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Wow how slow is Windows 10 at updating? Also how to prevent it updating in future?

Discussion in 'Windows & Other Software' started by Hades, 22 May 2018.

  1. V F

    Capodecina

    Joined: 13 Aug 2003

    Posts: 18,194

    Location: UK

    More of a nuisance than a pain. The pain is install all the apps and configuring them back to your preferences/work flow. It's all those little things that takes time.

    @Rroff funny how so many used to insult XP back in its day for every 6 month reinstalls, which was out of choice.
     
  2. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 13 Oct 2006

    Posts: 76,140

    Yeah I hate reinstalling and setting up the environment again and having to remember all the little tweaks, etc. I've used - I try to document them but invariably my notes aren't quite upto date - for instance one thing I do with Windows 10 is adjust some registry settings to make better use of space around the title bar of windows.
     
  3. npinn001

    Gangster

    Joined: 9 May 2012

    Posts: 104

    Yeah I agree. I always remember I used to take forever setting everything up and imaging along the way to make sure that I had everything backed up. But even the process of restoring an image is fairly slow going. And then if its old you have to update everything. I just love Linux these days, and that its all ready to use out the box with just a little tinkering. Granted that you cant do as much as with Windows, but Its made my life easier. If Microsoft get their act together, I would go back.
     
  4. npinn001

    Gangster

    Joined: 9 May 2012

    Posts: 104

    Yes, it made me switch full time to Linux. I put my friends/relatives on to chromebooks due to the lack of maintenance required too. Its a shame, as OSX seems to have stagnated too and isnt really innovative.
     
  5. eddiew

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 26 Jan 2007

    Posts: 2,262

    Location: Leeds

    Came here looking for a way to prevent auto updates since discovering that somehow Windows had magically enabled them (again) and rebooted during the night. Lost a bunch of stuff on the desktop and my Manga Studio undo history AND the colour profile for my drawing screen, so now I get to spend this evening with a colorimeter instead of working on anything.

    Hell hath no fury, tbqfh. This behaviour is as destructive as bluescreens, and I hunt those out ruthlessly.

    I've set "No reboot with logged in user" and it still does. I've disabled wake timers and it still does. I've set 5pm and it still does it at 3am. Now the latest update has blocked my ability to delete/take ownership of the reboot scheduled task, and the Windows Update Medic service is some sort of frikking virus because it cannot be disabled by an administrator. What the actual eff?

    At this rate I'll end up hibernating my PC and powering off at the wall every time I'm going to walk away for more than 10 minutes... I don't feel like I can trust it not to commit to an update cycle the moment I go for a poo.

    (I have no problem with updates in general. I will happily assume responsibility for applying them every few weeks but by thunder it is not acceptable to reboot without choice or warning. I want the old 4-hour postphone option back. I want to be asked about updates, and have a choice of "not now" every time...)
     
  6. darael

    Mobster

    Joined: 10 Jul 2010

    Posts: 4,820

    Which? calls for compensation for users hit by Windows 10 woes
    https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/...for_customers_amidst_windows_10_upgrade_fail/

    https://www.which.co.uk/news/2018/06/windows-10-update-pain-microsoft-must-do-more-for-consumers/
     
  7. eddiew

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 26 Jan 2007

    Posts: 2,262

    Location: Leeds

    Good :>

    MS really need to split updates into two channels: security and features.

    Security, fine, make that mandatory, just make sure there is a group policy option that really, truly puts it under the user's control and will not reboot without an explicit agreement (not clicking due to being afk is not consent to restart now).

    Features, totally optional. I don't care about movie maker, I'm not interested in all new ways to share my content or that Cortana will be more responsive. The only time I talk to my PC is when it's broken. I want my OS to be a host for other programs, not a creativity suite.

    Also now that I read the article, I remember that the update changed my default sound device to be nvidia audio. Which I think is my HDMI output. Which doesn't have speakers on the far end. Fortunately I know about this little game, but I bet a lot of people taking it to the "repair" shop were caught out by that!
     
  8. Bry

    Wise Guy

    Joined: 24 Jul 2005

    Posts: 1,377

    I don' understand why people are complaining about slow windows updates.

    Generally windows updates on windows 10 are very fast, especially if you are regularly updating (most updates are now cumulative). I still say though those rubbish 32gb cheap laptops should never of been made, they are just slow.

    Most people don' seem to understand that the `updates` that take awhile are major system updates equivalent to service packupdates... these certainly took a long time to do on windows 7too.

    The only change is that Microsoft don' call them service packs now and more of then... we are what technicallyo n service pack 4 or 5 now? Windows 7 only had 2 in it' entire lifespan.
    People certainly complained that windows 7 did not have enough service packs.

    Couple that with things like wannacry and other major viruses, Microsoft needs to patch and update more and force them because otherwise people don't patch and then moan and complain when they get a virus, lose money, their pc goes slow ortheycant go to hospital.

