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This is striking me as odd

Discussion in 'GD Archive' started by Ex-RoNiN, 27 May 2003.

  1. Ex-RoNiN

    Capodecina

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

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    http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0286499/board/nest/1344380

    This here is a forum discussion about Bend it like Beckham on the IMDB forums. For a change, it is a very sensible debate with thoughtful comments.

    The thing that strikes me as really odd is that a) most Americans seem to perceive this movie as a love story whilst I think the love story was just a tertiary part of the plot and b) skin colour STILL seems to be an issue in the US :confused:

    I have been in the UK for just 3 years, but from what I have seen and experienced, I think it is safe to say that Blacks, Asians and everyone else that has been here for a generation or longer has been "assimilated" into the UK culture and is seen as a member of the UK population. On the other hand, it seems as if in the American case people still think in terms of white, black and brown, rather than American :confused: The comment that made me realise this was the one by "Me Grimlock".

    Is the UK socially more advanced that nobody thinks of skin colour as a differentiating adjective, is it recognised as a differentiating adjective but ignored, or are white british folks just like the yanks but hide it better :confused:

    If I caused any offence with any of my wording, I apologise, I am interested in the cultural differences and the perceptions of cultures, I am not trying to have a dig at anyone.
     
  2. Mint Sauce

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

    Posts: 2,240

    Well before i start i'd just like to say no offence to any minorities (Sp).

    I think it's gone the other way over here. Employers are scared to not hire indivuals belonging to racial minornities, because it's very easy for mr perspective employee to shout 'I didn't get that job becuase of racisum'

    Another thing. If i was to start a radio station for white music i'd be branded a racist. However not so long ago there was the launch of 1extra (think it's called that) 'the radio station for new black music'. Now this i don't really mind, it's just the fact that if the boot was on the other foot it'd be treated like a different kettle of fish, and end up with me being branded racist

    Now some of the indivuals of the racial minorties (read most) don't take advantage of these over politically correct times, but on the other hand alot do, and this makes me sick.

    I'd jsut like to stress that i'm not racist, but i do sometimes feel like my country is been over taken by a different culture and i can only see the situations above getting worse before they get better.
     
    Last edited: 27 May 2003
  3. TheDogFather

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    Joined: 19 Apr 2003

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    Ive got a few non white friends in America and they say its very racist over there, which is a bit strange as they all come from somewhere else apart from the native americans (indians) who incidently get treated the worse out of all of them.

    America, one messed up country, so why do we follow them down the same road ?

    TDF.
     
  4. Mujja

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    Joined: 7 Jan 2003

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    When I first saw this my initial reaction was "not another black/white/muslim/sikh thread". There have been too many of them lately.

    I don't know about be assimilation, I'm just as different to everyone else as they are to me. we're all individuals. I'm just as much different from another asian as I am from a white person.

    Mint Sauce , I know exactly where your coming from and the truth is a lot of asians probably think the same thing. The problem is when just one person from a minority complains or asks for special treatment for something everyone starts as if we all are complaining. It's happened many times on this forum too, which explains my initial response.

    Ex-RoNiN, I wish they could just make a 'normal' film with an asian character in it without going into all the religious and cultural crap like they did with East is East and Bend it like Beckham. A girl wanting to grow up and become a pro footballer would probably get just as much disapproval from her family if she was white. They could have easily made the film with a white family, but instead made it look as only asian girl are not allowed to play football. Like asians aren't getting enough stick for suppressing womens rights as it is.
     
  5. Rich_L

    Capodecina

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

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    Location: Santa Barbara, Californee

    Well Ive seen the film, quite enjoyed it.

    However, not once did I even stop to consider how people of various different races were portrayed in it, or how it may be construed as offensive. I guess in that respect, by being utterly not bothered about it, thats true assimilation.....

    After all, when I saw Kevin and Perry go Large, it didnt make me suddenly think that all teenagers were like that, why should BILB be any different? The point is that stereotypes often have a grounding in reality, and they can be used for humourous ends. A film without stereotypes would be incredibly boring, as everyone would be bland, characterless drones, or it would be glaringly obvious that the director was consciously avoiding stereotypes to try and 'avoid' issues.
     
