so myself), but we have too many family ties here to move away. I don't think my wife could go a week without seeing her family, never mind months on end.

 

[Martynt74]

Starting to get pretty fed up now. Around 18 months ago, there was talk of moving to a new Reporting/Budgeting system. Given i'm the main user and would be the "superuser" i assumed i'd have had some input from an early stage.

Nope

It then gets to July and i get brought into some calls to demonstrate the system, at which point i point out all the issues with it and how from an initial glance, it seems inferior to what we have at the moment. We have a call with the consultants and i ask if we can do X,Y,Z which we can currently, to be told no. There's workarounds but they're impractical and horrible designed.

It then continues to drag on. My boss is the main lead, but he's not IT orientated and is so busy with his regular role he's not really able to invest any time into things.

Roll forward to the start of this year (we're meant to be live now by the way), and it's still a mess, virtually no actual data or FX rates loaded in so we can't even test the system. Me trying not to be overly negative, but still pointing out i'm seeing nothing which looks impressive. At multiple points my boss seems to lean towards throwing in the towel and going with our current system but in an improved implementation (it was put in around 6 years ago, again with very little initial design or thought), but sadly always wants to give this more of a chance, and i honestly don't think he'd make that decision now. It's dragged on too long and financially it'd be a huge hit.

Now at the end of March, we've mostly taken over the admin of setting the system up. I'm having to build loads of workarounds for reports to give what we need.

Want to compare Actuals vs Budget? Need to build a report for that
Want to compare Actual FX vs Budget FX? Need to build another report for that


I'm not an expert, but virtually all Datawarehousing packages i've used have been very dynamic in letting you choose what you want to see, by way of a few drop downs/drag and drops, but nope. Not this. Don't even get me started on the Excel implementation! I tried to find out how to do something and found a Youtube video from 2014 which is the exact same system we're supposed to be using to "drive the business forward and improve reporting".



When this was first discussed, my plans were.

1- Be involved in the implementation
2- Spend a year or two getting everything set up and learning the system and building knowledge
3- Look to jump careers into more of a Consulting role, and rolling out the software to businesses and building systems for clients.

After 15 months, i barely want to use this system for another day, let alone become an expert!

I'm now leaning towards looking for other roles, but trying to decide how to approach it. My boss has already hinted he can tell i hate it and doesn't want me to end up annoyed an leave, this was during one of the conversation where he was considering cutting our losses. Do i bring up that's how i'm feeling in the hope it gives him the kick to stick with our current system (which is very good), or just silently look around in the background as i normally would and approach it as and when i have another job?

 

[mattx2]

Starting to get pretty fed up now. Around 18 months ago, there was talk of moving to a new Reporting/Budgeting system. Given i'm the main user and would be the "superuser" i assumed i'd have had some input from an early stage.

Nope

It then gets to July and i get brought into some calls to demonstrate the system, at which point i point out all the issues with it and how from an initial glance, it seems inferior to what we have at the moment. We have a call with the consultants and i ask if we can do X,Y,Z which we can currently, to be told no. There's workarounds but they're impractical and horrible designed.

Out of interest what system is it?

 

[Martynt74]

Oracle EPM Cloud, they seem to have bought a package called Hyperion but not really made any improvements to it. We use Netsuite as our CRM/Accounting package which i don't think particularly suits our business (Manufacturing Chemicals) but very complex with varying raw materials and mixes going into around 3000 unique products. Again it's not fit for purpose, but we've used it for so long now and designed so many workarounds we're too heavily invested in it. However due to all our customisations, a lot of functionality/links to other systems no longer work.

It seems someone told someone high up in our company that Netsuite will no longer be linking with third party data warehouses and it was believed and we pushed ahead with this.

The system itself feels very old school IT'y, if that makes sense without being very user friendly or intuitive in the backend, with incredible outdated report writing tools.

Hell as an example. This is the syntax to work out a percentage

PercentOfTotal([8],[4])

Why not just follow an Excel based syntax of =X/Y



Our current package is Workday Adaptive. It's a very base level implementation, but it feels that they've been truly innovative and constantly improving to make themselves a product leader rather than being able to rely on the Oracle name.

It's odd as it seems a lot of very large businesses use EPM Cloud, but i'm just not seeing any benefit. Maybe our developers aren't very good an in time i'll work out how to do things better, but the issue with that is the system gets built around the initial setup and you're always chasing your tail.

I'm trying to find some positives, but so far i've not seen a single feature or function that our current system doesn't do better. I'm honestly dreading rolling it out to the business and having my name associated with it!

I find the Gartner report telling.

Oracle. Strengths include it's size and the fact it's improved over poor reviews in the past. Weakness - It's product




Workday. Main strength is it's product





Honestly if i could look at the Consulting type role for Workday i would, however because our implentation of it is so poor, there's a lot of product knowledge i don't have and so i don't feel qualified to make that step.