    Is it perfect? No. But regular free major system updates for free is certainly welcome.
    If You have a business then you should certainly be using various Microsoft business tools to manage your updates.


    In this existing world of visuals, randsomeware botnets, etc forced updates are a necessary evil.
    New features are welcome
     
  9. jpaul

    Capodecina

    Joined: 1 Mar 2010

    Posts: 14,322

    windows 7 was, what sp1 & sp2 ?
    windows 10 1507, 1511, 1607, 1703, 1709, 1803.

    how bad is their code architecture that they have needed 6 service packs - is there an explanation of why they did this ? just for kicks ?
    if you use a pc working from home, so it's mission critical, a several day hit sorting out issues with each of these is unacceptable
     
  10. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 13 Oct 2006

    Posts: 76,140

    The complaint isn't so much that updates are slow specifically - it is the combination of they often take a long time combined with reduced user control over when they are applied. I don't think anyone is saying older Windows OSes were magically faster when it came to big updates but at least there you could choose to manage them when it was convenient.

    As pointed out though Windows 10 has had a lot of large updates over its lifetime already - more in a year than Windows 7 has had so far to date.

    A lot of these updates aren't even critical security updates and if MS really cared about that there is a huge amount they could do to improve end user security and convenience - the whole Wannacry thing would have been a lot less severe if companies had the SMB patches in place but because of the way MS is handling updates and the mess and impracticality of out of band updates due to the overall implementation a lot of places had deferred dealing with it as long as possible so 2 months later the patches were still only trickling out in the work place.
     
    Last edited: 13 Jun 2018
  11. ubersonic

    Capodecina

    Joined: 26 May 2009

    Posts: 21,110

    This is my main beef with Windows 10. I actually had to replace a high end X79 system because it got to the point where a major W10 update that was incompatible with the system had become a mandatory update due to it's age >.>
     
  12. Duke

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 29 Jun 2003

    Posts: 33,827

    Location: Wiltshire

    Microsoft moved away from the big gaps between major OS versions which was causing issues, especially with businesses, staying on legacy OS's (I'd hate to think how many are still on XP). They now have a predictable 6 month cycle of releasing feature updates instead. Each one is effectively a clean install of the OS as oppose to traditional service packs, most of which were just rolling up all previous updates.

    As you listed the feature update numbers then I guess you already knew most of this. Of course if they didn't update things, people would moan at that too. Although I've had no issues at home or work with Windows 10, clearly some do so they do need to improve their testing and rollouts of patches.
     
  13. Buffalo2102

    Hitman

    Joined: 9 Jun 2004

    Posts: 933

    That made me laugh - I almost missed it.
     
  14. jpaul

    Capodecina

    Joined: 1 Mar 2010

    Posts: 14,322

    interesting 2017 article https://www.windowscentral.com/are-two-windows-10-updates-year-really-better-one

    so it is all part of their dastardly plan
    [​IMG]
     
  15. AthlonXP1800

    Mobster

    Joined: 28 Sep 2014

    Posts: 2,896

    Location: Scotland

    Windows 8 and 8.1 actually has the same Windows Update as 10, both Windows 8 and 8.1 has both old and new Control Panel and also old and new Windows Update. Many people are not happy with Windows 8 and 8.1 designs and layouts so Microsoft had to redesigned it in Windows 10 based on feedbacks. I cannot find screenshots on internet so I had time to installed Windows 8.1 on VMware to take screenshots so there the screenshots of new Windows Update on Windows 8.1.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Found and installed 165 updates while I am slept in bed and found out it took about 3 hours to installed all 165 updates which are a lot faster than Windows 7. The only small thing missing in Windows 10 is View details that let you choose which updates to download and install. My biggest complaint about Windows 8 and 8.1 Windows Update is lacked of progress details, without it I was stared at screen wondered what updates it is installed at the moment and didnt know how long will it take to complete.
     
    Last edited: 15 Jun 2018
  16. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 13 Oct 2006

    Posts: 76,140

    You are missing the point - in 8 you have this dialogue:

    https://www.simonsezit.com/article/configuring-windows-update-in-windows-8/

    See the screen at the bottom with the options - the ability to block automatic driver updates also works and works properly and additionally with some very simple use of advanced configuration you can also granularly control the installation of security and feature updates so as to get security updates in a more timely fashion and feature updates deferred permanently to your convenience.

    You can not do any of this out the box with 10 - at best some versions allow you some degree of being able to defer updates but the functionality is not reliable for blocking all Windows update behaviour and likewise even 3rd party tools aren't a complete solution especially as they've "hard-coded" some routines in 1703 onwards that currently no 3rd party tool disables.

    Windows update in 8 will also completely obey any metered connection settings you configure - Windows 10 will not - for some people this is a big deal.

