ventilation in kitchen legislation

[Mr.Cookie]

It used to go down as not to current standards but this has been stopped, you now have either at risk or immediately dangerous. It's down to how the person doing it sees it and at least he didn't disconnect appliance.
Yesterday I had a carbon monoxide detector going off, someone had cut and soldered capped the pipework, we don't have the tools to reconnect so customer is having to try to get them to remake bayonet fitting.

 

[builder22]

any of the other windows have the same handle?

 

[chrcoluk]

It used to go down as not to current standards but this has been stopped, you now have either at risk or immediately dangerous. It's down to how the person doing it sees it and at least he didn't disconnect appliance.
Yesterday I had a carbon monoxide detector going off, someone had cut and soldered capped the pipework, we don't have the tools to reconnect so customer is having to try to get them to remake bayonet fitting.

I would have preferred a disconnection, but since he didnt consult with me this mess happened.

 

[chrcoluk]

any of the other windows have the same handle?

It is the only double glazed window in my property, the ones at the front are single glazed. It is the only window at the entire back of my property which increases its importance.

 

[DB_SamX]

Does any exist?

So for years I have had gas safety checks, the guy turned a blind eye to the window issue as he respected I wanted fresh air. In return I agreed to have it shut when heating was on.

The issue is/was that the boiler is in a stupid place, the exhaust for it is right below the kitchen window, and safety rules say thats too dangerous.

This time a new guy came, and he didnt consult with me or anything about options, he just bolted the window and left.

The property has very poor ventilation in general, bathroom has no window and just a tiny extraction, fan, the room next to bathroom is the kitchen which now has no useable window, oly the other end of the property has windows but they not very good and open in a way that doesnt let much air in, I cannot find a diagram on the net which matches how they are but basically they open so the bottom part moves out and top stays in, and its only the top part of the window, unless its very windy there is no air circulation from them, also now my only windows all face the main road which is noisy, the kitchen window didnt add noise to the property and was always cooler air as it had no sunlight as well. It also opened sideways and was the entire window that opened, so was a lot more fresh air from it.

I know there is regulation for bathroom ventilation, which I am not even sure if my property complies with, but what about kitchens?

Even if there is no regulation what would you guys do if you had use of the window for several years then someone came round and bolted it shut without consultation?

Try Building Regulations Part F.

 

[d_brennen]

If you're renting, surely it comes down to the landlord to sort the problem rather than you losing a usable window?

 

[chrcoluk]

Try Building Regulations Part F.

Thanks, I am not a legal expert but that document seems to indicate there is a requirement to circulate air in kitchens but it doesnt have to be a window, it can be via mechanical ventilation as well, but regardless, my current level of ventilation is probably inadequate for the kitchen.

 

[chrcoluk]

If you're renting, surely it comes down to the landlord to sort the problem rather than you losing a usable window?

Yeah, but the problem is not every tenant will care, so if someone like me kicks up a fuss about it, it can be easier to evict, and replace with a tenant who doesnt care, my LL has given an indicator he is going to fix it, but my tenancy is up for renewal soon, and he could just be buying time. So providing my new handle works, I probably wont say much else, as I would rather leave when I ready than be forced onto the street.

 

[d_brennen]

Yeah, but the problem is not every tenant will care, so if someone like me kicks up a fuss about it, it can be easier to evict, and replace with a tenant who doesnt care, my LL has given an indicator he is going to fix it, but my tenancy is up for renewal soon, and he could just be buying time. So providing my new handle works, I probably wont say much else, as I would rather leave when I ready than be forced onto the street.

Fair enough, I wouldn't feel comfortable renting from a landlord I suspected would boot me for expecting basic building safety was kept up to standard though.

Might be worth seeing what's about in the same price bracket

 

[chrcoluk]

Well he bolted it "and" removed the handle.

Got the handle slotted it in (without securing) just to try it out, and it fits, but window wouldnt budge, checked outside and he has drilled bolts through the frame.

So this will be discussed with them some more next week then, and I will read more on those building regulations before then as well.

Also i had a look to see if engineers have permission to do what they want at free will.

https://www.gassaferegister.co.uk/help-and-advice/gas-safety-in-the-home/warning-labels/

According to that document, they can disconnect with permission, if it isnt given then they report to the ESP who would forcefully do it. So he didnt have any power to just bolt the window without permission.

My LL said he wasnt informed, and was most definitely not happy about the window situation, the manager I dont know, but even if he asked her for permission I believe the permission would have to come from me as well due to me been the person living here. Plus the document clearly states the process is to disconnect the boiler not to modify the property.

 

[Mr.Cookie]

Yup we can't do anything without permission if it's not given gas network called and if they aren't allowed they will shut it off in the street.

 

[chrcoluk]

Ok a little update on this, some videos and photo's were sent to a british gas engineer, this option was available given a family member is a manager at centrica.