    Last edited: 27 May 2003
  6. Mujja

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    Maybe you didn't see it that way, but that's the way it was marketed. And when the asian girl (don't know her name) was on daytime chat shows that all she was asked about, "is it really like that".

    What's I meant about making a normal film with and asian character was why not just have an asian guy and not drag all his family into it too. You see lots white of chararcters where the film just revolves around just them and their mates or work place.

    Another example is Monsoon Wedding, it would have been a great film if they had left out all the child abuse. Its supposed to be a film about a wedding and all the families meeting up.

    East is East was good but why include the bit with the kids eating pork. That was offensive to every muslim I know and probably most others too. It didn't educate anyone why muslims don't eat pork. And if the film was supposed to be about muslim kids growing up, well by that age they would have any desire they had to eat porkl beaten out of them
     
  7. Mujja

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    I'm not saying its a bad thing to make films about different cultures. I enjoy watching foreign movies from all over the world. There are probably just as many critics from those countries saying how the film should have been made.

    All I'm saying is lets just have a film with asian/black actors without going too deeply into the cultural stuff.

    Which reminds me, my cousin was over from France last year and while he was staying with us he was suprised by how many asians and blacks there were on TV, news, soaps, drama and ads.

    I couldn't understand why he was so suprised until I visited him and the only black faces you see on TV are in music videos. And France is a lot more cosmopolitan than the UK.
     
  8. MindYerBeak

    Soldato

    Joined: 17 Oct 2002

    Posts: 5,328

    As Mr. Mint Sauce stated, political correctness is annoying a lot of people. I'm all for integration of people of mixed race and religion, but I'm against crowding them all together in one place, and quite often ghettoes. I feel they should be integrated with the British public more than they now are. All minority groups should be forced to learn the English language, otherwise they can't integrate properly.

    Apartheid in America may have been discontinued, but there is still race hatred out there. I saw a television programme once where a balck man dared to walk into the white area of town. A camera crew followed behind in a car. He was stopped by white police officers, and when he dared question the authority of the cops they put his head through a large store window.

    The most people sentenced to death in America are the black population, the prisons there are filled with black "criminals". There's more unemployment and poverty amongst the black community than there is amongst the whites. Race hatred, to my mind, is still rife in America.

    The American Red Indian is also having a bad deal from what I've heard from American tourists I've met.
     
  9. wassap

    PermaBanned

    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

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    Myb, i agree with alot of what u say, the ghetto`s are infuriating, they are perputating intolerance, for both the indigenous and immigrant populace, the govt over the years have done this, and now are doing the same for asylum seekers.

    Mind u i dont think we have it bad at all, i think if u make an effort to assimilate u get accepted for what u are, colour is less of an issue in this country, and im pleased for that.

    Yeah we always seem to get the token bloody actors out, mind u eastennders is changing things somewhat tho.

    One thing i will say tho, why not just take films for what they are, just films,with no added overtones.

    As for 1extra we have been here before, black music is less about color than peeps make out, it is a genre, big artists in garage are artful doger etc, they aint black n all that. An d lets face the white majority are pretty well catered for arent they? ffs show me a black man who listens to classic fm or R2 lol:p .
     
  10. Bear

    Capodecina

    Joined: 24 Oct 2002

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    Location: Bucks and Edinburgh

    Man I see this written alot and what an absloute crock of wotsits. If you even bothered to look further, you would also find Welsh radio, Scotish Radio, Christian radio etc. these are radio stations that caters for a section of the community in the Uk that want to listen to it. Do you feel excluded because there is Welsh radio. Of course you dont, so why should black music be any different.

    I know loads of people that listen to black music, so I guess it caters for this market. Im not black but I listen to predominantly black music (Jazz, Blues, Hip Hop, Reggae) so a black music station I think is a good idea IMO.

    Stop jumping on the BS wagon and try thinking out of the little box a bit more.
     
  11. [TW]Fox

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 17 Oct 2002

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    After getting sick and tired of all this hip hop stuff on Radio 1 I to welcomed the introduction of 1Extra, hoping it would move this music there where people who specifically liked it could listen to it.