    So there is a lot of difference between 8 and 10 in terms of Windows update implementation.
     
  17. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 13 Oct 2006

    Posts: 76,140

    Some oddities in that article:

    Most of the feature updates have been big updates:

    I've seen several updates in the last 12 months that have been reasonably sizeable not just the two main feature updates.

    Regarding the fear of change thing - that doesn't seem to be working either - see a fair few people complaining of things changed around but more importantly I find that those less familiar with PCs and/or elderly find Windows 10 changes far too much per update - many of them have to write down the path to do things and reproduce the same actions each time with limited ability (mostly paralysed by fear of doing something wrong than anything) to try and figure it out for themselves. I've had a few requests to go back to 7 as it doesn't keep changing things around on them.

    A lot of the changes seem kind of unnecessary or experimental as well which is one thing to test with an insider program, etc. but shouldn't be using the full release for testing stuff like that out.
     
  18. AthlonXP1800

    Mobster

    Joined: 28 Sep 2014

    Posts: 2,896

    Location: Scotland

    No. When the issue happened back around 2010 when I had Windows 7 Ultimate installed on dad's laptop in 2009 used key from my TechNet subscription to upgraded from Vista. I never installed Nvidia drivers from Windows Update, I always installed drivers downloaded from Nvidia site. I remembered last time my eldest nephew watched streaming videos for around 2 hours on dad laptop then next day dad used laptop to checked emails and browsed internet then suddenly Windows 7 gone BSOD and restarted itself, passed Windows 7 logo screen but it never reached lockscreen and BSOD then dad told me about the issue. I tried many times to restarted Windows 7, tried startup repairs without successes but had gone into safe mode worked and investigated why it had BSOD and checked Windows Update all fine then I downloaded bluescreenview to read 2 crash logs and found nvidia driver was the cause of the issue. I uninstalled Nvidia driver and restarted then it finally reached lockscreen and I installed the latest nvidia driver, restarted and passed Windows 7 logo screen, never reached lockscreen, if I not pressed power button to shutdown and waited around 5 mins then screen gone BSOD. Checked bluescreenview on 3rd crash log and nvidia driver was the cause so I downloaded DDU to cleaned up removed all traces of nvidia drivers and installed older and first driver supported Geforce Go 7900 GS too did not helped with same BSOD everytime Windows 7 booted. Ran DDU again to removed Nvidia drivers then tried Windows Update to installed Nvidia driver and restarted with same BSOD, I removed nvidia driver from Windows Update with DDU and went to device manager to updated display driver to Windows Basic Display Driver then restarted went through logo screen and finally reached lockscreen without BSOD and it did not have nvidia driver installed. I also tried cleaned installed Windows 7 but same issue occurred with no updates installed, on next patch Tuesday I ran Windows Update and looked at list of updates also listed nvidia driver and I unticked the driver I don't wanted, Windows 7 automatically downloaded all updates and installed then restarted and BSOD, I went to safe mode and checked Windows Update history to found that Windows 7 forced installed driver no mattered how many times I unticked it so I found a way to stopped it installed driver by hide driver update.

    When Windows 8 came out, I was hopefully nvidia driver would magically worked without BSOD but sadly the same BSOD issue occurred with Windows 8, 8.1 and 10 too. Seemed something in GPU silicon are broke, yet amazed it still barely functioned with Basic Windows Display Driver but I cant played games with it without nvidia driver or booted Windows on broke GPU with nvidia driver. 4 years ago I been thought about replaced broke GPU with new spare but decided not to bothered it cos used spare are very expensive like £300 for Geforce Go 7900 GS but now the price gone down to less than £50 so someday I probably will have fun experience to disassemble my old laptop removed broke GPU with spare worked GPU to see Windows 10 finally boot properly with modded nvidia driver.
     
  19. Rroff

    Man of Honour

    Joined: 13 Oct 2006

    Posts: 76,140

    Odd never seen that happen personally - if I untick nVidia drivers I've not so far had it force installed in my experience. If the GPU works with Windows basic driver but BSODs with the nVidia driver that is 99% faulty hardware as the nVidia driver enables much more of the GPU hardware functionality which is unused with the basic driver.

    Slight caveat to that in that MS have fudged the dates on a lot of the "built in" drivers so that manufacturers drivers get installed properly which will sometimes result in a newer driver being force installed on boot up if it has been entered into the Windows driver catalogue which is a bit annoying - I think you can mess about with the driver package and disabling signed driver checks to fake it into thinking the basic driver is newer than the nVidia ones.
     
  20. jpaul

    Capodecina

    Joined: 1 Mar 2010

    Posts: 14,322

    personally never/not having any problems with forced win7 gpu driver installs.
    Did you find substantiation on the internet - like the multitude of win 10 update complaints

    can you put all those bitmaps in spoilers - you just chewed up a page