The professional opinion is "at risk" not "immediately dangerous", if he was doing the inspection I would have been advised to close the window, and he said absolutely no way he would be able to just bolt it, "beyond his remit". There was no comment made about boiler disconnection but that is what was said.

Also I have been reading through those building regulations, there is in my own opinion based on that document the kitchen currently does not meet regulations, I for hours yesterday had my front door open and windows at front of building, the air just was not reaching the kitchen and the kitchen already has a lingering smell, needs fresh air. Bear in mind yesterday was an unusually cool and breezy day as well, which meant more air mobility than normal, and even then it wouldnt reach the kitchen.

 

[chrcoluk]

They removing bolts tomorrow and taking photos to assess damage to pvc frame by the unauthorised work. So this seems resolved now, I have agreed to not use window when boiler is on.

 

[BigBoy]

They removing bolts tomorrow and taking photos to assess damage to pvc frame by the unauthorised work. So this seems resolved now, I have agreed to not use window when boiler is on.

This is not the answer. Gas Safe regulation is there for a reason, although the guy doing the safety check was in the wrong the response your landlord should be coming up with needs to be very different to this! I have reported landlords for less in the past.

 

[chrcoluk]

This is not the answer. Gas Safe regulation is there for a reason, although the guy doing the safety check was in the wrong the response your landlord should be coming up with needs to be very different to this! I have reported landlords for less in the past.

The boiler work is still been done, but my immediate concern was the window, and given the time of the year is more important than the boiler, which is why I said I was even prepared to have it disconnected.

The professional opinion I got from the british gas engineer was that there is no way the window should have been bolted, even if the boiler was about to catch fire. The website I linked to as well clearly states that is not part of the process engineers are supposed to follow.

The boiler isn't been used now at all until the modification work on the outside is done. It hasnt been physically disconnected, but I have agreed to not use it.

 

[BigBoy]

The boiler work is still been done, but my immediate concern was the window, and given the time of the year is more important than the boiler, which is why I said I was even prepared to have it disconnected.

The professional opinion I got from the british gas engineer was that there is no way the window should have been bolted, even if the boiler was about to catch fire. The website I linked to as well clearly states that is not part of the process engineers are supposed to follow.

The boiler isn't been used now at all until the modification work on the outside is done. It hasnt been physically disconnected, but I have agreed to not use it.

Good glad you have had a compitent installer look at the situation,my guess is the Landlord/Agent went with the cheapest option for the yearly service/maintanance contract and ended up with a guy who needs a kick or two in the pants!

 

[chrcoluk]

Absolutely no doubt they thinking about money.

 

[chrcoluk]

So this is kicking off again.

Got a letter last week that they doing another gas boiler check, these checks have to be done once a year. The last one was in June.

I have now been put in the vulnerable group by my GP and told him whats going on, he told me to ask them for proof it is legally required and to advise them I am in the group.

The response was (they now have a new manager), that they were told by the new supplier the check is needed, I asked for clarification and there was none, I later sent an email informing them to cancel the visit until I have the legal documentation stating why its needed, I got a sms 5 minutes later stating he will be coming as scheduled.

Yesterday due to been unwell I was asleep, and woke up to see a voicemail saying I had apparently refused him entry, that sounded creative given I wasnt even awake.

Then a few hours later after 5pm they replied to my email by an email showing the gas safety certificate issued in June.

So in response to my request asking for proof they needed to do a check in Sept 2020, they sent the certificate stating another check isnt needed until June 2021.

I then looked at the engineer's name on the certificate, its the same name as they put on the letter who is doing the new check, so it is not a new company, I also asked my neighbour if they had a check, and they said no, normally they have it done the same day.

So I am speculating he seen my window open, got angry and is forcing a new check so he can bolt the window up again.

British gas engineer has agreed to come to meet him face to face, he will ask why proper protocol was not followed which is to speak to legal tenant before action taken, and if action has to be taken the boiler should be disconnected, not making other modifications to the property, this is really nice on his part. He has also offered to support on paper a complaint to the gas safety regulator.

I also now have this guy's phone contact details as its on the certificate, however when he was here last time he refused to talk to me right after he bolted the window so would likely refuse to talk to me on the phone. He wrongfully thinks he only needs to communicate with the landlord.

So this may get messy, but interestingly it is still illegal to evict tenants. I am not going to accept the window been rebolted, and especially when all they need to do is move the flue.

 

[pp111]

I'd just drill a big hole through the wall and put a vent in for fresh air. Then let them do whatever they want. Honestly, what a bunch of silly devils.

 

[BigBoy]

So this may get messy, but interestingly it is still illegal to evict tenants. I am not going to accept the window been rebolted, and especially when all they need to do is move the flue.

How close.os the flue to the window? Legally it has to be 300mm from any opening, but that can be over come by using a plume kit to direct the flow of out gassing.