    So, we now have 1Extra, a music station for music of black origin. Despite this, Radio 1 continues to play virtually nothing but hip hop, 'RnB', etc etc. It seems no song today is complete, even if its just a normal pop song, without some token black person breaking out into a rap half way through, usually about seemingly random things not related to the song.

    I mean what on earth is 'X Gonna Give It To Ya' by DMX all about, and why do they play it every 2 hours without fail? Surely it belongs on 1Xtra.
     
  12. Bear

    Capodecina

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    TBH I dont listen to any radio/watch any chart shows at all so I wouldnt really know what you are talking about and havent done so for years. As a generalisation these pop stations tend to play middle of the road pap for the broadest market so all of the decent stuff doesnt get a hearing on these stations.

    I hate the radio really as there is very little that I listen to, accept the odd pirate station many moons ago. If I was to listen to the radio now , I guess it would be Classic FM.

    Hey maybe you could call Classic FM a white music radio station as I think there are hardly any black composers.;)
     
    Last edited: 27 May 2003
  13. Toast

    Banned

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    Unfortunatly, Radio 1 plays what is in the chart or what is just about to be released as a single.

    Radio 1 is not deliberatly playing black styles of music, it is just paying what is popular at the time.

    Stereophonics, Oasis, U2, Coldplay, Travis etc etc are also played to death whenever they release a new single.

    [edit] Correction. Radio 1 doesn't just play chart music. There are a few djs, like John Peel, who play alternative white label stuff.
     
    Last edited: 27 May 2003
  14. manic_man

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    Joined: 18 Oct 2002

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    this might seem a bit simple, but what does it matter?? Were all human arnt we??

    sorry - i really hate race discussions as they simply shouldnt be happening any more...

    Maybe we should all be turned inside out! Thats a great idea :p Then we would all look the same...

    As far as "black" music goes.. come on its just another variant on an art form it doesnt belong to one side of a culture or other. It has its roots, but thats all they are, roots, the same can be said of any other area of music, be it dance blues whatever, if you like it, then listen to it/practice it if you dont avoid it! (I stopped listening to the radio COMPLETELY about a year ago :) and now listen 2 nething from Puff daddy to beethoven)

    newho - just my 2p :)
     
  15. wassap

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    O-T but............


    What freq is 1xtra on???
     
  16. [TW]Fox

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    And plays it to death if its Hip Hop or R n B, and doesn't play much if its normal stuff. With the exception of Coldplays Clocks, which has been played so much I now cannot stand it.
     
  17. Toast

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  18. crab

    Wise Guy

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    Part of the problem with that is you can only get 1xtra and Asian network on DAB or on digital TV. DAB is hardly popular atm and who watches the radio?

    So if you took all the 'black' music off radio 1 then there'd be uproar.

    But the seemingly disproportionate amount of black music is not down to race issues/PC.

    I'm sure if such a survey exists i'm sure it would show that most ppl, regardless of culture, prefer the endless flow of cheesy trance or samey hip-hop/RnB. There's certainly no shortage of pop music and if you're low on inspiration, well, just cover an old song, nobody over 20 will notice.

    Radio1 reflects the charts which are dictated by young ppl. They buy far more music than the rest of us. Nowadays you can't just be an artist, you have to look good and have an edge. The lifestyle of a hip-hop artist that you're continually fed through their videos is far more appealing to the average 12 year old than the weedy, scruffy looks of say coldplay or travis :D

    Really there was no upbeat music until twelve bar blues and jazz were spawned from calypso or sumin, which was made by black ppl.

    In an ideal world yes. But you can't get over the cultural differences people have. Music kinda reflects culture but the indigenous british don't really seem to have a definite indentity wheras blacks and asians do.
     
  19. [TW]Fox

    Man of Honour

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    I think you've got ask what sort of people regulary go out and spend £4 on a single song, and its these peoples choices who make up the chart..
     
  20. Shadez

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    Joined: 23 Dec 2002

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    Are you sure its not Radio1, that plays the music, Brainwashing kidds to buy the CD, making the chart.

    I wonder if, a clasical track was played 50 times a day on radio1. Would it reach No1, or at least do well in the charts.