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What Speaker package?

Discussion in 'Home Cinema & Hi-Fi' started by -=Maxed=-, 25 Feb 2006.

  1. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    Im thinking about replacing my suround sound speakers but realy not sure what to be looking at.. ive been hearing KEF eggs from work mates but would like some other options.

    Currently have a mix of all differnt types of speakers but they are very loud and clear with realy deep bass (eg ground shaking due to 12" sub and floor standers).

    but i find with the xbox 360 that there are some things that are getting missed by the speakers because i dont think they are as clear as some of the newer stuff.

    I have this amp: HERE


    What packages would you recomend? i would like a full 5.1 set-up for arround £500 (dosnt have to be floor standers becuase i can keep my currnt ones for music)
    If possible i would like the sub to be powerful because i like bass with my films :rolleyes:

    Cheers
     
  2. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    What speakers do you have at the moment?

    My money is on the fact that its not properly set up and that with some playing you'll get a better sound out of the speakers you have than buying a little sub sat package

    ^ this is a bit of a give away, sound like you are running full freq through your floorstanders for a start which with a 12" sub isn't nessesary, if you set them to small your amp would be doing less work and cound concentrate on the mid to high end.

    I may be wrong and your speakers could be big but rubbish, anyway let us know what you have now.

    MB
     
    Last edited: 25 Feb 2006
  3. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    my floor standers are Eltax Symphony 8.2's (a few years old but i still think they sound good IMHO)

    Im not sure but i think your right about the settings.. i think they are on large.

    As for the sub i cant rember what make it is but its from richer sounds... think its this one.. HERE

    Again old but sounds good to me...

    You might be right as they are old as stated in first post.. i think i need some new stuff to brighten things up a bit. Only thing is i cant grumble about the sound, it just dosnt seem to be as bright with the xbox so some tones are very quiet.
     
    Last edited: 25 Feb 2006
  4. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    This sounds more and more to me like poor setup tbh, those speakers are fine and unless you have broken the tweeters then they will produce all the freqs just fine. Are the OK for music? If they are then its the noise coming out of the Xbox which is the issue not to hifi. I suggest you sit down and do some serious testing before you start buying new equipment ;)

    Set you speakers to small set your AV Amp crossover to 60Hz or 80Hz and then start to listen to music and films, if you still have a problem then get a copy of Avia or another test disc and run that. A digital Spl meter from a high street component store will cost you £25 and you can use that to check the levels out. If we can't get your system to beat a £300 sat sub system I'll be very suprised!

    MB
     
    Last edited: 25 Feb 2006
  5. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    Cheers for the reply i will have to check what settings its using becuase i dont think they have been changed since i got the amp...
     
  6. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    :eek:

    Prepare to kick yourself!

    MB
     
  7. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    I did set it up when i got it but i havnt adjusted since.. is what i was trying to say

    So do you think my 8.2's are ok for a average system?
     
  8. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    I do yes :)

    MB
     
  9. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    Hmm i wanted to spend some money tho... :rolleyes: maybee a new center or rears then...
     
  10. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    What centre and rears do you have?

    And how is the Xbox connected to the amp?

    MB
     
  11. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    I think i would go for a center because its a eltax thing but im not sure what.. theres a realy nice looking KEF one at richer sounds for £50 seems realy cheap...

    Xbox is conected through fiber optic..
     
  12. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    I have a Kef centre :)

    [​IMG]

    MB
     
  13. DRZ

    Soldato

    Joined: 2 Jun 2003

    Posts: 6,861

    Location: In the top 1%

    At low frequencies, your amplifier is working very hard indeed. With a limited power supply (which you have because you have an A/V amp) everything is suffering as a result.

    As MatBlack has correctly stated, you need to let the subwoofer handle what it can and give the amplifier room to breathe. The crossovers inside the amplifier are almost certainly digital parametric things (so awful, strictly speaking) so you arent going to totally remove the load from the amplifier (about -18dB or so probably, with 80Hz at -3dB) but 18dB is an awful lot of power removed over 6 channels!

    I would expect instant audible gains from that. Next step is to get the speaker placement right and then set the amplifier up correctly for your room. Turn off all of the tone control (and dont ever turn it back on) and move your speakers about until they sound right (checking for phase errors first) and sort the levels out.

    Give some consideration to the path between the speakers and your listening position (and I dont just mean line of sight). If you really want to go the whole hog have a listen to how reverberant the room is (with all doors and windows closed) and try and address any significant areas or resonance. You will need to do this at night with everything totally quiet else the reverberance will be masked by the background noise.

    Once you have done that, you have a budget of £500 to spend on sorting out anything that is seriously amiss now you can hear what needs sorting ;)

    It sounds like you potentially need a new center speaker but I would also be thinking "I wonder what kind of power amplification I can add to those front channels with the change" :p
     
  14. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    Matblack: what is center is that? i cant see the pic becuase the pants internet at work is blocking it?

    Im going to dig the manual out on my days off and have a play with settings..

    So what you both are saying is that the fronts are to big for surround and they are not getting enough power from the amp due to them being set at large? (dose this aply when the amp is in stereo?)
    Cheers
     
  15. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    Its a KEF 200C

    You have some big speakers and they aren't especially sensitive (this is not nessesarily a function of their size btw) Depending on what amp you are driving them with they might be slightly underpowered, adding a power amp and taking the pressure off the other chanels might be an option.

    However the one thing we have missed is that its only the Xbox sound which is bothing you. Have you considered the fact that sound out if a console is almost aways compressed and will never sound as good as a CD or DVD?

    MB
     
  16. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    I think this is the main problem but there isnt much i can do about that... so i thought that i might try and help it out a bit with better brighter speakers..

    Do you think its worth going power amps on these types of speakers?

    The amp is a pioneer VSX-D912K thats 110w x 6
     
  17. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    I think we've nailed the issue to be honest. The sound out of an Xbox will never rival CD or DVD, you seem happy with the sound on these better sources but because you have a good system you can hear the failings of the Xbox.

    Problem is that there is a good chance that by adding amps and better speakers you will make the system even more revealing and the Xbox will sound even worse :D.

    Your amp should handle those speakers without too many problems

    MB
     
  18. -=Maxed=-

    Hitman

    Joined: 20 Oct 2002

    Posts: 586

    Location: Newcastle

    Ahh well thanks for saving me some money.. lol cheers for the help....

    Might get a new center tho.. just fancy one i think... what would you recomend for < £100 ?

    love the look of the THIS

    But its the only one on RS that has only one speaker! i know its in mono but i thought two was better.
     
  19. Matblack

    Capodecina

    Joined: 23 Jan 2004

    Posts: 15,628

    Location: On my Boat, Drinking

    Not really, and that has two drivers ;)

    MB